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2nd Hand Boema 2 group purchase advice

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  • 2nd Hand Boema 2 group purchase advice

    Hi Folks,

    Before I go ahead and stitch myself up

    I'm about to hop in the car and go check this out.

    Boema 2 group,
    unsure if 10 or 15 amp model. looks like an A1 / A2?

    Given the size I will assume 15.

    Seller has advised the 2nd group is blocked and no water flows - I am assuming a solenoid or something has gone bung in this.
    pics show it comes with group handles

    it also comes with the trolley and all other things inside of it e.g cups and what what looked like an external water pump.

    Price, Good enough to take a chance.

    Things I should look over for?
    Note I will only have about 10-15mins to check it over nor make a drink.

    Mainly the obvious things to check over.

    I'm expecting i'll be needing to drop at least another $200-300ish for a proper pull down and service

    this will be more of an ongoing project, not something that needs to be put into commercial production.

    Cheers.

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  • #2
    Right group touch pads seem to be stuck on with tape? Maybe to prevent use because it is "blocked". A speck of breakaway limescale in the mushroom will block but very easy to fix if that is indeed why it's not working.

    If it is a problem with the control box that could be expensive.
    Swap the ribbon cables left for right and see what happens to check.

    The pars seem to be generic Rancilio/Grimac and available if need replacing.

    I would at the very least want to hear and see the pump running even if the water is cold.

    In the few minutes you have you should at least hear the element start to heat. In 10 minutes the pressure gauge should be moving especially if it is a 10 amp.

    These machines are very hardy and if not missused you might get away with a couple of group seals. Maybe a solenoid if that is why one group isn't working. Maybe a heating element if that's not working....

    Comment


    • #3
      Okay small update.

      I dropped some dollars down on it.

      Pick up Sunday.

      Overall cleanish
      10mins with some stainless steel cleaner will bring it right up.

      I found it is a 15 amp unit with a 10 amp plug.

      Fellow said it takes about 40mins to heat up so I'm assuming one of the heating elements has been disabled.

      Unit + 3 group handles (2 double and single) the cart and external pump for $150.

      I didn't take the lid off, but looking underneath the stainless boiler was clean and copper pipes were still somewhat shiny.

      He said the 2nd one had been disconnected but a bit of does come through it.

      I powered it on and water flowed through the first head finez so I shook hands and said i'll take it.

      100% needs new group seals and maybe a shower head as it looks pretty crusty.

      Overall it's a gamble. I'll give boema a call next week to suss out some more information about it.

      I'll guess 10-15 years old?
      Maybe?

      Gumtree link removed as per Site Posting Policy
      Last edited by Javaphile; 11 October 2019, 09:37 PM. Reason: Gumtree link removed

      Comment


      • #4
        And the other photos I took.
        Attached Files

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by robusto View Post
          Right group touch pads seem to be stuck on with tape? Maybe to prevent use because it is "blocked". A speck of breakaway limescale in the mushroom will block but very easy to fix if that is indeed why it's not working.
          Unsure.
          Now that I have brought the machine home it has given me a bit more of a chance to look over it.

          The 2nd group is missing the shower screen.
          It's pretty filthy inside of it up inside the actual group head.
          caked on black goop, so I'm confident to say it's probably never had a blackflush in its life.
          even any sort of cleaning really.

          When I flick the orange switch to manually run the pump manually on the 2nd group,

          The solenoid clicks, the pump fires up but nothing comes through.

          Where is the, I have just looked at some pictures of the E61 based head and that is something I will check out.
          I will start with removing the top bolt and dropping a bit of descaling solution down it and see if that loosens things up a tad.

          Originally posted by robusto View Post
          If it is a problem with the control box that could be expensive.
          Swap the ribbon cables left for right and see what happens to check.
          It won't be this, pressing the buttons on the panel up front makes the machine start making noises and the pump cycles itself.

          Originally posted by robusto View Post
          The pars seem to be generic Rancilio/Grimac and available if need replacing.
          Perfect.
          That will make shopping around for things easier.

          Originally posted by robusto View Post
          I would at the very least want to hear and see the pump running even if the water is cold.
          They have pulled the internal pump out of the unit and have it sitting in the trolley.

