Originally posted by Vinitasse
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Chinese Giotto ! ..Scam ?
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Agree with Vintasse. Paypal protects the buyer significantly. They have the right to pull payments out of the seller for sales that are several years old on a complaint from a buyer. They will then investigate and when they are satisfied that the claim was legit they will reimburse the buyer. I was on the other end of such a claim just a month ago (as the seller) for a legitimate sale that went through auction bay dating back to 2011!! When I saw that my paypal account was in the negative I called paypal and they explained the buyer claimed it was a bogus transaction. Ofcourse that was not true. The item was delivered and buyer at the time was more than happy (as per my feedback on the bay for that transaction). I then proceeded to search for the buyer through the myriads of emails I had and found the right person and sent him an email questioning him. I got a response that it was a mistake and he withdrew the claim and a couple of days later I got my money back. Paypal really IS good for buyers but leaves sellers very much exposed to nasty buyers.
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Which is why eBay has "Don't do this, gaiz, srsly, we mean it" splattered over every other page :POriginally posted by Barry O'Speedwagon View PostSimilar scammers have been known to contact the buyer and offer a substantial discount if one pays through Western Union.....then goodbye $$$.
Come again? PayPal is weighted so heavily in favour of the buyer it's not even funny. Have you ever had to deal with PayPal dispute resolution from either side? As a buyer, making a claim is easy; worst case is that you have to take a few photos and wait a few weeks. As a seller, if you don't cover your ass completely you're able to be screwed hard by a buyer who says that you didn't send the item or must've addressed it incorrectly etc etc.Originally posted by blend52 View PostPaypal is THE reason they can do this.
If you could pay with credit card, it would be a "No Risk" situation.
Paypal, gives the scammers the facility to hide behind the PP terms.
Smart buyers wont touch these deals, its only those gullible enough to think its a bargain that get caught out, and they are not always best equipped to chase through PPal's (unhelpful) procedures to even hope for a refund.
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As to your first assertion... are you really so obtuse???? It is a given that scammers do indeed have access to credit card facilities and that would help to explain why billions are scammed via credit card fraud each and every year.Originally posted by blend52 View PostYes.
Scammers do not have credit card facilities.
..Im surprised you dont see this as an obvious scam...its one of the classic one used for years on different items.
Secondly... whatcha talking about Willis? I clearly stated the following: "In any event... if the whole deal seems too good to be true... it probably is"
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There was something similar to this with GoPro Hero 3s a couple of months ago. Paypal isn't as wonderful as you think it is, and the hoops you have to jump through to prove it's a scam when something is actually sent to you are onerous. About 1/2 the people that I heard of going for the GoPro deal got their money back. Anyone who's seen a scam before should have their spider senses tingling on this one straight away.
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Actually, think I might have to backpedal a little bit on two points:
- Looks like in cases where tracking is provided, you may be required to pay return shipping before getting a refund (and not necessarily be reimbursed for that).
- If you start a certain number of dispute claims within an 18 months period, your account gets disabled.
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If they have in their ad that you have to return the goods at your expense to get a refund, PayPal won't do anything unless/until you show them the post office receipt to prove that you have returned it. I once got bitten (just for a USB stick, nothing like this) and PayPal wouldn't do anything for meOriginally posted by Dragunov21 View PostSeriously though... PayPal has buyer protection on purchases through eBay for just this kinda crap... I'm confused as to how they expect to get paid.
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Its a pity to see that this is not only on Ebay but on many other online sites for example gumtree, carsales and many other ones. Many of these arnt just single people its gangs which have found a market for scamming gullible people. While i write gullible i must say i feel a little guilty saying this as i feel that this has been going on for a long time yet these people we call gullible are more uneducated with this new age online buying. Many people are still questionable of buying online and things like what we are talking about here don't help the situation. Doing what the OP did has helped to alert this for other not to buy and have it taken off.
I agree totally with what Chris has said that the more people who test the legitimacy of Paypal's buyer protection is also going towards costing everyone else later down the track in fees. Think about it this way we all complain with the price we pay for car insurance but because people are willing to steel cars, write them off deliberately and be careless while driving knowing that the insurance will cover them, i feel they fail to think about the cost to others and themselves later on by paying higher premiums.
Chris
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Like hell. I'm as big a consumerist whore as the next man but there are things you have to accept.Originally posted by yabbaPlease. Start competing in the real world. Offer things at a competitive rate and be grateful for what you get.
Obviously not aimed at anyone here, just from my daily experience..
- Brick and mortar local stores cannot compete with online warehouse stores on price. It is literally impossible as they have significant overheads that online warehouses do not have as well as smaller markets.
- Brick and mortar stores offer a valuable (sometimes) service, which is being able to hold an item in our hand and give it a once-over before purchase (seriously important for anything that needs to "fit"). It's important to be aware that importing from international warehouses can have an effect on the availability/range of locally-sold products (as an aside, to anyone who goes into a store to test stuff then goes and buys it online, you're a thief as far as I'm concerned).
- No-one got a good deal on a 2.5k "italian made" machine mysteriously sold out of China for under 100 bucks. At *best* they're getting an empty box.
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I have learned that you can put a complaint in to PayPay, in case the goods don't arrive, before the deadline and withdraw it if necessary.Originally posted by blend52 View Post
You obviously have a better experience of paypal than me..
Try getting that refund once you have received ( and signed for) a slow delivery package that is now more than likely outside the PPal 30 day period .
Yes, PayPal does insist that you send the parcel back registeredOriginally posted by blend52 View PostAs a first step, PPal and the seller will insist you return the "package" at your cost ( you will have to register and insure it to secure a claim)
The seller ( in China) will most likely deny receiving the package, which will require you to then prove its been returned etc
Some people wont be prepared to invest more money, or know how to process, that kind of mess and simply give up.
All i am doing is trying to alert potential buyers to steer clear of these scam deals !
..Im surprised you dont see this as an obvious scam...its one of the classic one used for years on different items.
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This is the reason that I will never send anything overseas via sea mail again.I have learned that you can put a complaint in to PayPay, in case the goods don't arrive, before the deadline and withdraw it if necessary.
Last year I had someone purchase a Behmor roaster in Brazil who insisted on using sea mail to save money even though I told them that it would take 3 months (at least) and I typically only send via Express Post International (10 days to with tracking to just about anywhere on the globe).
40 days after purchase they complained to PayPal and when I asked why he said "because I only have 45 days to complain, I know you have sent it but if it doesnt turn up I can claim it".
He claimed, got refunded (even though I could prove I sent it) and the roaster arrived 3 months after purchase.
There are scammers everywhere... but luckily for the human race most people are good people.
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