Best machine under $1200

[Casa Espresso]

Best machine under $1200

Hey all,

Thanks for everyone's advice and help. Just thought Id update the thread for any future people who have the same needs by letting you know I ended up with the CIME 011. HX machine with E61 grouphead. Very nice looking machine and works well. Good price and for me I think it was better than a single boiler to give me instant milk frothing abilities. I am certainly now making the best coffees i have ever made at home and better than many cafes. Paired with the Baratza sette 270W its a good combo for my needs and budget and I highly recommend it. cheers again.

The CIME brand is certainly gaining admirers. Well priced, clever features and an E61 HX.

Your coffee is only going to get better as you become more accustomed to the machine and weight settings on your grinder.

Thanks again for your business

Cheers

Antony
www.casaespresso.com.au

[crazyjoe]

Hey all,

Thanks for everyone's advice and help. Just thought Id update the thread for any future people who have the same needs by letting you know I ended up with the CIME 011. HX machine with E61 grouphead. Very nice looking machine and works well. Good price and for me I think it was better than a single boiler to give me instant milk frothing abilities. I am certainly now making the best coffees i have ever made at home and better than many cafes. Paired with the Baratza sette 270W its a good combo for my needs and budget and I highly recommend it. cheers again.

[crazyjoe]

Don't forget to check out La Pavoni!

Great fun & you learn a lot.

will do. thank you!

[shortblackman]

Don't forget to check out La Pavoni!

Great fun & you learn a lot.

[crazyjoe]

Hi Crazy Joe

We supply the Oscar II and can fit the OPV pre purchase for you.

What many people do is to program the single shot for 60 seconds and then use it as manual stop/start button (if you want a manual shot) and program the second double shot button as a programmed dose. That way you get a manual and programed option.

An HX machine refers to how the heat/boiler/steam is configured. E61 refers to the type of group head manufactured by Faema. An E61 machine can have a single boiler, HX or dual boiler configuration.

As well as the Oscar II we have the new CIME 0011 which is an HX E61 machine compact. Exceptionally well priced https://www.casaespresso.com.au/cime-011.html

We have a few CS members who have purchase the CIME

Feel free to call me if needed.

Cheers

Antony
www.casaespresso.com.au

Thank Antony. I'll check out the Cime 011 and thanks for the info on the Oscar II. I might give you a call as theres a lot of options and the learning curve is steep on benefits of certain features vs other. cheers

[crazyjoe]

Its not an auto fill boiler. You treat it just like the Silvia. Prime the boiler at start-up, before steaming and especially after steaming. This is the same for any single boiler to ensure long element life.

No PID. The adjustable thermostat is very sensitive and when set to the correct temperature together with the 750ml boiler and E61 grouphead give very good temperature stability. This gives the Piccolo its own niche without spending the extra for a HX machine to get the same brewing performance.

As mentioned earlier, steaming is a case of hitting the steam switch after brewing and waiting a very short time for it to come up to steam temp. Similar procedure to the Silvia except more powerful steam. Not a big issue for 2 cups at a time. If you regularly made 4 or more then a HX machine would be more suited but you pay for the conveniance of instant steam both in complexity of the machine and price to purchase and service.

Many thanks. It does sound similar to the lelit, just with a better boiler. I guess it doesnt need a PID.

[Casa Espresso]

Thanks for this info. appreciate your insight! Just had a look at the Oscar II and it has some nice features and some features others dont have. In fact it does seem to have some good things like safety value, auto water filling (need to be plumbed or auto fill boiler?), water shortage indicator. This is all pretty confusing as it seems theres no perfect machine or more so that each machine has some things I want and not others and its hard to know whats the key ones until ive been using it for a while. I can get one for $1349 but I think id need to add an OPV for $200. It doesnt do manual shots only programmable shots which is a shame it doesnt do both. Not really clear on what the programmable buttons do. i guess you just need to experiment with the recipe and what time is best for the shots. Im not a fan of the aesthetic though or the plastic top but thats not the most important thing here.

Not sure how an HX compares with an E61 vs standard boiler on the lelit? I like how it does steam and brew at the same time though.

Hi Crazy Joe

We supply the Oscar II and can fit the OPV pre purchase for you.

What many people do is to program the single shot for 60 seconds and then use it as manual stop/start button (if you want a manual shot) and program the second double shot button as a programmed dose. That way you get a manual and programed option.

An HX machine refers to how the heat/boiler/steam is configured. E61 refers to the type of group head manufactured by Faema. An E61 machine can have a single boiler, HX or dual boiler configuration.

As well as the Oscar II we have the new CIME 0011 which is an HX E61 machine compact. Exceptionally well priced https://www.casaespresso.com.au/cime-011.html

We have a few CS members who have purchase the CIME

Feel free to call me if needed.

