Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

[Barry_Duncan]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

When brewing coffee for myself I too use the single basket in my BDB with good results. No coffee goes to waste.

Barry

[DavidW1960]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

When brewing coffee for myself I too use the single basket in my BDB with good results. No coffee goes to waste.

LOL. Go us single basket rebels!

[Thirteen13]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

from what i understand with the VST baskets, its making mention of 2 things, which could be what people are suggesting are inferior on the single baskets.

1. The inconsistancy in holes in the output side (bottom) of the basket. To the naked eye, this would be very hard to review.

2. The tampering of the basket. If you look at the double baskets, water flows into coffee and flows straight out.
On the single basket it tampers from the wide opening at the top, to the narrow output bottom. Apprently this can have an effect on the pour on the coffee as rather than just pushing the water straight out, it can swirl and do all sorts of funny things.

Im starting to have really good results with the single basket. My problem was over dosing. I was sticking with the smart grinder default settings and that was my undoing.
Just waiting for my Behmor to rock up now.

[DavidW1960]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Apprently this can have an effect on the pour on the coffee as rather than just pushing the water straight out, it can swirl and do all sorts of funny things.

Abundantly demonstrated if you use a naked portafiller

[Thirteen13]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Well i had a friend come over yesterday and he bought with him... hold onto something close by.... Supermarket beans over.

Yes a bag of black Vittoria Mountain Grown whatever it is... Anyway ground it up and run a few shots through the machine and i must say...

Terrible. Coffee ran like murky water, coffee had a very unpleasant flavour and didnt give me that buzz.

Its now becoming very clear the huge differences between fresh and not so fresh and how my taste buds are becoming snobby

[blend52]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Did you adjust your grinder to suit the beans ??
supermarket beans are never going to match a good fresh roast, but you can get a reasonable shot with some effort.
It would be a lot better if all these commercial bean suppliers printed the roasting date on the bags so you could at least get a reasonably fresh bag rather than the "lucky dip" attempt at trying to interpret their "best before" dates !

[peter.wake]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Ive had my Breville BES900 (BDB) for a few days now, an upgrade from a EM6910; before that I had Gaggia Classic and Gaggic Cube (also used to use works Kitchen Aid a lot, which was terrible). The BDB is certainly a lot better than my old 6910 or any of those machines.

I was immediately impressed with the better depth and range of taste compared to the Sunbeam, and milk is far easier to manage. Getting good microfoam from the old Sunbeam EM6910 machine was only possible with the absolute freshest milk, only with changes to the default temperature and pump timing settings for the steam, only with aggressive flushing before starting, and only with the right quantity of milk - milk for two or three people.

In contrast the Breville makes frothing milk almost impossible to do wrong. The only bad result Ive had was when my wife used the machine and left two holes in the steam wand blocked. It was all but impossible to block the giant hole in the Sunbeam wand, but the three small holes in the BDB mean you must be more careful how you clean it. Most people will never have a problem, but there are a few things about this machine that require more care and attention than the EM6910.

It does take more than the single tank of water suggested in the instructions to properly flush and prepare the machine out of the box. I initially flushed through at least four and I could still taste some newness, but by the second day the slight plastic-metallic taste was gone entirely. Even with the slight taint, the first few shots were still great.

The stainless head doesnt hold heat like a brass one, and Im not sure it represents an improvement, for what must be more cost. It really does require the heating and flushing regimen that Phil described, but then, almost every machine seems to get some benefit from such an approach. The plastic disc seems pointless and just invites trouble. It seemed silly on the Sunbeam, and on the BDB, a machine that will be mainly bought by people who care about their coffee, it is simply a nuisance that must be removed.

Though the water tank is not small, its very easy to go through it using the hot water tap. As the hot water on the Sunbeam was almost useless (hugely inferior to the Gaggias), that was never an issue there. So, I could wish for a larger tank, but I can also see how hard that would have been to fit in without making the machine bigger, which I suspect many people would not like.