          A water container sits above it and uses a form of gravity to put pressure within the pump itself.
          When you cycle the pump, the pressure needle shakes all around the place wildly.

          I'm confident to say the pump is NOT designed to do that.
          I'll either get myself a new 20l water drum to put some decent positive pressure and find a non return valve
          or find a flowjet / rotary pump?

          Originally posted by robusto View Post
          In the few minutes you have you should at least hear the element start to heat. In 10 minutes the pressure gauge should be moving especially if it is a 10 amp.
          I only had the machine on for a few minutes when i checked it out.
          Loaded onto the trailer yesterday and took it home.
          it took about 20-30mins? to head up, Average around 2200~ Watts for it to heat up.
          it maintained pressure quite well, steam pressure was stupidly powerful, coming from a BES820 to this.. haha :lol: VERY different..
          over a minute to steam 250mls of milk to all of about 15 seconds. it really gets away from you quickly, so I can forsee myself wasting alot of milk practicing with this.

          Originally posted by robusto View Post
          These machines are very hardy and if not missused you might get away with a couple of group seals. Maybe a solenoid if that is why one group isn't working. Maybe a heating element if that's not working....
          Thanks,

          I've just gotten off the phone with Boema and spoke with someone where.. Geoff? Grant? G.. something anyway.
          Spoke about the price I bought it for, and was given his word that even with a blocked up 2nd group,
          the fact that the machine builds and maintains pressure is good enough to persure getting it fixed up / back to proper spec again due to the sturdyness of the machines and that when given a good service would provide me with quite a few more years life of tasty coffee use.

          Going from the serial number, Estimated age to be around 10-15 years old.

          I was offered a dual group head service kit which provided all new seals etc, but I declined this and for the time being, whilst being a massive learning experience and would be a great oppourtunity to learn. I'm in the minds I would much rather have a "pro" go over the machine to adjust / fix / calibrate it and bring it back to working life.

          2x group kits are about $90ish each going by the interwebs,
          full clean and descale of the boiler / other things
          A clean up internally inside - I may attack this one with an citric based cleaner to remove as much gunk as possible,
          spray on, let it dwell and wipe off.

          There is some corrosion in some sections ontop of the group head and also at the bottom of the boiler, but I was unable to locate any other leaks when I left it turned on.


          Also.. What is the middle switch for on the power switches? it has a stam / cloud looking picture on it?

          Any reccomendations for service agents on the Central Coast area? (I know about coffeeparts in Newcastle too) I would put it on a pallet and take directly into the workshop

          Pictures to come soon so you can gauge a better idea.

          Cheers all!

          Comment


          • #6
            Pics when I pulled it down for those interested.


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            • #7
              The orange switch I'm pretty confident is an "emergency" switch to operate one of the groups if the touch pads cease working. Could be wrong, but try it and see.

              The gauge needle certainly shouldn't oscillate. Indicates the pump is struggling to draw water. Assuming the oump is ok, you may need to help it prime. To do that I crack open the pipe to the brew pressure gauge, run the pump until water spurts out, and then tighten the nut again on the pipe/gauge junction. Then turn off pump.

              These pumps mustn't be run dry from zero seconds for some to a minute for others so careful. Inline anti syphon valves are available at Bunnings for under $10.

              Good luck.

              Comment


              • #8
                im liking this one, id be inclined to completely remove those group heads and soak them in cleaner

                be watching this one, good luck!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by robusto View Post
                  The orange switch I'm pretty confident is an "emergency" switch to operate one of the groups if the touch pads cease working. Could be wrong, but try it and see.
                  Yeah, up next to the soft keys there is that orange switch which does manually activate it.

                  I've also discovered that the switch in the middle is for manual boiler fill.




                  Originally posted by robusto View Post
                  The gauge needle certainly shouldn't oscillate. Indicates the pump is struggling to draw water. Assuming the oump is ok, you may need to help it prime. To do that I crack open the pipe to the brew pressure gauge, run the pump until water spurts out, and then tighten the nut again on the pipe/gauge junction. Then turn off pump.

