Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

[Duffybeers]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

I have just purchased a bes900 and after appx 15 extractions I have found the following:

Initially I was disappointed that I had lost the buttery texture that I was used to with my brasilia club, and the seemingly "flat" taste. However with a bit of tinkering and some experiments with temperature I found the following:

95 Slight burnt taste, very light and fluffy texture with minimal depth of flavour
94 Less body than 93 degrees, beginning to have fluffy texture, but very flat flavour
93 light body with some depth of flavour and smoother mouthfeel
92 better body, good depth of flavour and more of the buttery mouthfeel
91 same as above with hints of sourness

The other observations that I have had is that this machine is amazing for texturing milk, and supremely user friendly. I am hopeful that I will eventually be able to replicate the espresso that I have become used to.

Overall this is a great machine (and congrats to all involved), however there are three (very minor) things that niggle me so far

1) Auto start timer lacks the features that I would prefer (mainly that its a daily timer instead of a weekly timer)
2) The clip that holds the basket in the portafilter is too tight for my liking
3) There is no backflush insert and the cleaning disk seems insufficient for this purpose.

[nickoyang]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Its actually the Alex Duetto II (Mark III). The names getting long now, so most refer to the the Duetto III. Tank beep, tank cover and a few other things were added.

Thanks for the answers. I also learned that the MKIII model improved the fixture of the boilers to the chassis for safe shipping and US model wrapped insulator over the brew boiler to maintain the temp. Are these true for all 110V MKIII ?

Bonus- one less expensive part to have to replace if it goes bang. Experienced baristi watch their shots, so dont need volumetrics.

The volumetric based pulling control is very accurate on my BDB unit. I always can get 30ml shot within 38 sec to 42 sec by the 1 cup volume control. The extraction amazingly and consistently has "tiger striping" of crema in the cup.

Thanks

Nick OY

[citizen_smith]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Hi All,

Im looking to order some Cafetto from Coffeeparts to backflush my BDB with.

Besides price and the organic properties is there any real difference in terms of machine suitability or performance between the Evo organic and the cheaper Cafetto Espresso cleaner?

Thanks

[Yelta]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Hi All,

Im looking to order some Cafetto from Coffeeparts to backflush my BDB with.

Besides price and the organic properties is there any real difference in terms of machine suitability or performance between the Evo organic and the cheaper Cafetto Espresso cleaner?

Thanks

Never used the Cafetto Espresso cleaner, however EVO is a good product, does an excellent job and a 500 gram container used weekly will last you for ages.

[Courierdog]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Definetely, the current extraction quality of your BDB can be further improved up to those USD2500 Italian machines such VBM or Duetto 2 dual boilers.

Hmm...I struggled to get similar body regardless of tweaks...It is a good machine for the price though.

Duetto 2 takes 20 mins to reach the regulated temp

:-? Debatable...Our Alex Duetto III are up and with a hot group more rapidly than that- 8 minutes. Nevertheless, its best (as with the Breville) to give it time for everything to warm. The results are in the cup.

t has no auto power-on clock and almost cannot heat up the dual boilers in the same time for 110V AC power.

1. Easily fixed with the purchase of a timer from your local hardware shop

2. Thats why US models can operate on 15A or 20A (not that I care because Im not in the US)

It has no volume based shot controls.

Bonus- one less expensive part to have to replace if it goes bang. Experienced baristi watch their shots, so dont need volumetrics.

Its pre-infusion is purely manual type operation.

Factually incorrect. Might I suggest you do some research on e-61 anatomy and operation.

Its E-61 group head needs to cool flush before pulling a shot...

Nope. Wrong again....:

It may be best if you stick to what you know Nick. Have you had any significant hands on experience with a Duetto :-?

Too much of this information is incorrect and may mislead potential buyers. Our current stock of 230V Australian product is configured to happily run on 10A circuits in dual boiler simultaneous mode.

Nick OV
As to the internal piping on the BDB honestly believe Breville has the right idea by using the hi grade plastic piping as opposed to the copper piping as used in the Duetto for instance. The reason I suggest this is where there is a water quality issue the copper pipe really has a problem with scaling up very quickly where the piping as used by Breville takes much longer to scale up.
My self in Edmonton, AB, Canada we have several issues with our water quality, one the risk of Beaver Fever, (Guardia) very difficult to kill completely, the other is the water is exceptionally hard meaning scale build up and anything of a rubber nature such as tap washers eat through in about 6 months.
We can soften the water, removes the scale and hardness but not the potential parasite which is best removed by distillation. Many purists will say distilled water does not make good espresso. I prefer distilled as opposed to the risk. For the record the BDB does work with distilled water, contrary to any published documentation. I received my BDB unit 07-02-2012 and it has been working much better than any previous espresso machine we have ever had as far as the auto fill methods.
There are more plus points about the BDB than any other home espresso unit currently on the market.
Could it be improved, yes, however, and here is the caution, at what price to the design and at what cost to the consumer.
This is not to say Breville cannot do it.
My wife bought a pod machine about two years ago which I thought was a joke but compared to the other pod machines on the market it worked very well.
When the Reviews began about the BDB espresso machine at first I was very skeptical, how could a machine costing 1/3 that of the Italian equivalent produce such good espresso. The answer is simple Breville did not know it could not be done. LOL
I am enjoying this forum, keep the comments coming
Dave

[nickoyang]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

As to the internal piping on the BDB  honestly believe Breville has the right idea by using the hi grade plastic piping as opposed to the copper piping as used in the Duetto for instance.

