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Rocket Appartamento/Bezzera BZ10/Bezzera Magica

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  • #16
    Rocket Appartamento/Bezzera BZ10/Bezzera Magica

    Where are you based 850t?

    Are you able to get along to a site sponsor and check out the machines in person ?

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    • #17
      Originally posted by Casa Espresso View Post
      Hi Bert,

      Here is the link to the Strega mod and corresponding graphs. Note that the HX thermostat has been wound back slightly.

      The same system is used on the BZ10.

      Hopefully this explains things a bit better

      cheers

      Antony

      http://coffeesnobs.com.au/brewing-eq...ra-strega.html
      Thanks Anthony.

      Comment


      • #18
        Originally posted by Casa Espresso View Post

        We fit these to new machines and offer full factory warranty and are recognised by the Bezzera distributor in Australia.

        Antony
        Antony, as OP in HK, presume warranty won't be offered on any mods?

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        • #19
          Originally posted by Di_Bartoli View Post
          Antony, as OP in HK, presume warranty won't be offered on any mods?
          Hi Offra,

          I cant see where there is a mention the OP is in HK. Did I miss part of the thread?

          However if they are in HK the best advice, whatever machine they buy, is to purchase from a local reseller for ongoing support, service advice and parts.

          Cheers

          Antony

          Comment


          • #20
            Rocket Appartamento/Bezzera BZ10/Bezzera Magica

            Sorry guys, I am located in Hong Kong and I am looking for advice as this two brands are the only ones that have formal authorised dealer in HK and there's nothing for you to try out. You can just order through them. The coffee group is just not as flourish as you guys in Australia. You guys are so lucky to have such a knowledgeable group. Thank you

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            • #21
              Originally posted by 850t View Post
              Sorry guys, I am located in Hong Kong and I am looking for advice as this two brands are the only ones that have formal authorised dealer in HK and there's nothing for you to try out. You can just order through them. The coffee group is just not as flourish as you guys in Australia. You guys are so lucky to have such a knowledgeable group. Thank you
              The reality is both brands are well established and produce quality machines and both are going to produce great coffee with the right training.

              If I was you I would purchase from the importer you are feel most comfortable with. In the long run it is the seller that is going to give you best advice, support and back up.

              They are the ones that are going to help you get the best out of either machine.

              Cheers

              Antony

              Comment


              • #22
                Damn this thread. I thought I was set on the Rocket Appartamento and a Fausto. Now I'm heavily considering the Bezzera Magica, and maybe seeing how my rocky does with it.

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                • #23
                  Originally posted by K_Bean_Coffee
                  ....you seem to be at the point where you need to see the machines. Reading more threads doesn't always help - as you know
                  Yep. And calling the experts who can provide comprehensive non brand biased advise that's tailored to your culture. Sometimes that's more than enough to help you go over the line.

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                  • #24
                    Rocket Appartamento/Bezzera BZ10/Bezzera Magica

                    Originally posted by mentasm View Post
                    Damn this thread. I thought I was set on the Rocket Appartamento and a Fausto. Now I'm heavily considering the Bezzera Magica, and maybe seeing how my rocky does with it.
                    Hi mentasm,

                    Apologies for the long post in advanced. Might be helpful for others in the same boat:

                    The Bezzera Magica is sold in Australia as the Di Bartoli Magica and is exclusively distributed by Di Bartoli. Any reviews you'd either need to google it as Di Bartoli Magica or check directly our web site.

                    As for the Rocky, I'm at the opinion that there are no ultimate truths in coffee gear choosing, only what works for you. Most often than non, working out what works for you isn't straight forward and is best supported by a Pro who asks you the right questions for you to get some answers.

                    What do I mean? Here's an example.

                    When I read people's opinion that upgrading the Rocky wouldn't change results in the cup, I ask, to whom it wouldn't make a difference? To the one who drinks milky coffees, cares more about consistency than refinement, prioritizes easiness to complexity, is not in a rush while making coffee and happy to adjust constantly his routine? Then I'd agree (to a certain point).

                    Or are you a coffee aficionado who drinks sometimes blacks, makes a distinction between thin to full bodied coffee, recognizes fruity coffee from nuts and chocolate and always seeks balance and complexity? Maybe you just want to get the same flavors your barista achieved with the same beans or you're experimental, curious and seek constant improvement of your routine as well as educating your palate? Maybe you will roast one day at home, maybe you've got this one friend you wish to impress and he only drinks espresso. Then I wouldn't agree.

                    Why?

                    Because if you compare it to other doserless grinders around the $8k-$10k mark, the Rocky is:

                    1. Slow, and because of that it clumps up more than others, which if not dealt with, can easily lead to uneven extraction and anything from lack of balance to 'dirty' coffee. Both visually and tactile wise you will get an inferior coffee to what its potential is. But is it inferior to YOU? Can you taste the difference with milk? Maybe not. And can you tackle inconsistency in particles size? Yes you can to some degree and with training or the right advice.