                  These pumps mustn't be run dry from zero seconds for some to a minute for others so careful. Inline anti syphon valves are available at Bunnings for under $10.

                  Good luck.
                  Perfect, thanks for that.
                  I had a feeling this may be the case,
                  that is my plan this week to head out and buy a new water container, anti-sypon valve and try my luck from there.

                  I will pull the top valve off out of the 2nd group head and see if it's caked up.
                  The pump has been hack-jobbed a bit up so hopefully it isn't dead.
                  it is rather loud but i'll put that to not being mounted on any rubber etc.

                  is there an obvious way to see if it is a rotary / vibration pump?

                  Hopefully it turns out okay,
                  Maybe PID control in the future if it's worthwhile? who knows!
                  but this is the first adventure into overkill machines at home haha.

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Sullo View Post
                    im liking this one, id be inclined to completely remove those group heads and soak them in cleaner

                    be watching this one, good luck!
                    I have considered this,
                    but that would involve me needing to purchase a full rebuild kit and at this stage my confidence levels aren't quite there.
                    on the flip side, getting some citric based cleaner to loosen up all the gunk can be a labour saver down the line when it goes in for it's check over :/

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Noomz View Post
                      is there an obvious way to see if it is a rotary / vibration pump?
                      A rotary pump will be brass with a sizable electric motor attached to it while a vibration pump will be plastic with no obvious motor.


                      Java "Night and day" phile
                      Toys! I must have new toys!!!

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                      • #12
                        Thanks for that.

                        Rotary pump it is!

                        A Bit dirty, but now I have a better idea of what I'm working with.
                        Attached Files

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          You are learning more about your machine as you explore deeper into it...way to go!

                          That pump looks as though it has a garden hose attached to it with other plastic irrigation adaptors. I'd remove them. Braided stainless steel hoses should screw onto the pump directly. Also less joins for leaks under pressure.

                          The dirty blue rectangular box with CE on it to the right of the boiler is almost certainly a Sirai pressurestat, which controls the heater. They are extremely long lasting, cheap, easy to adjust pressure, so a PID will not be necessary nor will it do a better job.

                          This is the Kinetic brand backflow anti syphon valve from Bunnings. The top part goes onto your braided or other hose, the large bottom part drops into your water tank.
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                          • #14
                            Originally posted by robusto View Post
                            You are learning more about your machine as you explore deeper into it...way to go!
                            Indeedy, it's something different.

                            Originally posted by robusto View Post
                            That pump looks as though it has a garden hose attached to it with other plastic irrigation adaptors. I'd remove them. Braided stainless steel hoses should screw onto the pump directly. Also less joins for leaks under pressure.
                            Correcto!,
                            The way it was setup is the braided line at the back goes upto the feed line
                            and the hose connector goes to the water container for quick connect / disconnect.
                            I'm not so worried about that side as it's pretty low pressure

                            Originally posted by robusto View Post
                            The dirty blue rectangular box with CE on it to the right of the boiler is almost certainly a Sirai pressurestat, which controls the heater. They are extremely long lasting, cheap, easy to adjust pressure, so a PID will not be necessary nor will it do a better job.

                            This is the Kinetic brand backflow anti syphon valve from Bunnings. The top part goes onto your braided or other hose, the large bottom part drops into your water tank.
                            Great! That answers my other pending upcoming question of "What is this"

                            Thanks for that!
                            I'm starting to feel a touch better with this risky purchase.

                            I'll drop into the big green store on my way home to pick some things up.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I appreicated the responses here as I go on this wild adventure of discovery, frustration and "what on earth does this do"

                              some questions may come across as silly, but absoloute new kid on the block for this side of the world haha.

                              The next Q.

                              Now, I haven't gone over the intricates of what each component does (I've had this for under 48hrs)

                              But this bitsa here.

                              I was looking around for a way to see inside the boiler and found that this was loose, as in I could turn it a couple of times before it reached the base of the thread.

                              Did potentially undo a setting here? or should this be tight tight?
                              taking it off showed a white plastic... thing.. with a rubber seal on the end, so I'll take a wild guess of a pressure relieve valve?

                              Thanks
                              Attached Files

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