Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

[Lukemc]

i got my BDB today, picked it up from the post office, set it up and went through 5 shots before i got a 34 second extraction time and a great (for me!) tasting espresso (using Brazil premium Bourbon beans roasted 26/12 from beanbay).

Im really happy with the steam, I managed to do a dodgy heart with the milk (first time I've ever been able to get anything close to latte art!)

Dunno if its just the honeymoon period but I've already found in a few hours that this machine is much easier to get a half decent shot with for me than the sunbeam i had before it.

[nickoyang]

I have a half baked theory about how to avoid the portafilter coming loose mid-extraction.

It only seems to happen to me when I attempt to brew as soon as the machine has reached operating temperature.

I've found that if I turn on the machine, take the dog for a walk (20mins) then start brewing when I return home, it doesn't happen.

Also the portafilter just "feels" different when inserting it into the group head if the machine has warmed up for 20 mins. It's like the seals expand a little bit after a few minutes, although it's also possible that they are just drying out (Phil recommended that the seals should be bone dry, right?)

Note: before anyone trolls me for suggesting that people wait 20mins before brewing... a) i don't care if the breville says you don't need to wait this long, b) waiting for 15 or so mins is probably good advice for *any* home espresso machine.

Hi,

If you think from the o-ring lifetime and reliability, it would be better not to keep your BDB always standby. The extended period of time to keep machine warm up is sufficient to shorten the o-ring lifetime and makes them hardened sooner as expected.

From my experience, those o-rings are highly related to the sealing and pressure even there is no visible leak from the hose connections. The scale accumulated on the steam boiler probes and NIC temperature sensors for the boilers also change the bar pressure and brewing temperature gradually. So indeed, all the minor changes continuously until you observe something goes wrong.

One tricky comment from Breville not to descale the boilers is a mistake for me. Those boilers cannot be dissected for descaling as the traditional HX or DB Italian machines' boilers. If the scale accumulates too much, even after the descaling with citric acid, the large pieces of the scale flakes cannot be blasted out from the little pipe holes on the boilers. So the BDB almost cannot be repaired fully by that time. In short, BDB was designed in good concept in mind but not much in its maintenance due to its low pricing and less durable components.

Thanks

Nick

[Andy]

i got my BDB today, picked it up from the post office, set it up and went through 5 shots before i got a 34 second extraction time and a great (for me!) tasting espresso (using Brazil premium Bourbon beans roasted 26/12 from beanbay).

Im really happy with the steam, I managed to do a dodgy heart with the milk (first time I've ever been able to get anything close to latte art!)

Dunno if its just the honeymoon period but I've already found in a few hours that this machine is much easier to get a half decent shot with for me than the sunbeam i had before it.

Sounds like you are on a winner there Lukemc

Enjoy the journey to better coffee!

[nickoyang]

Hi,

If you think from the o-ring lifetime and reliability, it would be better not to keep your BDB always standby. The extended period of time to keep machine warm up is sufficient to shorten the o-ring lifetime and makes them hardened sooner as expected.

From my experience, those o-rings are highly related to the sealing and pressure even there is no visible leak from the hose connections. The scale accumulated on the steam boiler probes and NIC temperature sensors for the boilers also change the bar pressure and brewing temperature gradually. So indeed, all the minor changes continuously until you observe something goes wrong.

One tricky comment from Breville not to descale the boilers is a mistake for me. Those boilers cannot be dissected for descaling as the traditional HX or DB Italian machines' boilers. If the scale accumulates too much, even after the descaling with citric acid, the large pieces of the scale flakes cannot be blasted out from the little pipe holes on the boilers. So the BDB almost cannot be repaired fully by that time. In short, BDB was designed in good concept in mind but not much in its maintenance due to its low pricing and less durable components.

Thanks

Nick

Hi,

Some folks posted here and coffeegeek regarding my "descaling". That is very funny to comment my method is wrong without witness.
As I said many times before, I really don't care about that kind of comments because I know my preventive descaling is working perfectly and no acid residue or poison left inside the machine's boiling system when the process is completed. I also use soda to neutralize the citric acid residue and then peer at the interior of the boilers to check the results. I can tell you, the result is damn good!

