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Breville 870 never gains pressure, chronic under extractions, any ideas?
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It's not the way to do it Barbara. You are overdosing, and forcing coffee grounds into the internals of your machine.
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Thanks, aranala, as your advice worked with my brand new machine!
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I was commenting on my recent problem and how I solved it with the hope of helping others. That´s all.
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Originally posted by aranala View PostLike I said before, Try this:
Grind coffee fine, 2 positions from maximum.
Fill the port a filter 3/4 press hard without pushing against table. Top again high and press again almost to the rim. Clean the edges. Put in the lock. It has to be really tight.
I had problems before following this routine. Now the needle goes up more than half the arch and my espresso has a beautiful top of cream.
This machine, the BES870XL likes it really tight with coffee offering a lot of resistance.
Yeh...like you said before...4 hours before your current post......when you are replying to a post that is more than 2 years old. And you don't seem to have noted that lordmandrake's problem was effectively solved by using fresh beans (though his original machine was faulty).
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Aranala I feel that by having to overdose to get a result your happy with that your masking an issue.
my guess would be old beans or the grinder can’t grind fine enough. The numbers on a grinder are different for all grinder (ie1 on your machine may not equal 1 of other person machine) and as other said some grinders need to be re set using shins so can grind fine enough. Post 22 shows fresh vs stale beans result
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Pressure on the 870XL
Like I said before, Try this:
Grind coffee fine, 2 positions from maximum.
Fill the port a filter 3/4 press hard without pushing against table. Top again high and press again almost to the rim. Clean the edges. Put in the lock. It has to be really tight.
I had problems before following this routine. Now the needle goes up more than half the arch and my espresso has a beautiful top of cream.
This machine, the BES870XL likes it really tight with coffee offering a lot of resistance.
Originally posted by lordmandrake View PostThis is my 3rd espresso machine. I tried all the tips found in here from grind size/amount, tamped with the force of 1000 elephants, overflowing with fine grinds and the machine still gets zero pressure, the needle just barely moves.
I watched the Breville official video and his needle moves with almost no tamping pressure so I can't figure out what the issue is.
Breville has ignored all my support requests so I'm hoping for some help in here.
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I probably would if the cost wasn't so high ($35 + $14 postage) when I can get 6 blends and a single origin at a roaster 10 minutes drive from where I live and save postage.
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Sounds like a perfect reason to try a sample pack: CoffeeSnobs - BeanBay - Roasted Coffee - Roasted Sample Pack
Java "Roasted goodness" phile
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Just a follow up on what has happened since.
Breville replaced the machine after their test indicated something was wrong with either the pressure gauge and/or pump.
I had been using freshly roasted beans and still required a shim installed on the inbuilt grinder.
Anyway the new machine worked much better WITHOUT a shim requiring a coarser grind (higher number setting on the grinder).
BUT I recently ran out of the freshly roasted beans and in desperation loaded some Vittoria beans (from a supermarket). Guess what? Yes the pressure went down substantially and the extraction time was too fast. I needed to set the grinder to the finest grind.
I am now a convert but now need to find a blend or single origin roasted bean that I prefer.
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Point taken and I understand the reasons.
I guess what I was on about was the fact that Breville claimed that my (no pressure) problem was caused by not using freshly roasted beans and this is NOT mentioned anywhere in their literature.
Sure this (freshly roasted beans) did make a difference but I had to add a 0.4mm shim to enable me to grind at a setting 'higher' than 1 the finest setting (and still get a good coffee extraction.
I had asked in another post if ground coffee (ground with the grinder set to 1 the finest setting) should feel similar to prepackage ground pepper and was advised that it should feel FINER than prepackaged ground pepper.
Maybe I should have explained better and not used the word 'primary' (this was not the primary cause) - sorry.
There are numerous comments on the internet (including Youtube videos) posted by people who had to install shims to obtain a grind fine enough for espresso even when using freshly roasted beans. Breville tried to fob me off telling me that the (only) reason was because I wasn't using freshly roasted beans. Not once, initially, did they say that the grinder might require shimming. It took me many (wasted) hours to work this out including comparing (via tests using the same beans) my machine with my daughter's which is exactly the same.
