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Rancilio Sylvia vs Lelit PL41TEMD
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Lelit PL41LEM appears to have a 250ml boiler whereas the Silvia a 300ml boiler. Both are brass. That equates to a 20% larger boiler capacity on the Silvia. I imagine this would give a longer duration of steam if starting with a full boiler on both and possibly slightly better temperature stability (depending on boiler wall thickness etc).
The Lelit PL41LEM being completely Stainless Steel is a very nice feature. Rancilio should have done this with the Silvia after all this time.
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I was in the same boat as you recently and ended up getting a Lelit PL41LEM. Basically the same as a PL41TEMD but without a PID. Cost a bit more than a Sylvia but nowhere near double. I was umming and aahing and doing research and decided on the Lelit for a couple of reasons:
Apparently it's a bit more forgiving
Basket where you put the coffee in is apparently a bit better shaped
Completely stainless steel so wont rust
Slightly smaller and nicer looking
I got a heavy tamper with it, which I think this is a must for whatever machine you get.
Other than that I think they're much of a muchness.
Now that was less than two weeks ago. Lets just say I can use it without reading the manual, but compared to my usual daily Large FW from Campos near my work - I've got a while to go before I get there...Hoping I do!
My coffee's can be a bit hit and miss. Mostly hit though which is good. Sometimes the shot comes out within 10 seconds. Sometimes there's not even a drip for 10 seconds and then eventually it very slowly starts dripping out. I think maybe my biggest problem is my grinder - See I already had a Sunbeam Em048 and I plan to upgrade it one day when funds permit, but not in the near future so I'll stick with it for now.
Then again, I dont really know what I'm doing if I'm grinding too fine? Grinding too course? tamping down with too much pressure? I'm having fun learning though...
Cheers
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Re: Rancilio Sylvia vs Lelit PL41TEMD
I was in the same position a few years ago and in the end I ended with a Silvia and a k3t. I'm glad I did because on my next upgrade I know my grinder is up to scratch.
I used my Silvia with and without pid. Its not rocket science to temp surf. Installing a pid made things a bit more convenient but coffee tasted more or less the same.
Your biggest concern is how much milk drinks you plan to make at once. 2 is fine but more than that it gets annoying.
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Thanks for the advice guys. If most of you sat the PID and pressure gauge is not really necessary then that's good enough for me. Looks like I will be shopping for a Sylvia as soon as my Breville sells.
Cheers.
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Morning Bob, unless your a bit of a geek and like fiddling forget about PID's etc, totally unnecessary.Originally posted by 13bob View PostThanks, but now I'm more confused than ever....
The majority of Silvia owners (myself included) manage to make excellent coffee without the aid of a PID or similar, get to know the machine in it's standard out of the box form and all will be well.
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Basically , a digital temperature display.Originally posted by 13bob View PostHi Hildy, what is gronking? Sorry for the question.
But much simpler and cheaper now with the cheap digi thermometers available like these for $2 delivered !
Digital LCD Probe Fridge Freezer Thermometer Thermograph for Refrigerator 110
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Much is made of the difficulty of using single boiler machines. Some (most) of it is misinformation.
When unmodified, many require a cooling flush. It's simple. Let the machine come to top of temperature cycle and then operate the group until you you no longer hear steam. Lo and behold, you're then at optimum temperature to lock and shoot.
A PID removes the cooling flush and the need to use your ears, but will not miraculously produce better coffee. When used by a skilled operator, PID or no PID really makes little, if any difference.
The biggie with single boiler machines is learning to boiler prime and realising that they are good for 2-4 cups. Beyond that, you should sit on your hands, save a little more and look to a more convenient (pricier) option.
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Thanks, but now I'm more confused than ever....Originally posted by greengarden View Post
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Is having the pressure gauge a really good thing for the novice user? Without one, how will I know if I'm getting it right?
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Well, you see, a mummy Silvia and a daddy Silvia love each other very much, and ......
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Hi cafelotta, thanks heaps for all the advice. Being a novice really sucks!!Originally posted by CafeLotta View PostHi 13bob. Any new machine will take a little time to master. The Silvia is no different. The advantage is that so many people have gone through the process there is heaps of info out there to help you while your learning the new machine, including here on CS. No doubt you'll be going to some type of boiler machine from your current BES860 which is a thermocoil machine.
Biggest difference is that you need to understand that a small boiler machine needs to be looked after when steaming. You need to start with a full boiler before hitting the steam button and take care not to run it dry while steaming. When you're done you refill it straight away using the hot water button. The Silvia has a really good head of steam and will do a 2 cup jug comfortably as long as you start with a full boiler.
There are various opinions re: the need for PID on a machine but I would guess the majority of people with a Silvia don't have one. Temperature surfing is easy to learn and will give very good results without having to spend all that extra cash on PID. In the video below I think they use a 30 sec delay from when the boiler has heated until the thermostat cuts power to the heating element (light goes out). Varying this by 5 or 10 secs either way will help find what's best for the bean/grind you're using.
How to Temperature Surf on the Rancilio Silvia - YouTube
or with PID
Crew Review: Rancilio Silvia with Auber PID - YouTube
No matter what you get, you'll still need to master how to get the correct grind fineness and how to pack your filter basket correctly. The PID can help a bit with brew temperature but temperature surfing can get you there too. Steaming milk will be a case of learning the correct technique for the machine you are using.
The other good thing with the Silvia is they have a good resale value. They're well known and appear to be well respected.
i thought the Lelit might be more forgiving machine for a fairly newbie like me, and it also has the pressure gauge which I thought I might need to tell me when I had the right pressure instead of me guessing.... but from what you are saying the temp surfing thing is on the sylvia is not too difficult to learn.
i think also I need to be convinced that the Lelit is really head and shoulders above the Sylvia for me to fork out the extra $500 in price.
Cheers.Last edited by 13bob; 20 March 2013, 12:53 AM.
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