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Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

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  • Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

    Hi everyone,
    This is my first post here and after reading through post after post I think I have narrowed my choices down to the above 3 models. But first a little background information.
    I currently have a deceased Sunbeam Intuitive EM8910 Semi Automatic machine. It recently stopped heating, and then went on to trip the safety switch on shutdown. So i have decided to upgrade.
    My usage is as follows. I usually make a latte before work, and one in the afternoon. Weekends I will make my girlfriend a flat white as well.
    I will also make guests a drink ( the most I have done is 4 at a time so that fits in with the capabilities of the machines I am looking at)
    I generally use Merlo beans.
    So now to my questions. I am leaning to the Lelit . I understand that it has a slightly smaller boiler unit than the Silvia but have read that is slightly more user friendly which may help.
    Now my first question, is the PL41EMD worth the extra money over the standard PL41EM? Will the PID make a great difference for single pours? i.e making one coffee per session? Like I said I generally make one before and after work and will turn it off in between. Maybe on weekends I may leave it on through the day and the temperature stability will be more beneficial. My understanding is that you will get more consistent shots with the PID but is that more for regular shots?
    I know that there is PID kits available for the Silvia but how does adding one affect your warranty. I have seen them advertised with the PID as an addition but at $400+ again does the advantage out weigh the costs?
    My second question relates to start up times. As I said I make a coffee before work. Being that I start at 6am and dont really dawdle. From my research I have read that the Silvia takes about 20 minutes to get up to temp ( I assume the Lelits will be similar) Is this correct?
    I know a lot of people on here love the Silvia so any feed back on the Lelits would be most appreciated.
    I think either will be a significant upgrade on the EM8910.
    Thanks in advance.



  • #2
    Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

    PIDs in small boiler machines make a big difference to taste as when brewing a shot the boiler may fill and cause the temperature to drop.

    Unlike a PID the standard brew thermostat will let the temperature of the brew water drop considerably before engaging the element.

    My experience with my previous Silvia in which I installed a PID was significant.

    If you can afford the lelit with a PID I would recommend it as it may future proof against upgraditis.

    In addition you wont have to temp surf aiding user friendliness.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

      The PID will benefit any pour - whether its single, double, 2 in a row, 6th in a row, first after 6 hours of on time, or first cab off the rank!

      Basically without a PID, you dont know (unless you learn to be perceptive of the clicks, and surf a couple of times) exactly what the temperature of the boiler is. It will range from 80 - 95 or some similar numbers. By surfing you can find the point at which it is passing 94 (generalised optimum extraction temp) and extract then.

      With a PID, you just wait for it to warm up, wait for a bit of extra heat to infect the parts, and extract any time you want to. So Im told! 20 minutes is a good start up time for just about any machine from thermoblock to dual boiler, as it allows the group and pf to heat up as well.

      Just beware leaving it on all day since you need to make sure the boiler always has water in it. Either Lelit / Silvia will also require manual priming (filling the boiler) after every shot which your Sunbeam didnt need.

      HTH

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

        I dont know how anyone uses the Silvia without a PID. My mate has one and hes always complaining about working out the temp and he seems to throw out a few bad brews when Im there because thay are too cold. My Lelit with a PID is great fun even though the PID seems to be playing up somewhat - see my recent thread.

        To answer one of your questions - my Lelit gets up to temp in around 3 minutes but it hunts around a bit for the first 10 minutes (you can make a brew by watching the temp guage) so if you can give it 15 it settles really well.

        My next machine in a couple of years will have a PID and a boiler that I dont have to "baby" after every steam shot - but you get what you pay for.

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        • #5
          Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

          Originally posted by 5966677A6B636F600E0 link=1335326665/3#3 date=1335348690
          I dont know how anyone uses the Silvia without a PID. My mate has one and hes always complaining about working out the temp and he seems to throw out a few bad brews when Im there because thay are too cold.
          Whilst a PID may assist, it really isnt that hard.

          Let a heating cycle complete and then flush to reject steam. When you can no longer hear steam, you will be ready to roll.

          Hope that helps.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

            Thanks for the advice guys.
            So just to make sure I have it right, the PID wil regulate temperature much more accuratley than the thermostats ( i.e 1 degree vs 20 degree variation)
            So a machine with a PID wont pull a shot outside the set temp (within say 2-3 degrees) So it will be far more consistent without user intervention.
            As far as the warm up time, is there a way to Auto start these machines? Maybe a timer on the power outlet? I know that would work for turning it off (so avoiding leaving it on all day and the boiler running dry) but would it be able to start and therefore warm up ready for my early morning shot?
            I know this is probably asking a bit much but worth asking.
            So the other thing I have read is that the brew pressure and that 9 bar is optimum. I know the Lelits have a 9 bar OP valve but is this adjustable? The Silvia does if I am correct.
            I am leaning heavily to the PID Lelit... Althought that will scare the Mrs when I add a grinder, but hey short term pain long term gain!
            Which leads to the next question. Grinder.Hopefully I can get a package deal with whoever I decide to purchase off. What are your thoughts on the Lelit PL043?
            Thanks again.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

              Originally posted by 07323F380C103C35353636530 link=1335326665/4#4 date=1335350355
              it really isnt that hard.
              and yet it is for so many people!

              It also seems to be different if you catch the going-down or coming-up part of the cycle.

              Originally posted by 393267616163530 link=1335326665/5#5 date=1335351267
              is there a way to Auto start these machines? Maybe a timer on the power outlet?
              Thats the only way I know how to, but beware because just in case theres a problem with the water in the boiler or you forget to prime (or forget to turn the auto switch off for the next morning!). How soon do you like your coffee? I find theres enough time to stumble out of bed, fill and flick the switch, then start getting ready.

              I cant speak for all machines, I think these all have adjustable OPVs. Most sponsors will set this for you to around 9 bar anyway.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

                I leave for work at 5am and dont mess around in the mornings so when I was looking I considered a timer set up too. But seriously I dont think you need it. My lelit pid hits brew temp in about 2 mins but obviously longer is better. I just turn it on as soon as I get up, by the time Im ready to leave she is nice warm and stable.
                I cant comment on not having a pid but I certainly love mine, its nice to know that temp is spot on when hitting the brew switch. Once warm the temp at idle never varies by more than 1•c . I also find the temp readout useful when steaming to keep my method consistent. I guess it would be easy enough to surf using the light but if you can afford the pid its a nice feature.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

                  Ok thanks for clearing that up guys. Like so many things it seems its just a matter of working it into the routine of a morning.
                  Sounds like it heaps up quick enough it just takes that bit longer for the boiler temp to stabilise (from my readings)
                  Can I ask the guys with the Lelit what grinder you have paired with it?
                  And I am on the Gold Coast, does anyone know of a site sponsor nearby I could check it out and purchase?
                  Thanks again.
                  Justin

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

                    if you send a email to every site sponsor will get a copy an those who can help you will email or ring you back.

                    make sure to include details of what your looking for etc

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                    • #11
                      Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

                      Ok thanks for that.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Machine advice: Lelit PL41LEM, Lelit PL41LEMD or Rancilio Silvia

                        Ive got the Rocky grinder with my Lelit and have had no problems.

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