Decent Espresso Machines (DE1) - Any thoughts?

[338]

Avian, just reading that John already pays the duty and I assume the GST. Technically no duty should be paid on a Decent (under the TCO) just the GST, so assume you will actually get something like a $200 refund! (Duty is 5%) Worth putting the paperwork in and great news you wont be out of pocket, though morally I would suggest John overpaid so he should get the excess. Let us know how you go.

[avian]

Thank 338, I've added that to the information I've provided customs. Great stuff. Also it seems the tamper thing was my error when ordering, and John was on it right away with a solution, a complete champion.

Edit: Just saw your newer post. I'm not sure, cause there is the hardware and software component, and it seems I've paid tax/duty on the hardware side of things. I've provided them with as much information as I can and been as transparent a I can, so we'll see what customs come up with.

[338]

Unfortunately the TCO won't apply to the software component though I have no idea if there is duty on software. There is definitely GST which I am guessing John already pays as it would be caught either under the Netflix tax ( digital services ) brought in a couple of years ago or under the legislation for companies selling over $70k (or maybe $75k) into Australia (assume Decent sell at least 20 machines here). You may still see a refund if all GST is paid. As you said it is in their hands and sure it will work out easily.

[avian]

Customs ended up being an interesting process. After speaking to someone in the brokerage team, it seems as though customs were going to charge gst (I presume on the software portion), but UPS asked for a re-evaluation and it was then passed through without any additional tax/duty.

So far the machine is great. I've been experimenting using some throw away beans today while I get the hang of things, and its interesting how the profiles can effect flavour. After trying to dial things to taste, I ended up running at a faster flow rate than I think is to be expected (close to 3ml/s), but I think thatll change once I switch to some preferred beans tomorrow.

The steaming has impressed me a lot. First time using it I was able to produce a texture that could pour great art, and weirdly I wasnt even trying to, was just testing that it functioned okay. Anyway sorry for derailing the thread for a bit there, I'll be quiet now while I try to get my head around eveything this machine can do

[>decentespresso]

At the HOST Milan trade show, we met the fine Australians behind this countersunk steam/pitcher rinser/hot water dispenser: https://www.steam.international
Looks quite useful for our Decent Coffee Cart project.

While our espresso machines make "not so bad" coffee, we're not optimized for steaming lots of milk. This steam unit could be quite useful for coffee carts that need to make gobs of lattes.

-john

[Sullo]

John, i did read thru 41 pages of this thread as much id love your machine, whats peaked my attn is your cart an the pump for the jug rinser as to how it works? Ie how does it know to turn on? Is the rinser same as regular ones connected to a mains supply? An really like the idea of your ikea cart setup!
Pm me or post here just really interested in all of it!!
Thanks

[>decentespresso]

John, i did read thru 41 pages of this thread as much id love your machine, whats peaked my attn is your cart an the pump for the jug rinser as to how it works? Ie how does it know to turn on? Is the rinser same as regular ones connected to a mains supply? An really like the idea of your ikea cart setup!
Pm me or post here just really interested in all of it!!
Thanks

I hook up the pitcher rinser to a flowjet, which keeps the water pressure on at all times.

The pump automatically activates when the pitcher rinser is used. You coud likely skip the flowjet if you had access to a pressurized mains water line. I sell the parts to hook this together at https://decentespresso.com/de1xl

I have a video showing the underside of my coffee cart, where you can see how this is wired up.

[>decentespresso]

Smart Espresso Profiler, running on Decent Espresso Machines



Miklos at Smart Espresso Profiler “pitched me” on their porting the Android/iOS app to work natively with the upcoming v1.3 Decent Espresso Machine. It’s a cool idea, and we’re going to make it happen.

Here is his concept: instead of running the tablet app I wrote (to control the Decent), you’d run their app (I’d pre-load it on our tablet) and that would turn the Decent into a fully manual “lever machine”.

You’d use the circular controller on our upcoming v1.3 espresso machines to manually control flow through the entire espresso shot, and follow the curves on the SEP software display.

This would allow you to totally emulate traditional lever machines profiles that SEP has in its software. It also sounds like fun, and a much more hands-on experience than our normal “the machine does it all” approach on the DE1.

Thanks Miklos for suggesting this cool idea!

This will incidentally be a great example of the benefit of a “software controlled espresso machine”, i.e. a totally different concept for machine control, written by someone else who has a very different vision from mine. Choice is good!

And… this will be offered for free, to all our customers.

Here is a video showing how the SEP software works with Paul Pratt's awesome robot lever machine:
https://vimeo.com/343843768

-john

[Javaphile]

No video link shows John.


Java "Bad link format" phile

[>decentespresso]

No video link shows John. Java "Bad link format" phile

Fixed (I think!)

[Javaphile]

Yup!