The genuine low-pressure pre-infusion is a really great feature on this machine. Even if you are awful at tamping, it is going to reduce the chance of channelling. I used to use the single shot basket on the Sunbeam a lot (as the double seemed to have holes that were too large) and started out using the single on the BDB, and got reliable results. Still, its nice to have a genuine choice of single or double again. Its very hard to stuff up a shot with the double, and the single is pretty reliable too. Im using the double almost exclusively now as I usually need to make four coffees anyway and getting back the ability to make a decent double shot is another benefit over the Sunbeam (yes I know I could have bought another basket, always meant to).

I read through all 35 pages of this forum, and some people really seem to be having problems. I cant help but think that in most cases their trouble is starting with the grinder (or the beans) and not the BDB.

I have over a decade of espresso experience, but I certainly dont expect buying a new machine will allow me to brew with the consistency of a thirty years professional or get God shots 9 out of 10 ... and some people do seem to think that it should ... but ... the BDB is the easiest machine to get a good coffee out of that Ive used. I can reliably get pours that seemed all but impossible with the Sunbeam and occurred only on a magic alignment of the planets with the Gaggia. I dont get shots or milk as good as the best Ive tasted from tweaked commercial machines driven by experts, but Im still very pleased with the quality and consistency of the results Im getting. As for reliability - we wont know with certainty for some time how that will pan out.

There really needs to be a FAQ sticky. It took me along time to go through this thread in its entirety, and there is a mass of duplication.

Recurring issues that jump out at me are:
[list bull-blackball][*]The bad batch of OPV calibrations and getting yours fixed.[*]Do not try to descale and why you dont need to.[*]Flushing/temperature regimen for brewing.[*]Removing the annoying plastic disc from portafilter (dont lose the washer).[*]Smart Grinder shims.[*]How to get a naked portafilter.[*]My shots suck, whats wrong? Checklist of obvious things.[/list]

[Thirteen13]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Did you adjust your grinder to suit the beans ??
supermarket beans are never going to match a good fresh roast, but you can get a reasonable shot with  some effort.
It would be a lot better if all these commercial bean suppliers  printed the roasting date on the bags so you could at least get a reasonably fresh bag rather than the "lucky dip"  attempt at trying to interpret their "best before"  dates ! 

Exactly. It was labelled on the bag best before, but they could suggest any amount of time is good.

It pulls an ok shot, you definately do not get the same quality of coffee, with pour consistancey,immediate taste, and after tastes. But using this machine vs a cheaper machine i used in the past its clear to see this machine is superior in shot.

I have played with the grinder and i cant get anything decent or close to the fresh roasted coffee i have had, so im not going to bother trying to replicate it with these beans. As they say.... you cant make a silk purse from a pigs ear.

[Yelta]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

you cant make a silk purse from a pigs ear.

Thats absolutely correct, and of course we must remember Rome wasnt built in a day. ;D

[Thirteen13]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Lol....Im trying to further the wit but I cant think of another cliche.
A good call none the less 

[coolie21]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Ive had my Breville BES900 (BDB) for a few days now, an upgrade from a EM6910;

Good post thanks, Ive come to much the same conclusions as a new user but you have put it very well

[Stumpybum007]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Hi all,
Despite reading through 35 pages of discussion on the BES900 I cant find anyone who seems to be having similar problems to me.
I am an early adopter, my unit arrived in Brisbane in September of last year. It was a combo deal including the breville BCG800 grinder. All had been going very well up until 2 months ago. I noticed that the extraction times seemed to be increasing while the boiler seemed to make some struggling noises. Over a few weeks the amount of water coming through the head dropped off. Finally no water would come out, even without attaching the filter. The steam wand and hot water heads continued to work fine.
I have continued to use the same beans, from Dibella. My technique has remained unchanged (I hope).The machine has been cleaned regularly as per the manual and the filter changed.
I called the breville support line. I stated the model number and problem. I was advised it was likely a scale buildup, easily fixed by flushing vinegar through the system. Despite my query that the manual stated not to descale the machine, the support person reassured me this was the correct thing to do. You can probably guess what happened. The machine still didnt work but now smelled very strongly of vinegar. As did I.
Further advice from breville was to take the machine into a service center.
After two weeks the machine was returned. I was advised that the had replaced some internal seals that they presumed the vinegar had damaged.
The machine still does not work properly. When the auto extraction buttons are pressed there is now a loud zapping noise. The machine cycles though the pre-extraction phase, generates pressure for less than ten seconds, pressure falls and then continues to chug along at a pressure of zero indefinitely. Right now no water comes through the head at all. I have also noticed the top surface of the machine, for resting cups, has become too hot to touch.
Im very sorry for the long dialogue. The breville support line doesnt seem to have done me any favours and neither has the authorized service center. At least I wasnt worried about electrocution before I took it in. If anyone has some advice as to my next step I would be very grateful.
Cheers

