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At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

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  • At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

    Hello All,

    Ive had a Silvia and Rocky (purchased from Siboni) for 4 or so years and have had great coffee out of the combo. Im due for a new group head cover (got to love the chromed plastic) and most likely a new set of burrs. Ive also just picked up a Bemor roaster, just took delivery today (thanks Andy).

    Moving to Wentworth Falls convinced me to finally get a roaster as getting fresh beans here is much harder to the extent I have been reduced to buying supermarket beans, Yeah I know pretty bad. I also couldn’t bring myself to have an espresso, no crema and too bitter. I could hide that with a latte at least. Well at least they were fair-trade. I used to get most of my beans from Forsyths or Hernandez when I lived close and had work getting beans from Siboni. So now at least I can have fresh beans again.

    After that long winded wind up Ive gotten to the stage that Im thinking of another machine. There’s nothing wrong with the Silvia it’s a great little machine that produces great coffee but I have the feeling known to everyone here that there could be something better. I know I feel that way with straight razors, not necessarily looking for a better shave but a different experience. Ive been looking at lever machines and have and drawn to both modern and classic levers. Sneaking a La Pavoni Europiccola circa 1970 past SHMBO is not impossible and I love old stuff, cars, razors etc they just have a feeling that most modern alternatives just dont offer. I’ve had a look at the Ponte Vecchio Lusso and the Olympia Cremina but still come back to the vintage La Pavoni. What I’m after if possible is an idea of what they are like. This might be a question for Jack who I know has tried various lever machines.

    I’m asking now because I have the chance to pick a machine up from Francesco of francescoceccarelli.eu in Rome when I’m there in June. All help appreciated.

    Thanks
    Tony

  • #2
    Re: At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

    Rocky: ".....4 years or so.....new set of burrs..."

    Lets say 250 grams per week for 4.5 years

    ie. 0.25 x 52 x 4.5 = 58.5 kilos, say 60. The machine and burrs are barely run in and at that rate of use you probably still have another 18 years left in them especially if you are using good quality arabicas at the correct grind setting. 

    Silvia VS europiccola is like comparing apples to oranges. They are different in so many ways, about the only thing they have in common is they make a cup of coffee. So yes, you need to seek opinions from europiccola owning members.

    But you dont need to buy this stuff o/s, you should be able to pick them up all over the place in Oz new or used.....even I have 2! As to them having antique value, its a model that is still current although in developed form. It can be said that the modern form is "better" than the older models, and is there any value in having an older one? Only you can answer that.

    For my opinion, I dont see any value in the "antiquity" of a europioccola although others may differ in their opinions (an old europiccola is just an old europiccola to me) and I would prefer a more refined / developed / easier to manage lever machine if I were to want to use it seriously for my home coffee requirements. I also dont like small / light coffee machines because they are small and move around on the bench while you are trying to use them.....I dont like that at all.

    Ultimately, my opinion is your silvia is a much better espresso machine in toto if you are only interested in the "matter of fact" end of good quasi commercial style espresso.....but it doesnt have the old world romantic aura / charm about it. You simply have to decide what you want and for what reasons.

    Hope that helps.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

      As the owner of a vintage Cremina Ill weigh in on this one. My previous machine was a Gaggia classic so pretty similar choices. Basic pump and lever. Like you I wasnt that impressed with the Cremina initially, the boxy look was a but un-special for me and the europic was a consideration on looks and charm front.

      Lever is a different experience and produces a different kind of cup. I much prefer both the taste and process of lever coffee to pump machines. Getting a lever was the best thing I ever did. I love it and my Gaggia has had no love since the Cremina arrived.

      The research which swayed me away from the europic...

      Its well known to hop, or move while pulling a shot. The design of it makes it less stable than some levers and I didnt fancy being tempted to grab hold of a poker hot boiler should my europic suicide off the bench. My cremina has a case that never really gets hot. And its heavy enough it doesnt tip or move while pulling a shot.

