Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $1500

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $1500

    Hello all,

    I bought a Gaggia Carezza a couple of years ago and while I use it often, Ive decided to go down the path of a super automatic machine for a number of reasons.  Im aware of the pitfalls of super-autos.

    Ive read a lot of postings on this site that say how unreliable they are, but I wanted some opionion on the most reliable of the unreliable!

    I have $1000 to spend but, at the risk of my marriage, could stretch it to $1500, so the closer to a grand the better.

    I like the look of the Gaggia Titanium (and my Gaggia Carezza has been faultless) but it only comes with 12 month warranty.  My sisters Saeco Incanto Sirius is fantastic, but broken down twice in the 2 years warranty period it comes with.

    I know I can save money by buying on eBay, but if I buy from a store I can get extra warranty (which interests me greatly).

    Can anyone advise me on the lesser of two evils (Saeco Incanto/Gaggia Titanium), or indeed a third evil in my price range? Reliability will be the deciding factor.

    Thanks in advance.

  • #2
    Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

    Originally posted by pat_mc_crotch link=1180844837/0#0 date=1180844837
    Reliability will be the deciding factor.

    Thanks in advance.
    In that case dont touch any superautomatic other than a Jura.....

    You WILL have problems with the others and, even if fixed under warranty, you will be without a coffee machine whilst yours is being repaired.

    Superautomatics are extremely complex.... and it is the complexity which results in them being unreliable.... especially when corners have been cut to make a price point. That is why so many end up (used) on Evilbay.... the owners have become sick of the problems with them- and the expense of on-going maintenance (which may not be covered by warranty).

    The fact that a normal model gaggia is reliable has little bearing on the reliability of a gaggia superautomatic..... its like comparing an IBM supplied pencil and an IBM computer / word processor / printer..... they both will produce text on paper.... the pencil will be far more reliable than the complex technical solution :

    The Jura is quite a bit more expensive - but there is a reason - it is better built therefore it is far more reliable!!!

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

      Thanks for your response. Please point me to the Jura super-auto which is around the $1000 mark.

      My friends experience with the $2000+ Jura he was in charge of purchasing for his work has turned me (and everyone in his office) right off them. Reparied a half-dozen times in its first year. Everyone switched back to instant.

      Is there no reliability difference between the Saeco/Gaggia (even though theyre the same company now)?

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

        Originally posted by pat_mc_crotch link=1180844837/0#2 date=1180850715
        Thanks for your response. Please point me to the Jura super-auto which is around the $1000 mark.
        There is none!!!

        My friends experience with the $2000+ Jura he was in charge of purchasing for his work has turned me (and everyone in his office) right off them. Reparied a half-dozen times in its first year. Everyone switched back to instant.

        Well they are FAR more reliable than the ones you mentioned..... better get in some stocks of instant..... :

        Have a search here for comments on super autos - from owners. Mostly bad!

        Is there no reliability difference between the Saeco/Gaggia (even though theyre the same company now)?
        I think you will find they are pretty much the same..... both equally bad!!

        What you are saying is that a Jura (about the quality of a Silvia as far as build goes - but naturally the Silvia is more reliable - is no good..... so you want something for a fraction of the price..... and you expect it to be more reliable / make better coffee.... which is like buying a $200 gaggia/sunbeam/breville in the hope its going to be better than the Silvia??????

        Sorry, Jura are far more reliable (and as you say... thats not too good)..... what you are looking at is worse - far worse - when it comes to reliability....

        I hope you get a good one.... and it continues to be so.... but that is most unlikely!

        Sincerely - Good luck - you will need it!!!

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

          OK, at the risk of my marriage, what Jura super auto can you recommend and how much are they?

          Would a second hand one be anygood?

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

            Originally posted by pat_mc_crotch link=1180844837/0#4 date=1180922043
            OK, at the risk of my marriage, what Jura super auto can you recommend and how much are they?
            They start at about $1500.... send a PM to Serge at Go Barista as he is one site sponsor who sells them (there maybe others- but I dont know any)..... They will be more reliable in the home situation than in the office / work situation because of the reduced number of drinks made.

            Would a second hand one be anygood?
            Well that would depend on why the person is selling it. Jura, just like every other brand, can have the odd lemon (and because of the complexity of a superautomatic the odds of this are a lot higher). So if the seller has been having problems (and they wont of course tell you that) then you will be purchasing a headache.

