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Rotary ECM Technika IV or Rocket R58?

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  • Rotary ECM Technika IV or Rocket R58?

    Hi All,
    I'm looking at upgrading my rancilio sylvia & rocky with either of the above.
    Whilst I understand they're 2 different machines (ECM is HEX, R58 is DB), I am limited by space…..(i.e. Alex Izzo Duetto too large) & I don't like the look of the Rocket HEX equivalent (Evoluzione).
    I make approx 3 milk-based coffees per weekday & 4 milk-based coffees per weekend day……
    I live in Adelaide - whilst we have dealers who can sell either machine, the after-sales repair services available to me are actually quite limited. In fact, I'm not aware of any Adelaide dealer who can repair a Rocket machine - I think they get shipped to Melbourne or Sydney (ie. a horrible 2-3 week wait).
    Thankfully I do have an ECM dealer who can actually assess & repair ECM machines on site…….this seems like a big plus.
    I have read about the R58 dual boiler being a bit unreliable - but perhaps they've ironed these problems out by now??
    I don't tend to play around with different beans or temp-surf etc……

    Pros of the ECM Technika:
    1. Repair centre nearby in Adelaide
    2. Spartan German looks
    3. Larger drip tray
    4. Less complicated (? more reliable) system
    5. Runs on a time-honoured system
    6. Cheaper (by approx $700)

    Pros of the Rocket R58:
    1. Looks pretty awesome
    2. Slightly smaller footprint (4.5 cm less wide, 1cm deeper)
    3. PID with temp control of both boilers
    4. Knobs (not levers) for steam & hot water - not sure if this is an advantage or not???

    I'm wondering what your opinions are on my thoughts above…….I will also upgrade my rocky grinder……..am looking at possibly the Macap M4D….
    Thanks for your advice!
    Andrew.

  • #2
    Hi labs, and welcome to CS.


    Whichever machine you end up with...... make sure it doesn't come with a HEX; it could prove to be unreliable,

    especially on full moon nights. ;-)

    Machine choice is really up to you, there will be no difference in the cup between the PID or the HX.

    The features that drive your decision will relate to your personal preference. Have you had any

    'hands on' with the machines?

    If you are considering the Macap M4D you are on the right track, it is my recommendation for a top shelf home grinder.

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by chokkidog View Post
      Hi labs, and welcome to CS.


      Whichever machine you end up with...... make sure it doesn't come with a HEX; it could prove to be unreliable,

      especially on full moon nights. ;-)

      Machine choice is really up to you, there will be no difference in the cup between the PID or the HX.

      The features that drive your decision will relate to your personal preference. Have you had any

      'hands on' with the machines?

      If you are considering the Macap M4D you are on the right track, it is my recommendation for a top shelf home grinder.
      Thanks chokkidog,
      I've played with the ecm & it seemed ok - I think with time I'd get used to the portafilter insertion & levers with time. None of the stores in adelaide seem to have the R58 available to play with. Most of the stores think it's unnecessary to have the double boiler......I'd rather buy the machine from someone local so that it can get fixed locally. I really don't want to be shipping a 30kg coffee machine to get fixed! So I suppose I'm leaning towards the ECM.....

      Comment


      • #4
        You'll get used to the steam/hot water levers pretty quickly; I used them on my first machine and prefer them over taps.

        I don't agree with the point of view that the retailers in Adelaide have, if only that it denies consumers the choice....

        and don't they know that Adelaide is the newly crowned 'coffee capital' of Australia?. ;-D

        But I guess you're stuck with it. ( their attitude)

        Even though after sales service is an important consideration when purchasing a machine it is highly unlikely

        that a problem will develop with such a well built machine within the warranty time.

        Having a good local service technician who can take care of the machine in the long term is far more valuable.

        Good luck with your purchase and don't forget to post some pics of your new setup!
        Last edited by chokkidog; 7 October 2014, 11:38 AM.

        Comment


        • #5
          Welcome lavs,

          No problem with an r58 in Adelaide so long as you give it good water. We have quite a few there and have reciprocal service and warranty facilities in place as well.

          The right machine is the one you like- not the one someone else tells you to buy! Weigh up the pros and cons and then you will have your answer.

          Cheers

          Chris

          Comment


          • #6
            I was hoping Chris would see your post...... he ships machines all over the country to very

            happy clients.

            I can also vouch for his exemplary customer service, ........recommended

            Comment


            • #7
              Hi lavs,

              Have you had a look at the Profitec Pro 700? It seems to tick off most of your requirements. Last time I checked, Complete Cafe Services had a demo available. They also handle service locally,

              charlie

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by JetBlack_Espresso View Post
                Hi lavs,

                Have you had a look at the Profitec Pro 700? It seems to tick off most of your requirements. Last time I checked, Complete Cafe Services had a demo available. They also handle service locally,

                charlie
                Woah. A shot clock! What a great idea! I will look into this……..thankyou!

                Comment


                • #9
                  You might also like to consider the Alex Duetto as a potential addition to your short list lavs

                  Cheers

                  Chris

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    You must have missed this comment Chris....
                    Originally posted by lavs View Post
                    , I am limited by space…..(i.e. Alex Izzo Duetto too large)
                    .

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      erm yep- there's actually not much in it, but too big = too big

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        I think this is my first post so, Hi, I'm Dan

                        My wife and I are contemplating the r58 as our current machine is playing up, its currently in for repair so we are driven to buying coffee. thankfully the a local cafe is meeting our needs but a $100-150 repair is costing another $100+ in outsourced coffee! Add to that our machine (EM6910) cannot produce what the local cafe/r58 can and ...well we are contemplating the r58. But i ask what else is there? My wife has plenty of coffee/barista experience and after reading up she'd like a DB machine. A family member has the Alex Duetto and we've played with it and while we love its performance the height between portafilter spout & drip tray is prohibitively small. I've noted the Profitec Pro 700 and i'll look into it some more.

                        Also are there any manufacturers the make more....theatrical/appealing machines... something like the Kees Van der Wester Speedster (with about 1/3rd the price tag). It doesn't have to be as out there as the Speedster, just not a 304SS brick. (I do like the look of the r58, but i don't think it goes far enough)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hi Dan and welcome to CS.

                          No Speedster lookalikes I'm afraid.... that machine is in a class of it's own.

                          Group head height is generally something that can be worked around, using a naked for instance...

                          If you're looking for something outside of the box, with visual appeal... what about the Alex Lever?

                          Have you seen the new Isomac Mondiale? It's had a recent reworking/upgrade and is no brick, worth a look even if just from

                          a design point of view.

                          Where are you located? Can you get to a sponsor/machine reseller who has multiple machines up on the bench for some hands on & eye action?

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            ECM produces the Controvento. It's a double boiler but with a different design (some will love and some will hate)... it's also pricey. My understanding (although more than happy to be corrected) is that it basically has the same base components as the Profitec 700.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Getting hands on is the smart next move, I'm in Melbourne so hopefully we can drop by Coffee-a-Roma and see a few units and play around.

                              Comment

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