Java "" phile

[>decentespresso]

Post-trade show wrap-up



Arrived home last night with 3 espresso machines, after making 2000 lattes in 3 days at HOST Milano in Italy.

The photo above is what happens when you make that much coffee with no cleanup facilities. Everything stinks of souring burnt milk. Yum.

I just ordered a 2 liter "milk cleaner" detergent bottle from Amazon. It can't come soon enough. I'm running "decalcificazione" (the tablet is still running in Italian) and cleaning cycles through my 3 machines. There's an "easter egg" on the tablet when you clean, that some of you might have not seen before.


Some things I learned at the show:

- baristas new to our machine, who are pressed for time, will tend to leave the steam wand in a full milk jug. This moves milk up the steam wand, and slightly clogs the wand, and cooks the milk on the next steaming.

- there's "a process" we programmed for steaming this much milk. Use the steam timer and steam "hands-free". Because, at the end of the time, the steam turns off, but then continues making gently "puffs" of steam every few seconds, to (a) keep milk from going up and (b) keep the foam slightly circulating and thus of higher quality.

- Once the baristas learned the "decent process" for steaming milk, we were able to crank out many more lattes per hour, and only needed one barista, instead of two, to keep up with orders. Two machines were basically steaming constantly, while the 3rd machine pulled long Blooming Espresso shots (15g in / 50g out)

- The wheels on our IKEA BROR cart of made of fairly soft plastic. I didn't notice that one wheel "locked" during transport. After 20 seconds of pushing it along the pavement, I'd sanded 5mm off one wheel, so it no longer rolled smoothly.

- I designed the PRO steam wand for use when the DE1XL is countersunk. If it's not countersunk, the steam wand is too high up to do "hands-free" steaming.

- This prototype v1.3 machine locked its portafilter sooner than the other machines (that's since been fixed in later prototypes). When a barista switched from his machine to mine, he didn't squeeze hard enough to lock the portafilter in. The portafilter popped out during espresso making, and splashed me with burning water. Thankfully, the burn was not too bad, but this really does bring home the lesson that we need to get all the details right, as we're working with pressurized boiling water here.

-john

[>decentespresso]

Manument is really decent



At the Berlin Coffee Show in July, Manument was the darling of the show, and you couldn't get anywhere near them.

So, it was with great anticipation that Bugs and I were able to meet Francesca, the CEO
https://manument.com/en/ as well as her designer and barista.

My focus was not on the beauty of the machine (which is obvious) but on "can it make good espresso?"

I was pleased to see a few coffee-quality related things that were well thought out:

• a small handle controlling a needle valve, to control water flow rate in real time
• the handle moves up at a speed proportional to the flow rate, giving you a rough flow meter
• a front-panel control knob for the water temperature

While the Manument is heavy and tall, it's very narrow, so there are lots of cases where it'd fit nicely.

It's not yet in production, and with Francesca (who we got along famously with) we swapped notes on manufacturing. They've had some thoughts (not followed up on) about using a ceramic drip tray instead of plastic. I offered to put Francesca in touch with our porcelain manufacturer, as I think it'll work well for the drip tray design they've got there.

They had a very nice welded wire drip tray cover, and gave me a few war stories about how hard it'd been to find someone who made that part nicely. They're passing their contact for that part over to me, which is kind of them.

Francesca stressed that she wants to go slowly with their manufacturing and growth, despite lots of demand to "ship now!!!", as she wants time to incorporate barista feedback into the design, to make a truly decent product. I applaud her.

-john

[>decentespresso]

Big Five Rum Coffee Ice Cream



After the HOST Milano trade show, I was given 8 liters of heavy whipping cream, that went unused in the stand's "granita" machine. As this cream has an expiry date of tomorrow (November 1) I'm making LOTS of ice cream.

I was also gifted by Cafezal https://cafezal.it/ some beautiful single origin Ethiopian beans Ethiopia - The Big Five roasted in Kenya by Big Five About us - The Big Five Coffee

My recipe:

• 500ml 30% heavy cream
• 3 shots of espresso, using Rao's Blooming Espresso profile (15g in, 45g out)m about 150ml total. You want length and balanced acidity in your shots, to make this an interesting ice cream.
• 200ml of milk
• Sugar to taste
• Vanilla essence to taste

Blend and freeze in an ice cream machine.

For extra credit:

• instead of vanilla essence, use an oaked rum with strong vanilla flavor notes
• the alcohol in the rum lowers the melting point. This makes for a more pleasant creamier texture when serving ice cream directly from my home freezer. My chest freezer sits at -28ºC, so I usually have to put ice cream in my refrigerator 30 minutes before serving, to soften it up.
• I don't think you can buy ice cream commercially with this much alcohol, as it'd require a liquor license. That makes it something particularly special to make at home.

[Dimal]

Mmmm...

Memories of home made Rum and Raison ice-cream comes to mind.
Sounds great John...

Mal.