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In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

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  • In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

    Greetings, Im still a relatively new user to the Silvia  having come from a Via Venezia which has the crema enhancing group handle. Ive read up what I can on the Silvia but here are a couple of questions Im throwing out there. I have been following the Mark Prince temp surf method and Im reasonably happy with the outcome. That is, I am having a fairly good strike rate in producing a nice golden crema with a sweet taste from the ethiopian roast which I roast myself. However when I let the machine heat up to the 30 mins or more which is suggested. The outcome is a mottled light crema with a bitter tasting brew. Any comments on that. Secondly when I allow the machine the recommended 30 mins or more. There is a great deal of steam ( in comparison to temp surf  method ) when I purge the brew head before I place the group handle on. Is this the ideal temperature for the proper use of the Silvia a great deal of steam as opposed to minimal from the temperature surf method.

    Cheers
    Carloz    

     

  • #2
    Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

    Originally posted by 282A392724314B0 link=1259100626/0#0 date=1259100626
    Greetings, Im still a relatively new user to the Silvia  having come from a Via Venezia which has the crema enhancing group handle. Ive read up what I can on the Silvia but here are a couple of questions Im throwing out there. I have been following the Mark Prince temp surf method and Im reasonably happy with the outcome. That is, I am having a fairly good strike rate in producing a nice golden crema with a sweet taste from the ethiopian roast which I roast myself. However when I let the machine heat up to the 30 mins or more which is suggested. The outcome is a mottled light crema with a bitter tasting brew. Any comments on that. Secondly when I allow the machine the recommended 30 mins or more. There is a great deal of steam ( in comparison to temp surf  method ) when I purge the brew head before I place the group handle on. Is this the ideal temperature for the proper use of the Silvia a great deal of steam as opposed to minimal from the temperature surf method.

    Cheers
    Carloz    

     
    May or may not be of assistance..

    Randy G has plenty of hints and his main system was a Silvia for a long time... Lots of reading and tips.

    http://home.surewest.net/frcn/Coffee/Coffee.html

    Also a handy page for those new to coffee and some great technical/service tips, machine reviews and how toos.  

    Search for - Coffee for Connoisseurs (Sorry link may be not 100% OK)

    AND of course
    http://www.sweetmarias.com/prod.rancilio.php


    Comment


    • #3
      Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

      Originally posted by 686A796764710B0 link=1259100626/0#0 date=1259100626
      Greetings, Im still a relatively new user to the Silvia  having come from a Via Venezia which has the crema enhancing group handle. Ive read up what I can on the Silvia but here are a couple of questions Im throwing out there. I have been following the Mark Prince temp surf method and Im reasonably happy with the outcome. That is, I am having a fairly good strike rate in producing a nice golden crema with a sweet taste from the ethiopian roast which I roast myself. However when I let the machine heat up to the 30 mins or more which is suggested. The outcome is a mottled light crema with a bitter tasting brew. Any comments on that. Secondly when I allow the machine the recommended 30 mins or more. There is a great deal of steam ( in comparison to temp surf  method ) when I purge the brew head before I place the group handle on. Is this the ideal temperature for the proper use of the Silvia a great deal of steam as opposed to minimal from the temperature surf method.

      Cheers
      Carloz    

       
      Gday Carloz,
      I used a Silvia for 8 years, great machine, only upgraded a few weeks ago.
      I agree with your observation, she can get too hot at times, I particularly noticed it when going back to pulling shots after the steam cycle, when you turn off the steam switch you need to run water through the group head at least until the thermostat light comes on, even then it is still too hot.
      And of course it can get pretty hot if you just leave it turned on for extended periods, Marks temp surfing method does work well.
      You will get to know the machine pretty well as you use it and work out your own preferences.
      A lot of people have fitted PID temp controllers, and are very happy with the results, never went in that direction myself, only changes I made were to buy a commercial PF and LaMarzocco double basket, I believe the standard PF being supplied now is a vast improvement on the older models, forget about using the single basket, useless.
      Oh and if you dont already have one buy a good tamper, (the plastic fantastic as supplied is crap) lots of threads on this site offering excellent advice re selection.
      Good luck with your new machine.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

        Greetings Jon,
        Thanks very much for your sharing your knowledge of the Silvia . Your information
        confirms that Im on the right track with some of Silvias idosyncracies particularly with steam. I have noted the popularity of the PID but shall wait till I get cashed up. In the meantime its great to get feedback from users that have hands on experience on this unit. The LM basket was suggested but I opted for the Synesso ridgeless because it was available at the time. Quite frankly Im pulling better shots just with the Silvias double basket and ditched the single basket. So at this stage Im going to stick this till I become more familiar with the Silvia.

        Thanks again
        Carlos

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

          Originally posted by 2220332D2E3B410 link=1259100626/3#3 date=1259119963
          Greetings Jon,
          Thanks very much for your sharing your knowledge of the Silvia . Your information
          confirms that Im on the right track with some of Silvias idosyncracies particularly with steam. I have noted the popularity of the PID but shall wait till I get cashed up. In the meantime its great to get feedback from users that have hands on experience on this unit. The LM basket was suggested but I opted for the Synesso ridgeless because it was available at the time. Quite frankly Im pulling better shots just with the Silvias double basket and ditched the single basket. So at this stage Im going to stick this till I become more familiar with the Silvia.

          Thanks again
          Carlos
          Sounds like your well and truly on the right track Carloz, Im told the Synesso baskets are equally as good as the LM, as I said I think nearly everyone gets rid of the single basket pretty early on.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

            Carloz,
            Im a PID guy these days, but I went down the temp surfing path for a few years. Ill stick my neck out against the general internet crowd and say I had very little success with temp surfing, I tried all methods with a very meticulous /anal approach.