Cheers

Antony
www.casaespresso.com.au

[CafeLotta]

is it an auto boiler fill machine? does it have a PID? 750ml boiler seems huge compared to the 250ml one on the lelit.

Is this machine more suited for espresso drinkers, not latte or flat white drinkers?

Its not an auto fill boiler. You treat it just like the Silvia. Prime the boiler at start-up, before steaming and especially after steaming. This is the same for any single boiler to ensure long element life.

No PID. The adjustable thermostat is very sensitive and when set to the correct temperature together with the 750ml boiler and E61 grouphead give very good temperature stability. This gives the Piccolo its own niche without spending the extra for a HX machine to get the same brewing performance.

As mentioned earlier, steaming is a case of hitting the steam switch after brewing and waiting a very short time for it to come up to steam temp. Similar procedure to the Silvia except more powerful steam. Not a big issue for 2 cups at a time. If you regularly made 4 or more then a HX machine would be more suited but you pay for the conveniance of instant steam both in complexity of the machine and price to purchase and service.

[crazyjoe]

Have a look at a Nuova Simonelli Oscar 2. Its under $1500, timed shot (not volumetric, timed) HX so can steam and pull shot at same time, loads of steam and 15-20 minute heat up time but if that’s an issue put it on a timer and issue solved. Mines on a timer for 6:30am so ready at 7am and then on and off a minute later at 6pm so if boiler needs to fill it does it when house is noisey not super quite.
Drip tray, top and rear are plastic and the look isn’t for everyone.
if can get an OPV installed when buying i’d say do it as made my Oscar 2 more consistent (or is that hid my flaws a bit!)

Thanks for this info. appreciate your insight! Just had a look at the Oscar II and it has some nice features and some features others dont have. In fact it does seem to have some good things like safety value, auto water filling (need to be plumbed or auto fill boiler?), water shortage indicator. This is all pretty confusing as it seems theres no perfect machine or more so that each machine has some things I want and not others and its hard to know whats the key ones until ive been using it for a while. I can get one for $1349 but I think id need to add an OPV for $200. It doesnt do manual shots only programmable shots which is a shame it doesnt do both. Not really clear on what the programmable buttons do. i guess you just need to experiment with the recipe and what time is best for the shots. Im not a fan of the aesthetic though or the plastic top but thats not the most important thing here.

Not sure how an HX compares with an E61 vs standard boiler on the lelit? I like how it does steam and brew at the same time though.

[crazyjoe]

You mentioned earlier that you have a fairly low usage and that you don't mind the idea of a single boiler. One option that may be worth considering is the Vibiemme Domobar Piccolo.

Site sponsor Coffee-A-Roma in Melbourne still have them listed at $1499 but have been showing out-of stock since before Christmas. At this price its a really good buy if still available.

https://www.coffee-a-roma.com.au/sto...r_Piccolo.html

The Piccolo is a single 750ml boiler with 1400 watt element for quick boiler heat-up and recovery. Its uses the same E61 group-head as all the Vibiemme domestic machines (Junior HX, Super and double boiler). A micro-switch cuts the pump if water in the reservoir falls too low. Stainless Steel body and frame and commercial quality components all make for good durability. Brew pressure gauge is installed. Included are 2 portafilters (use one for brewing and one for daily backflushing with water using a blind insert.) Spares are readily available and will be for a long time to come.

Having previously used the Silvia for a few years and now a Levetta (earlier Piccolo), the Vibiemme with the E61 definetly produces more consistent and I think higher quality coffee. It uses an adjustable remote thermostat with liquid filled capillary tubing to a sensor inside a sleeve immersed inside the boiler. The temperature deviation for these types of thermostats is only 4 degrees celcius (on-off-on) and they seem to be very responsive. If you observe E61 cold start heat-up times (30-40 mins) and always brew soon after the light goes out, brew temp will be consistent. I tend to run water through the group when the heating lamp initially goes out and then repeat 2 or 3 times after which let it stabilise for 5-10 mins. Seems to speed things up for me. As with most decent machines the OPV is adjustable to achieve the desired 9 bar pressure at the portafilter. The one down side is unlike the HX machines you need to wait a short to heat-up to steam like any single boiler but I find mine to be quick compared to the Silvia.

The Piccolo doesn't have an electronic black box to go wrong like higher end E61 HX machines. Compared to the Lelit PL41TEMD, any E61 will however require some extra maintenance such as lubrication and keeping an eye on scale build-up in the group-head, less so if filtered water is used. These are things you can learn to do yourself to save money but if you don't have the right tools, a couple extra may need to be bought.