      Its well known to have a tight tolerance for grind, resulting in sink shots and its notorious coffee sneeze. None of which I fancied. Europic owners however soon learn to deal with their machines and there are many happy owners of them. The cremina has never sneezed coffee and Ive not gotten a sink shot. The grind can vary and its very forgiving.

      Although a rectangular box on my bench was never an aim what I do love about the Cremina is its footprint. Its actually tiny and sits very nicely in my equally tiny kitchen. Its about the size if an upended toaster and looks surprisingly good. Ive also never gotten a burn of it, but I was constantly burning myself on the Gaggias steam wand.

      To sum up. If you want to try lever you wont be disappointed, the above are simply the reasons why I chose the lever that I did.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

        Hello,

        Maybe 40 is the time to buy a lever machine, I recently turned 40 myself and went on a trip instead. The Pav. for me would be special because its vintage and Ill pick it up in Rome. Its also a cheap way to get into a lever machine and I can sell it for pretty much what I payed for it.

        Id love a Cremina (and no they dont look as sexy as a Pav. but do run like the proverbial swiss watch). They are apparently hard to find vintage, you were indeed in league with the devil to find one so quickly. So Ill keep an eye out for one but prabably grab a Pav and a good oven mitt in the meantime.

        On a sidenote I can highy recommend getting a roaster, My first roast was fantastic. Well that is apart from setting off the fire alarm. First crack then a siren going off. I think I reached second crack while I ran and disabled the offending unit.

        Thanks

        Tony

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola


          Originally posted by 66707C7E7A382324262D150 link=1336022124/3#3 date=1336201102
          Hello,

          Maybe 40 is the time to buy a lever machine, I recently turned 40 myself and went on a trip instead. 
          Agreed. I think you just get to the mid-way stage in life and think screw it! Its time I found out what Ive been missing out on. I need to taste the connoiseur lifestyle.  ;D

          Enjoy your pav. Im sure youll find it just as enjoyable as anything else. Theres research, and then theres following your heart. Both are fun!

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

            Welcome seiko-6138,

            FWIW, my opinion of the Pav is that its an interesting exercise in design which might produce a good shot or two in the hands of a skilled operator, but its best admired for form, rather than appreciated for function. Day to day the Silvia wins hands down.

            One thing to keep in mind is that if you onsell a grey import and it goes pop, you could possibly be held liable for damages.

            If youre going to Europe and have your heart set on a lever machine, why not use the time to scope out a good renovator from Faema, Gaggia et al?

            A faithful and considerate restoration will create a machine of far more interest than a little toy and you will have a family heirloom and item of true beauty which also produces great coffee.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

              Grey import is not really a problem as Im looking at one older than I am Warranty went long ago the model is the same as the vintage in AUS with an EU plug.

              People also say the same about straight razor shaving or drinving an old car. Its not how many bells and whistles that is important too me its the experience.

              Example I drive an Audi TTS as an every day car, but also have an old mg that is more fun to drive. More care is needed but the experience is fantastic. I at one timed shaved with the standard dual head displosable, transitioned to a safety razor and now only shave with a straight razor. Shaving is now fun and I cant wait for the hair to grow. How many of you can say that about shaving

              Thats the great thing about anything, everyone enjoys something a little different. When I upgrade, If I like the lever system Ill grab a cremina or Lusso. If I dont Ill get something like a vintage Faema and have it plumbed.

              Cheers

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: At a crossroards Silvia/La Pavoni Europiccola

                Originally posted by 67717D7F7B392225272C140 link=1336022124/6#6 date=1336207460
                If I like the lever system Ill grab a cremina or Lusso. If I dont Ill get something like a vintage Faema and have it plumbed.
                Thing is, the Pav is not representative of the quality of shot you can produce with any of the others- so you will never really know. I think the logic is flawed.

                Your money though and how you spend it is up to you.

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