[frangutz]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Ok. unfortunately my BCG smartgrinder just died this morning itself- not happy  > dropped it off to the breville service centre & was told I would need to wait about thirteen days (work days) before getting it back  > So, now I am without a grinder for at least 3 weeks. So... has anybody used pre ground coffee in their machine? should I use the other type of basket for pre ground?

do you get reasonable results?

[Yelta]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Hi all,
Despite reading through 35 pages of discussion on the BES900 I cant find anyone who seems to be having similar problems to me.
I am an early adopter, my unit arrived in Brisbane in September of last year. It was a combo deal including the breville BCG800 grinder. All had been going very well up until 2 months ago. I noticed that the extraction times seemed to be increasing while the boiler seemed to make some struggling noises. Over a few weeks the amount of water coming through the head dropped off. Finally no water would come out, even without attaching the filter. The steam wand and hot water heads continued to work fine.
I have continued to use the same beans, from Dibella. My technique has remained unchanged (I hope).The machine has been cleaned regularly as per the manual and the filter changed.
I called the breville support line. I stated the model number and problem. I was advised it was likely a scale buildup, easily fixed by flushing vinegar through the system. Despite my query that the manual stated not to descale the machine, the support person reassured me this was the correct thing to do. You can probably guess what happened. The machine still didnt work but now smelled very strongly of vinegar. As did I.
Further advice from breville was to take the machine into a service center.
After two weeks the machine was returned. I was advised that the had replaced some internal seals that they presumed the vinegar had damaged.
The machine still does not work properly. When the auto extraction buttons are pressed there is now a loud zapping noise. The machine cycles though the pre-extraction phase, generates pressure for less than ten seconds, pressure falls and then continues to chug along at a pressure of zero indefinitely. Right now no water comes through the head at all. I have also noticed the top surface of the machine, for resting cups, has become too hot to touch.
Im very sorry for the long dialogue. The breville support line doesnt seem to have done me any favours and neither has the authorized service center. At least I wasnt worried about electrocution before I took it in. If anyone has some advice as to my next step I would be very grateful.
Cheers

Not good enough.
It must still be under warranty, take it in and tell them to fix it.

[peter.wake]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Further advice from breville was to take the machine into a service center.
After two weeks the machine was returned. I was advised that the had replaced some internal seals that they presumed the vinegar had damaged.
The machine still does not work properly. When the auto extraction buttons are pressed there is now a loud zapping noise. The machine cycles though the pre-extraction phase, generates pressure for less than ten seconds, pressure falls and then continues to chug along at a pressure of zero indefinitely. Right now no water comes through the head at all. I have also noticed the top surface of the machine, for resting cups, has become too hot to touch.
Im very sorry for the long dialogue. The breville support line doesnt seem to have done me any favours and neither has the authorized service center. At least I wasnt worried about electrocution before I took it in. If anyone has some advice as to my next step I would be very grateful.

As Jon said, Breville needs to fix this. Its a basic warranty issue. If you can try a different service centre you might have more luck. Failing that, you may have to pursue the matter directly with Breville.

I think it is worth making a complaint about the vinegar advice, as that sounds very much as if the person on the help line had insufficient training on the BES900 and didnt check their notes for it properly. You cant blame Breville for the bad repair, but you can blame them for the dubious advice that, according to the service centre, created a need for seal replacements.

Perhaps others can comment on how this is done at Breville, and they may not work this way, but Im sure we have all experienced help line personnel that have been outsourced and/or offshored, working from a basic script, that are as likely to harm as help. In those cases the best outcome is for is for them to put you through to someone who can actually help, which to some extent is their job: directing questions to the right people.