                    2. A stepped Grinder with larger steps than other similar grinders in its range (ECA KA or Macap M2 for example). What does that mean? It means that it's easy to adjust as numbers provides clarity and repetition. BUT, if you aim at 25ml in 30sec or at that perception of what a good espresso is for you from the specific bean in the hopper, you may find that on 10 it goes quite fast, crema is pale in colour, body is a bit thin and it has no aftertaste. Setting it to 9 you find that it's too slow, quite dark, it's oily and the coffee tastes a bit bitter. What do you do? Adding milk solves the problem to many. But if you insist improving quality there is not much you can do with the grinder and you'd need to start looking at yourself which is always the hard part. Do I tamp harder? Put more coffee? Collapse half way? Is it my distribution? With little training and no patience deducting logical conclusions and being able to systematically apply incremental consistent adjustments to your routine, you end up being frustrated. Rings a bell?

                    3. A manual Grinder. If you don't use scale to weigh your grind (and few home users do), you end up having your eye judging dose level which will not support dose consistency, therefore will be open to variations and possible frustration. Adding milk might help..[emoji14] nothing that a good digital dosing Grinder cannot fix.

                    4. Requires 2 hands operation. Might look like an insignificant detail but those who upgrade tend to make the comment of not realizing how much more time they've saved juggling the grinder's operation with getting cups ready or purging, and how they finally get to spend more time with their guests than making coffee.
                    No, it doesn't make much difference in the cup but it surely makes a difference to the number 1 reason many bother with quality coffee at home and that's to share it with those we love.

                    And there's more..

                    Point is mentasm, use this wealth of knowledge which is a result of years working, training and collecting feedback from thousands of home baristas combined with our own intimate knowledge of coffee as a specialty roaster.

                    The truth for YOU and anyone else will always lie in the cross road between your culture and the very tiny details of the behavior of each appliance (not its specs). And you're not expected to figure it all out. You've got us and other sponsors to do that for you. We don't tell you a name of brand or model, we guide you to realize it yourself.

                    We do that every day, all day. Everyone is different, so each 'truth' is different. Allow us to help you finding your own truth, by phone, email, live chat, social media or in person.
                    And with the tool developed just for that:
                    http://bit.ly/DBquest

                    Ofra

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                    • #25
                      I've already had a few long chats with a few sponsors, Ofra made some good points about advantages of the Magica over the Appartamento which got me re-assessing things.

                      My Rocky is the doser model so the clumping is dealt with somewhat. I think my dosing technique is a bit different from others, but was taught to me on a barista course where I was able to take my machine and grinder in. I seem to get very consistent results when I pay attention to what I am doing. The wife and I drink espresso in the morning and my results are often on par with my fave cafe in the city using the same beans on a Kees Van der Westen Spirit.

                      I do kinda like the idea of being able to dial in my dose and not have to think about it as much every coffee. I also do take your point that the Rocky is slow. It is.

                      I guess I'll have to call up again and talk through magica v appartamento when Im ready to buy. The grinder will probably get done at some point. I guess there is no reason I have to do both at once. May as well see how the rocky holds up while I save further and upgrade when it feels right

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Rocket Appartamento/Bezzera BZ10/Bezzera Magica

                        Originally posted by mentasm View Post
                        I've already had a few long chats with a few sponsors
                        Have I had the pleasure, mentasm?

                        Originally posted by mentasm View Post
                        My Rocky is the doser model
                        That ofcourse changes things. The Doser behaves better with clumping but dose level consistency is certainly challenged as swiping rate varies subject to bean (SO vs Blend), roast level, humidity, age etc. Glad you feel you tamed the beast and that you're not bothered by constant need for chambers cleaning.

                        Originally posted by mentasm View Post
                        my dosing technique is a bit different from others
                        Is there a one true way of dosing? We'd love having you in for some free training with your new machine if in Sydney (or virtual if interstate). We work with you to cement a routine that is right BOTH for you and the results in the cup.

                        I didn't mention in my last post adjustment mechanism. If you do end up upgrading to a stepless, doserless and digital Grinder, you'd enjoy not only dose consistency and speed but perhaps more importantly, the ability to achieve smaller incremental changes in your particle size. That WILL impact your cup. And as you drink Espresso's, you will find with time it gives you better control over speed of pour, color, thickness of crema, balance, clarity, complexity and aftertaste.

                        Originally posted by mentasm View Post
                        guess there is no reason I have to do both at once
                        Budget? Most sponsors offer combo deals with major savings on a grinder if purchased with a machine.

                        It'll be a pleasure chatting when you're ready, mentasm.

                        Cheers, Ofra

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                        • #27
                          Yes, I believe we have talked on phone and via email/sms a few times. I had you take some pictures for me before christmas.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Originally posted by mentasm View Post
                            Yes, I believe we have talked on phone and via email/sms a few times. I had you take some pictures for me before christmas.
                            Hope you found it helpful [emoji4]

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