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It absolutely does.Originally posted by jparnold View PostInitially I took it back to HN who contacted Breville and was told the low pressure was caused by not using freshly roasted coffee bean (I was using beans purchased at a supermarket).
This was NOT the primary cause and nowhere on the box or in the instructions does it state that freshnext of coffee bean roast can affect pressure.
Sure freshly roasted coffee beans can make a difference to pressure not in my case it was the inbuilt coffee grinder.
The extraction pressure is the direct result of resistance to flow through the puck - the two key factors here are:
A) how much of the area is available to flow through - which is largely determined by grind size/shape
B) viscosity - which is determined by what has been extracted into the water (which is affected by both coffee freshness and grind size).
The reason you have to grind finer with older coffee is, in part, to compensate for the reduction in viscosity.
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I too had this problem and I eventually found that it was caused by the grinder not grinding fine enough even on the finest setting.
Firstly note that the pressure gauge is not the only thing to indicate that the pressure is insufficient. Also the speed it takes for the coffee to be extracted is a good indication. Ideally it should take between 25 and 30 seconds for the extraction to complete (the time between when coffee starts to flow and when the pump turns off).
Correct grind, correct dosing (use the 'razor' to ensure it is correct until you get familiar with how to dose) and tamp method are also important to getting the extraction correct.
Initially I took it back to HN who contacted Breville and was told the low pressure was caused by not using freshly roasted coffee bean (I was using beans purchased at a supermarket).
This was NOT the primary cause and nowhere on the box or in the instructions does it state that freshnext of coffee bean roast can affect pressure.
Sure freshly roasted coffee beans can make a difference to pressure not in my case it was the inbuilt coffee grinder.
After purchasing some fresh ground coffee beans I still had to use grind setting 1 to obtain ideal pressure and extraction.
I contacted Breville again who then sent a shim kit for the grinder. I used one shim (the 0.4mm one) which was very easy to install and then was able to set the grind setting back to 3.
I feel that Breville has been treating me as a nuisance and as a company I am not impressed with them.
I have since found many places on the internet of other users having the same problem and having to fit a shim kit (free of charge).
Brickbats to Breville for treating me as they did and not having better quality control on their coffee machines.
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It's besides the point (as this is apparently the OPs third machine), but I disagree - a gauge doesn't necessarily aid learning, and actually seems to confuse a lot of people (the OP for example). On a machine with an OPV they are even less useful.Originally posted by Brevillista View PostIt may be superfluous to someone that knows what they're doing, however this guy is a beginner and the gauge is a great help on the learning curve.
Anyway the machine is not functioning properly and I wouldn't be satisfied with it.
I get the impression that this was a "new" machine purchased privately online, with no hope of warranty and no funds for repair; hence my comment.
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Just to chuck in my 2c,
When I first got my BES860 I had a similar problem with watery coffee no matter what.
Turns out it was the stale supplied beans that got chucked in as a freebie.
Get some freshly roasted beans, grind fine, and see if you can choke it.
Also, are you putting the cleaning disc in the single filter basket? It fits much more snug in there than the double.
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Ummm i would make sure you are operating it correctly first. When using the backflush disk, pulling a 'shot' of water and stopping it, do you hear (and see) water whoosh into the driptray?
If the gauge doesn't work and you can't get it replaced, it is not the end of the world. If analogies are your thing, its more like a RPM gauge in an automatic car rather than a speedo
Some think the pressure gauge is more of a distraction to the new learner, and indeed most of the medium end machines don't have one. My HX has a pressure gauge that sits at the same value regardless of flow. Going by 'time, look, and taste' is waaaay more important than an arbitrary pressure reading. Have a look at a few resources on the net: start with a consistent dose and tamp, then vary the grind until you get a shot in 30 +/- 5 seconds.
Javabeens question on what beans you are using is important... also what grinder do you have? You have a grinder, right?
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