Nick

[BubbaDude]

Hi,

Some folks posted here and coffeegeek regarding my "descaling". That is very funny to comment my method is wrong without witness.
As I said many times before, I really don't care about that kind of comments because I know my preventive descaling is working perfectly and no acid residue or poison left inside the machine's boiling system when the process is completed. I also use soda to neutralize the citric acid residue and then peer at the interior of the boilers to check the results. I can tell you, the result is damn good!

Nick

Phil Knight from Breville said your de-scaling method is wrong and dangerous, and advised people not to use it. Until there is documented evidence to the contrary, Phil's word is the gospel as far as I'm concerned.

[Yelta]

Phil Knight from Breville said your de-scaling method is wrong and dangerous, and advised people not to use it. Until there is documented evidence to the contrary, Phil's word is the gospel as far as I'm concerned.

Not sure where the danger aspect comes in BD, citric acid is a naturally occurring substance that is found in many foods, particularly citrus fruits Is Citric Acid Toxic? | LIVESTRONG.COM I'm not suggesting its ideal for descaling, however the minute amounts left over after the process won't do any harm.

[BubbaDude]

Not sure where the danger aspect comes in BD, citric acid is a naturally occurring substance that is found in many foods, particularly citrus fruits Is Citric Acid Toxic? | LIVESTRONG.COM I'm not suggesting its ideal for descaling, however the minute amounts left over after the process won't do any harm.

Phil's response was pretty strong, as I recall, but I don't have time to look it up today.

[nickoyang]

Phil Knight from Breville said your de-scaling method is wrong and dangerous, and advised people not to use it. Until there is documented evidence to the contrary, Phil's word is the gospel as far as I'm concerned.

Gospel? HA! HA!

[nickoyang]

Not sure where the danger aspect comes in BD, citric acid is a naturally occurring substance that is found in many foods, particularly citrus fruits Is Citric Acid Toxic? | LIVESTRONG.COM I'm not suggesting its ideal for descaling, however the minute amounts left over after the process won't do any harm.

My post about one year ago regarding the descaling was incorrect but that had been modified and followed all the methodologies of professional descaling done by some experts.

[BubbaDude]

My post about one year ago regarding the descaling was incorrect but that had been modified and followed all the methodologies of professional descaling done by some experts.

That's nice, what's your current method? All I saw was the first attempt.

[geekylucas]

So I've had my BDB for 5 months now and I'm really starting to worry about the pending o-ring failure you guys are talking about.

I'm also concerned about not having the ability to descale the machine.

Combine this with the fact that I'm not totally impressed with the quality of the espresso coming out of it (although the steamer is excellent).

I'm thinking of selling it and getting a Silvia (which was my original plan until I saw the BDB for $1k at a Retravision closing down sale).

Can someone please talk me off this ledge?

[blend52]

Can someone please talk me off this ledge?

The "O" ring issues ar well understood and the fix is easy, so dont let that worry you.

And the quality of the coffee is more a function of the inputs.. ( beans , roast , age, grinder, dose, etc etc) than the m/c itself.
Stick with it,..the Silvia would not be easier for you to make good coffee.

[J_Hutt]

So I've had my BDB for 5 months now and I'm really starting to worry about the pending o-ring failure you guys are talking about.

I would recommend everyone with a BDB get Breville to replace the o-rings on their machine whether in warranty or not, whether a current problem (ie decreasing extraction pressure) or not. Its a latent defect - ie a design fault that they are addressing with a proper solution. You get your firmware upgraded at the same time - if you have an older model (at least thats what the guy from Sparky's @ Albion/Brisbane told me)

[geekylucas]

Stick with it,..the Silvia would not be easier for you to make good coffee.

Not suggesting that the Silvia is easier to use. I know the Silvia well as we had one at the office for a while (we now have a GS/3).

It's just that the Silvia seems like a machine I will more likely be able to take care of myself. Most things that go wrong with it are well known and easily dealt with. And it's easy to find good service when you need it.

I would recommend everyone with a BDB get Breville to replace the o-rings on their machine whether in warranty or not

Just to clarify, If I call Breville and tell them I want to pre-emptively have my BDB o-rings replaced will they happily book a free service in for me?

Some of the things you read on here about Breville's customer service and their attempts to replace busted o-rings... it just doesn't fill me with confidence.

[coolie21]

Just to clarify, If I call Breville and tell them I want to pre-emptively have my BDB o-rings replaced will they happily book a free service in for me?

Will watch replies with interest...