            To put this whole reliability thing in perspective..... two coffee machines which are built to the same standard with the same quality bits..... one (a semi auto) has 5 items which can fail.... the other (a super auto) has 25 - and that is very conservative for the super auto.... the probability of failure is the square of the ratio between the two (a statistical fact).

            so 25/5 is 5 .... the square of 5 is 25... so the Super auto is 25 times more likely to fail than a semi auto (again this is conservative)...

            Or in the real world .... if a Silvia fails once in 10 years.... the superautomatic will probably fail 2.5 times a year !!! Scary isnt it ------ and the reason most of us dont like superautomatics!!!!

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

              Gday pmc,

              Im pretty sure that Attilio of Cosmorex and perhaps Gilkatho also sell Jura Super-Autos, just click on their respective links at the L/H side of the page to grab the contact details,

              Cheers,
              Mal.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                OK Ive had a quick look at the Jura C5 and it looks like their entry level machine (for around $1500).
                Does anyone have any opinions on it? Surely its going to be better quality than the Gaggia/Saeco.

                Thanks again

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                  ....hahahahaha...pat my crotch....funniest name on here.....hahahaha

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                    Ive had an Incanto for almost three years. The first one was replaced within a year because of constant breakdowns. The second one went back six or seven times in 14 months. Luckily, I made enough noise so that they now collect and return the machine. I was convinced there was a design fault because the steamer knob kept sticking so that the valve didnt close. Eventually, they acknowledged that there is an issue and have done a stealth recall - they havent announced it, but if you take your machine back theyll replace the internals with a brass unit. Since the last repair, its been mostly fine - the odd sticky valve, but it soon rectifies.
                    Also, with some tweaking, you can get a reasonable result and our flat whites compare with most of the cafes around here.
                    My advice, get an extended warranty. Youll probably need it.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                      Thanks for the info on the Saeco - Ive passed it onto my sister.

                      After the posts above Ive decided to go for the Jura C5. It just means Ill have to save up a few more shekels (or get me a new wife)!!

                      Thanks to all respondants.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                        Dont get a superauto machine.
                        Why do you want one so bad?
                        I mean, you must want it bad to pay that much for. For far less you can get a many times better machine with better reliability and a million times better coffee in your cup.
                        Those machines are huge, expensive, unreliable, dont make good coffee, no fun to use, and still have to clean them and empty them.
                        I am sorry to say, but in time, you will regret your purchase.

                        For someone like you the Sunbeam Cafe series EM6910 could be a great purchase. So easy to use and even if you dont know much about making coffee you still be making coffee better then out of the superautos. All you need to do is to fill the basket with coffee and press the button. That is not much harder then a superauto machine. The only extra you do with the sunbeam is to fill the basket with coffee. Cannot be that hard. You will still froth milk the same way with the superauto if you want good milk. At least with the Sunbeam you can expand your accessories if you want to get involved with coffee more. Like getting a grinder, a nice tamper, or a bang bang.


                        The Sunbeam 6910 is perfect for someone like you.
                        And if you want something even better then you could get the Ascaso. The Ascaso comes volumetric now, also, and is still cheaper then a Jura.
                        Remember there are other machines but from listening to you it seems these would suit you best.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                          Like I said in my original posting, Im fully aware of the pitfalls of super-autos and the trade off with the resulting espresso quality. Its a personal choice. I know in theory I could get a better coffee with my Carezza and a good grinder, and I thought about going down that path, but the fact of the matter is I get a better coffee out of my sisters Saeco EVERY time than I ever had with my Carezza. Plus you become a waiter whenever people come over because it takes forever to make more than 2 cups.

                          For a lazy guy like me, who even enjoys the taste of instant, a super-auto with a 2 year warranty will get used at least once a day. If I went down the path of getting an $1800 diadema with another $500 rocky grinder would get used once a week. Horses for courses.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                            cant help you mate - my wifes work have now gone through like 4 super-autos in 2 years, and its not heavily-driven. Plus the coffe tastes average (tiny crema), the microfoam is non-existant (massive frothy bubbles). My point is from what ive seen around that $ there not reliable! just a warning... but like you said Horses for courses.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Most reliable super-automatic machine sub $150

                              BTW the 4 models have included 1 saeco.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X