As you mentioned, hi grade plastic piping is good for prevention of limescale. I have CC1 espresso machine whose teflon graded pipes are more stable for high temperatrure environment.

I also used cable ties to re-enforce the tightness of pipes connecting joins because I noticed the OPV hose clamp had slid away due to pumps vibration and caused decreased gauge reading. I think brass pipes, their joins and piping threads should be tighter and more durable. However, it can be improved as I did to my unit.

Thanks

Nick OY

[Courierdog]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Nick OY
I tried the CC! and to be blunt I was not impressed by the feel of the unit and again as with my Silvia it is a sequential unit.
I wanted the Dual Boiler ability and when I found what I could have with the BDB for its price when compared to the much more expensive Italian models. and if I wanted reliable service, ME, The options are few. Once the Breville makes the parts available so that the home mechanic can purchase the parts as required I do not think there will be many issues. It would be nice to obtain a service manual and a parts break down c/w part numbers.
The complex nature of the software is the only area which may pose any issue. the mechanics and layout are quite good. I would like to see more technical follow up however this machine was designed to be a toaster or tea kettle appliance and thus the support is based on that of an appliance as opposed to the typical espresso cultist device with secret hand shakes etc. LOL

[nickoyang]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

I would like to see more technical follow up however this machine was designed to be a toaster or tea kettle appliance and thus the support is based on that of an appliance as opposed to the typical espresso cultist device with secret hand shakes etc.

This is a crazy idea for Breville that BDB was designed as disposal kitchen appliance device just because of one or two replaceable parts cannot be renewed. Also, it is very strange that BDB cannot be de-scaled by users.

I would like to see Breville designs BDB machine with "saving our planet" in her mind.

Thanks

Nick OY

[Jonty]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

I would like to see more technical follow up however this machine was designed to be a toaster or tea kettle appliance and thus the support is based on that of an appliance as opposed to the typical espresso cultist device with secret hand shakes etc.

This is a crazy idea for Breville that BDB was designed as disposal kitchen appliance device just because of one or two replaceable parts cannot be renewed. Also, it is very strange that BDB cannot be de-scaled by users.

I would like to see Breville designs BDB machine with "saving our planet" in her mind.

Thanks

Nick OY

To sum it up, you get what you pay for & a targeted market, for which breville have done well. I can say I use a 800es but I have something very special on order, which is in the pointy end of the market...

[LaughingAtFate]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Much has been made of Brevilles statement that the BES900 is not able to be descaled by the standard user.

However, I wonder how many multi-boiler machines are able to be descaled by the layman who doesnt know what they are doing?

From what Phil has said, I am lead to understand that the task is not impossible, in fact, hes stated that its easier to descale the BDB then to adjust the OPV. Whether that is hyperbole or not, Can we PLEASE get off this tired old horse about "the end user isnt able to descale the machine" as being a reason to avoid this machine.

its simply not the case, Its just that Breville doesnt recommend that the average home user tinker with the machine. Not that its impossible to do so. :

[DavidW1960]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

its simply not the case, Its just that Breville doesnt recommend that the average home user tinker with the machine. Not that its impossible to do so.

+1. Its getting a bit ridiculous.

[specialpants]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

Can we PLEASE get off this tired old horse about "the end user isnt able to descale the machine" as being a reason to avoid this machine.

+1 also. Just enjoy the machine

if its like any other dual boiler out there, Im sure you can disconnect the water level probe to activate the water pump and flush everything out.

Just use the filters that they supply you with and make sure you change it every 2 months (assuming youre using tap water). Replacement filters only cost $30 for a years supply which is pretty fair.

On a different topic - does anyone know what the cleaning program is actually doing? It seems to be doing more than just building up pressure and flushing water through the 3 way valve.

Also, does anyone know whether using a blind filter for chemical backflushing (a metal one without a hole) is going to have adverse effects in the long run? I assume theres none seeing theres an OPV but I thought id check any way.

[nickoyang]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

its simply not the case, Its just that Breville doesnt recommend that the average home user tinker with the machine. Not that its impossible to do so.

I am asking Phil from Breville sent me a private message for the instructions to descale the BDB becauses my machine will not be serviced by Breville due to where I live. I will take the responsibility of descaling the BDB on my own and only need to know how a Breville engineer performs the descaling.

[oldbeamer2]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

I think its incredible that a brand new machine has been released into the market, and the worst that can be said about it is that the manufacturer doesnt recommend the end user de-scales it.

What an fantastic job Breville has done.

[nickoyang]

Re: Breville BES900 Dual Boiler - Owners thread

I think its incredible that a brand new machine has been released into the market, and the worst that can be said about it is that the manufacturer doesnt recommend the end user de-scales it.

If you recalled previous OPV re-calibration issue for some BDB units, you will realize that Breville may not be able to support and provide massive descaling services after three or four years. So what I claimed for service manual for descaling is sounded no matter how Breville thinks it is not good for mechanical dummies.

By that time, most of BDB machines have expired their warranty and some owner may dump the machine if the descaling cannot be done by any other local 3rd party technicians or by himself.