            I rarely achieved a consistant tasting shot, but I was certainly able to get a consistant "window" where the shot was very nice.
            Having played with a PID for some time now, this doesnt surprise me as a 0.5C difference in the setpoint will make the kind of difference Im refering to.

            Pre PID, I ended up getting similar results to temp surfing by following this much easier routine:
            Hit the hot water switch and open the steam valve, run a bit of water into the jug: Stop the flow at the point where the spluttering steam starts to become more of a water stream [but still with a hint of steam]
            The shot will be good at this point.

            But of course YMMV

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

              Many Thanks for your comments. I think a very high consensus of Silvia users go by way of the PID. Like I said when Im cashed up I will probably go that way as well. In the meantime will try your suggestion about the steam quite an interesting idea. Theres only so much coffee one can drink though in the name of getting it right. Or is there?

              Thanks
              Carloz

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                I bought a Lucy 6 years ago and never temp surfed it. The Lucy doesnt have a light that comes on like the Silvia does for some reason.

                Im not convinced that the temp surfing you read about on the American sites is as necessary with the 240volt models we have here.

                I think a bitter shot is due to being too hot or over extracted (please correct me if I am wrong and I will edit the misinformation).

                I always ran water through the group and group handle into a cup to warm everything up, grind tamp and then pour. Worked for me

                I follow the same routine with the new GPP 8-)

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                  Originally posted by 6D6B7C776D6A7270190 link=1259100626/7#7 date=1259147205
                  Im not convinced that the temp surfing you read about on the American sites is as necessary with the 240volt models we have here.
                  It is if you want the correct brew temp, massive dead band, my silvia was from 86C low to 109C high!
                  Originally posted by 6D6B7C776D6A7270190 link=1259100626/7#7 date=1259147205
                  I think a bitter shot is due to being too hot
                  correct, and sour too cold......
                  Originally posted by 6D6B7C776D6A7270190 link=1259100626/7#7 date=1259147205
                  GPP Cool
                  How good are they!

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                    Carloz
                    Two weeks into a PID (after 2 years of standard use), and I must say that being able to see the vast fluctuations in boiler temp that comes from a bit of flushing, it is no surprise that some people struggle to find the right timing/temperature.

                    On the other hand, with the PID, Silvia is so much more relaxing to use. Knowing the machine is at the right temp, you can just get on with the grind/dose/tamp, lock it in and pour the shot - no need to think about where in the boiler cycle the machine is at. And seeing the brew light come back on during the pour, shows that it was probably getting too cool previously.
                    Now with the PID set at 108°, I wouldnt be surprised if most of my previous pours were in the high 90s as a rule. No measure of consistency, something we all know as being so important.

                    So whether you PID or Gronk - being able to see the temp is a great benefit if you want to know what is going on, and improve the level of control you have.

                    That leads on to a plug for Jim - great kit. As an electrician, I was most impressed with the standard and finish of his cabling and the ease of installation of the SD3C. It just all went together and was up and working in no time.

                    I bet the next two years of enjoyment go just as quick.
                    Thats probably why Ive got so few posts, too busy just enjoying the brew !

                    Good luck on your journey, just enjoy...
                    Fraser

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                      Originally posted by 7F7B5D4444415E4946280 link=1259100626/8#8 date=1259148741
                      Originally posted by 6D6B7C776D6A7270190 link=1259100626/7#7 date=1259147205
                      Im not convinced that the temp surfing you read about on the American sites is as necessary with the 240volt models we have here.  
                      It is if you want the correct brew temp, massive dead band, my silvia was from 86C low to 109C high!
                      Crikey

                      Is that at the group or the boiler temp?

                      If at the boiler does the brass around the group moderate the temp at all?

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                        Is that at the group or the boiler temp?
                        That would be the thermostat on/off cycle, residual heat pushes the boiler temp up to 120 or more(t/c on top of boiler)
                        Suggest the OP has a read of the Gronk thread at start of section, lots of info in there
                        Im not convinced that the temp surfing you read about on the American sites is as necessary with the 240volt models we have here.
                        I think our 240v machines run hotter, or get hotter quicker, my lovely MLG pidkit needed recalibrating to suit the 240V supply.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                          In regards to trenskis comments

                          I think a bitter shot is due to being too hot or over extracted (please correct me if I am wrong and I will edit the misinformation)

                          I think your quite right and in my case the bitterness it seems is when that boiler gets to hot and I get a very mottled consistency with the pour. I think even with the so called temp surf what Im trying to achieve is to heat all the brass components of the Silvia rather than the long wait.

                          Cheers
                          Carloz

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                            I actually found that with Silvia if I pulled 60ml into a cup to warm it while I ground the beans, then that would produce a great shot just as consistently as when I went to the trouble of Temp Surfing (which I became lazy about and gave up). I just wasnt seeing a huge difference in the shot (which I thought was fabulous) irrespective of the technique. So the mantra keep it simple became the solution. Just ensure that 30 minutes warm up. I loved my Silvia and only traded up to a HX to live the dream!

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: In need of some Rancilio Silvia Tips

                              Greetings, First a very good point about Keeping it Simple. Thats the general direction Im trying to with by heating all the brass components and ensuring that the Silvia is up to temp before the 30 mins. Congrats on the HX and living the dream. It is all good fun at the end of the day if you dont take it all to seriously.

                              Cheers
                              Carloz

                              Comment

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