Thanks for the info. appreciate the detail! It certainly does look like a good buy compared to prices at other stores. It looks in stock to me? I have a look at some reviews or comparisons so I can understand this type of machine as I must admit its a bit confusing and actually intimidating (price, pro aesthetics and it seems harder to use and maintain than say the lelit). I love the safety feature of cutting off power if I forget to fill the water up. is it an auto boiler fill machine? does it have a PID? 750ml boiler seems huge compared to the 250ml one on the lelit.

The start up time is pretty long at 30 - 40 min though. The extra maintenance is something to consider as lubrication, scale and standard backflushing seem a bit. Im scared that this kind of machine might require too much prior knowledge or experience for me? Might also be in instruction manual or maybe the store is helpful to explain it all (although they might not want home maintenance?).

Is this machine more suited for espresso drinkers, not latte or flat white drinkers?

Only issue is IF i can increase my budget to $1500, what else is now out there to consider too?

[crazyjoe]

Thanks Yelta. I had considered 2nd hand but decided against it as I dont know enough to ensure i get a good one although Id consider 2nd hand from a shop with a warranty. My grinder for eg was brand new, never used but had some scratches from shipping so was discounted.

[Mb21]

Have a look at a Nuova Simonelli Oscar 2. Its under $1500, timed shot (not volumetric, timed) HX so can steam and pull shotat same time, loads of steam and 15-20 minute heat up time but if that’s an issue put it on a timer and issue solved. Mines on a timer for 6:30am so ready at 7am and then on and off a minute later at 6pm so if boiler needs to fill it does it when house is noisey not super quite.
Drip tray, top and rear are plastic and the look isn’t for everyone.
if can get an OPV installed when buying i’d say do it as made my Oscar 2 more consistent (or is that hid my flaws a bit!)

[CafeLotta]

I assume your after E61 mention is because its certainly well over the $1200 mark? I believe they would be over $1500 too?

You mentioned earlier that you have a fairly low usage and that you don't mind the idea of a single boiler. One option that may be worth considering is the Vibiemme Domobar Piccolo.

Site sponsor Coffee-A-Roma in Melbourne still have them listed at $1499 but have been showing out-of stock since before Christmas. At this price its a really good buy if still available.

https://www.coffee-a-roma.com.au/sto...r_Piccolo.html

The Piccolo is a single 750ml boiler with 1400 watt element for quick boiler heat-up and recovery. Its uses the same E61 group-head as all the Vibiemme domestic machines (Junior HX, Super and double boiler). A micro-switch cuts the pump if water in the reservoir falls too low. Stainless Steel body and frame and commercial quality components all make for good durability. Brew pressure gauge is installed. Included are 2 portafilters (use one for brewing and one for daily backflushing with water using a blind insert.) Spares are readily available and will be for a long time to come.

Having previously used the Silvia for a few years and now a Levetta (earlier Piccolo), the Vibiemme with the E61 definetly produces more consistent and I think higher quality coffee. It uses an adjustable remote thermostat with liquid filled capillary tubing to a sensor inside a sleeve immersed inside the boiler. The temperature deviation for these types of thermostats is only 4 degrees celcius (on-off-on) and they seem to be very responsive. If you observe E61 cold start heat-up times (30-40 mins) and always brew soon after the light goes out, brew temp will be consistent. I tend to run water through the group when the heating lamp initially goes out and then repeat 2 or 3 times after which let it stabilise for 5-10 mins. Seems to speed things up for me. As with most decent machines the OPV is adjustable to achieve the desired 9 bar pressure at the portafilter. The one down side is unlike the HX machines you need to wait a short to heat-up to steam like any single boiler but I find mine to be quick compared to the Silvia.

The Piccolo doesn't have an electronic black box to go wrong like higher end E61 HX machines. Compared to the Lelit PL41TEMD, any E61 will however require some extra maintenance such as lubrication and keeping an eye on scale build-up in the group-head, less so if filtered water is used. These are things you can learn to do yourself to save money but if you don't have the right tools, a couple extra may need to be bought.

[Yelta]

I assume your after E61 mention is beacuse its certainly well over the $1200 mark? I believe they would be over $1500 too?

Not at all, the smile was simply intended as a pleasantry.

Your right though, a new E61 will be well over the budget you mention, have you contemplated second hand, some bargains come up from time to time in the for sale area of this forum, nothing wrong with a well maintained used machine.

[crazyjoe]

No laughs from me Joe, sounds very much like common sense.

Buy the best you can afford, you won't regret it in the long run, easier to use and longer lasting by far.

A good E61 machine would be an excellent choice for longevity.

I assume your after E61 mention is beacuse its certainly well over the $1200 mark? I believe they would be over $1500 too?