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  • #31
    Originally posted by Jonathon View Post
    It's also worthwhile remembering that La Marzocco are an American-based company, not an Italian one (albeit most of their machines are still made there), so the US is their home market.
    ??
    Their Corporate head office is in Florence,
    Manufacturing facilities are based in Florence,
    Sales and Marketing in Milan.
    they do have regional offices in several international locations.
    LaMarzocco USA is a subsidiary of laMarzocco International.

    from ..http://www.lamarzocco.com/en/headlin...561705ba9.html
    Europe is the primary target market for professional espresso machines, accounting for 54 per cent of the total annual production capacity for conventional Espresso machines (all manufacturers) which is 185,000
    So, yes LM are only a small player, but the Eu market is at least 100,000 per year !
    ....bigger than the rest of the world combined !
    Last edited by blend52; 28 March 2015, 03:34 PM.

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    • #32
      Originally posted by MorganGT View Post
      ?........so I'd suspect the total number of new Marzoccos installed per week in Australia would be well over 1000 units.....
      well , I guess you meant 100 per week, not 1000...... But even so, you are still suggesting Australia is installing 5000+ per year ......or 80% of all LM's being manufactured ??
      ?.Hard to believe..

      This would tend to suggest more like 1200 per year......
      .....The Australian market is the second largest for La Marzocco after the US, with 18 per cent of our total global sales here. It’s a fantastic market with very high-quality Italian-based espresso coffee beverages,” says La Marzocco’s CEO Kent Bakke.
      Last edited by blend52; 28 March 2015, 04:04 PM.

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      • #33
        Originally posted by blend52 View Post
        ??
        Their Corporate head office is in Florence,
        Manufacturing facilities are based in Florence,
        Sales and Marketing in Milan.
        they do have regional offices in several international locations.
        LaMarzocco USA is a subsidiary of laMarzocco International.
        Unless I've got my research wrong (entirely possible), LM International LLC is the ultimate holding company of the LM empire. LM International LLC is based in Seattle and run by Kent Bakke, who owns 90% of the company along with some of his associates. The original Bambi family only have a 10% stake in the Italian company.

        Kent bought the Italian LM company as part of the Starbucks deal in 1994 - without his equity they couldn't have funded the manufacture of all those lineas.

        So La Marzocco is essentially owned and run by an American, based in Seattle - they're just very good at marketing themselves as a purely Italian company. (Not that there's anything wrong with that, it's clearly working for them)

        Also, LM make roughly 4,000 machines a year, with 18% coming here to Australia their second biggest market, so about 700 machines a year. Most of their output goes to the US, which would suggest they sell perhaps less than 500 machines a year in Italy, hence previous comments that they're largely unheard of in Italy.

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        • #34
          https://lamarzoccousa.files.wordpres...lm-history.pdf

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          • #35
            Thanks Chokki, I wasn't completely sure on the 90% ownership number, so good to see that confirmed on what looks like a LM document.

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            • #36
              I went to the LM factory last year and all the above is true. They had to get capital from somewhere as they brothers were pretty broke after the war...

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              • #37
                Originally posted by blend52 View Post
                well , I guess you meant 100 per week, not 1000...... But even so, you are still suggesting Australia is installing 5000+ per year ......or 80% of all LM's being manufactured ??
                ?.Hard to believe..

                This would tend to suggest more like 1200 per year......
                Yes, I meant 100, not 1000. Revising things on the basis of better information from this thread - 4000 total production per year, 18% of that coming here, or about 700. That works out to about 13 and a half machines installed per week across Australia, so at the current rate we are going, it looks like we are putting out close to a quarter of all new Marzoccos in Australia - no wonder they've just appointed us as a distributor!

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                • #38
                  Just to be clear, it doesn't say that Kent Bakke owns 90%. The document says "Kent and partners (Emphasis mine.) acquire 90% of La Marzocco Srl (Italy). Form La Marzocco International (LMI) as parent company."

                  From the Wiki entry for La Marzocco: "1994, La Marzocco International, LLC., a formal partnership between the Bambi family and a team of American coffee enthusiasts and Italian partners, lead by Kent Bakke, is established."

                  There was an article in a 2013 issue of Bean Scene that may contain further info on the subject if someone has a copy of it handy.


                  Java "Seattle soon!" phile
                  Toys! I must have new toys!!!

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                  • #39
                    Well this went off topic quickly. [emoji57]

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                    • #40
                      You guys crack me up. "I know more about La Marzocco." " No! I know more about La Marzocco!" " My speculative calculations are better than yours." "I says so on Wikipedia, I must be right." :-)

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                      • #41
                        Interesting read while my machine warms up. Funny.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by muzz88 View Post
                          Well this went off topic quickly. [emoji57]
                          yep !...and all from the question why LM would ignor the European 240volt market for the Mini.!
                          ..but as it now appears they will be shipping 230/240 volt versions in May, it's a mute point .

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                          • #43
                            I don't know about points being silent... but that might be a moot point ;-)

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                            • #44
                              I think I'm going to rename this one machinebo: Might look good to some, but when you look inside, you find pretty much nothing of substance.

                              With a multitude of $3k+ competitors which offer far superior spec, I really can't see how this could possibly be attractive as a potential purchase unless brand is the only factor.

                              In my opinion, this one underdelivers dramatically (on spec.) and I can't find a single reason at to why I'd range it.

                              I just can't understand what LM must have been thinking. I see a $3k machine with a >$5k price tag.
                              Last edited by TC; 5 April 2015, 11:26 AM. Reason: tpyo

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
                                I think I'm going to rename this one machinebo: Might look good to some, but when you look inside, you find pretty much nothing of substance.

                                With a multitude of $3k+ competitors which offer far superior spec, I really can't see how this could possibly be attractive as a potential purchase unless brand is the only factor.

                                In my opinion, this one underdelivers dramatically (on spec.) and I can't find a single reason at to why I'd range it.
                                I can see a market for it.

                                Yes, some buyers are "spec chasers" putting specs of machines into spreadsheets before making a purchase decision. Others have gone down the highly digital tinkerer's route with machines like the Vesuvius.

                                This LM machine is taking a very different tack, basically the polar opposite of the Vesuvius approach and and it's not a bad idea. There's room for both. I ran an Elektra Semiauto for many years, and this machine would almost certainly fail any assessment based on "specs". But we know there's more to it than numbers, and the Elektra is a wonderful machine to use and the results in the cup speak for themselves. (The most important spec of all?)

                                Similarly, my impression is that LM isn't going after the spec nerds with this machine. They have very deliberately made it a simple design and have instead gone for fit, finish and build quality. And simple operation with high consistency and no digital interfaces. In other words, a high quality "back to basics" machine, where you manage your shots by more traditional eyeball and feel.

                                The small brew boiler is a deliberate design - apparently can get to brew temps very quickly, and as it is fed through an HX it's very temp stable.

                                I can't see myself flogging off the Profitec to get one, but if I was in the market, I'd certainly take a look.
                                Last edited by herzog; 6 April 2015, 03:21 PM.

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