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  • Mattm14
    replied
    Originally posted by lovethesmellofcoffee View Post
    Long time lurker here looking currently at buying the 7000 (on sale at GG for $502) but would consider the 6910. Is your guy in Melbourne at all?
    Ariad not, he is in Newcastle NSW. Maybe there is Sunbem repairer in the Melbourne area that would do a similar deal?

    Leave a comment:


  • lovethesmellofcoffee
    replied
    Originally posted by Mattm14 View Post
    Not long after posing this question about finding a 6910 as a stand alone unit I had a conversation with my local Sunbeam reparirer (he runs a repair busiiness dedicated to Sunbeam appliances). He indicated that they now only sell the 6910 as a combo with the grinder BUT he could get the 6910 in and has sold them as separate units. Can't remember what he said he would charge but I think it was a reasonable price.
    Long time lurker here looking currently at buying the 7000 (on sale at GG for $502) but would consider the 6910. Is your guy in Melbourne at all?

    Leave a comment:


  • Mattm14
    replied
    Originally posted by Dave88 View Post
    I just went through this process and I was unable to buy a standalone EM6910 from any of the major retailers - only the combo option. That's what pushed me towards the EM7000. I paid $580 for it with a few little extras thrown in (descaler liquid and tablets and a seperate milk thermometer for the jug). That seems to be around the going rate at the moment[/LIST]
    Not long after posing this question about finding a 6910 as a stand alone unit I had a conversation with my local Sunbeam reparirer (he runs a repair busiiness dedicated to Sunbeam appliances). He indicated that they now only sell the 6910 as a combo with the grinder BUT he could get the 6910 in and has sold them as separate units. Can't remember what he said he would charge but I think it was a reasonable price.

    Leave a comment:


  • Greenbeen
    replied
    Picked up the Sunbeam EM7000 today from JBHIFI for $399. Was a very last minute decision and they only had 1 left in stock. Now I need to find a grinder to go with it. Our previous Sunbeam coffee machine died last week (not sure of the model) and it was a total champ. We got 10 years out of that machine and it also cost $399. I'm yet to make a coffee with the EM7000 but my decision today was based on the number of positive reviews and praise I found on Google.

    Leave a comment:


  • Dave88
    replied
    • Is it still possible to purchase the 6910 as a stand alone unit - I seem to have only come across them paired with a grinder and I am very happy with my Rancillio Rocky grinder?
    • I just went through this process and I was unable to buy a standalone EM6910 from any of the major retailers - only the combo option. That's what pushed me towards the EM7000. I paid $580 for it with a few little extras thrown in (descaler liquid and tablets and a seperate milk thermometer for the jug). That seems to be around the going rate at the moment

    Leave a comment:


  • Mattm14
    replied
    Well the new seal is in place, along with a spacer made from hand cut out icecream container lid. Not sure I am going to stick with the spacer. It was quite difficult to get the screw that holds the screens in place to catch in the thread so I think that this suggests that there would be too much pressure from the screens onto the rubber seal which could assist in seal damage. It was also leaking a very slow dribble of clear water during the pour which may (or may not) be related to my DIY spacer. As the seal is new i think I might remove it. At least until the seal gets squished a bit and the whole thing gets loose again. I was a bit deflated last night I had high hopes all would be good so to see that little drop of water dribbling over the porta filter .

    Add to that the fact that when I was fiddling around and cleaning a few things on the machine yesterday I stuck the little pin thingy that Sunbeam supply for the purpose in the end of the steam wand. there was a bit of build up there but sticking that up the hole made it all clear again. Now the steam is back to making the noise I remember it making back in the early days but the quality of mico foam is just CRAP. Would I be correct in thinking that my action of making the hole larger by clearing out the build up has effectively diluted the intensity of the steam? Prior to this I had been getting some fairly decent quality microfoam.

    Leave a comment:


  • TampIt
    replied
    Originally posted by level3ninja View Post
    The answer to that question is always, always one of the following two options:

    A) "Yes."

    B) "No it'll be about $200 better and $1500 more fun, so it's a bargain really!"
    You made my day level3ninja. Well stated - applies to my audio upgrades as well (just add another zero after the $1,500, but keep the $200).

    Originally posted by LeroyC View Post
    If your group head and screen are in a bad way you might be out of luck, but I'd suggest giving them a really good scrub with steel wool or some sort of scourer to clean them up and smooth them off a bit then try your new seal without the spacer. I get the concept of a spacer, but it's a real band aid solution and sometimes it can cause more problems than it solves. One little tip I've got is to make sure the group handle is locked in properly when you use it. I've noticed on these sort of machines that use a soft silicone gasket that you don't always get a good seal first go. What I do with my EM6910 is I lock the portafilter in place firmly, but not too hard. Then I place my cup underneath, then I try to tighten the portafilter again. I don't go too crazy as I don't want to damage the collar, but I find that most of the time the gasket has a little bit more give and if I don't do this it sometimes leaks. I just fitted a new collar and I still need to follow this method as I'm using non-standard baskets. Might not work for you, but could be worth a try.
    Careful scrubbing can work wonders. Matt1m14 is correct - leave crap there and damage happens.
    As a minimum
    1) group head corrodes in the mild coffee acid
    2) coffee grounds act like grinding paste and destroy the seal.

    Keeping the coffee grounds out of that area means you are unlike to ever need to replace a seal (or need a spacer for that matter).

    Spacers: can be pretty permanent. The 1970 machine* I tamed needed a multi layer spacer under one of the groups. It was still in situ doing its job in 1987 when I last saw the machine. What wonder material was used? Three or four layers of card from either a cornflakes or weetbix packet cut to size by hand.

    TampIt


    *1970 machine: I used to joke that all 6 groups, p/fs and baskets were all made in different factories as nothing fitted properly - the only thing they had in common is that they were all made on a Monday morning. I started with a game of "mix and match" to get semi-compatible combinations. One group was so far out that I couldn't even match the height by grinding the p/f lugs - hence the spacer. In hindsight, I reckon they got two 3 group machines and whacked them together in a hurry... or maybe just manufactured the whole thing to the best mafiosi standard at the time. It still rates as the worst "big commercial" espresso machine I have ever encountered. I no longer name it as all their post 1980 ones I've seen have been made properly.

    Leave a comment:


  • LeroyC
    replied
    Originally posted by Mattm14 View Post
    Interesting you say that TampIt because this may have all been for nothing. Because I was getting sick of the old machine spitting water/coffee every time I attempted to pull a shot I took the group seal out this morning thinkning I was going to insert a spacer to compensate for my worn collar and the seal was stuffed. A bit surprising because it is not that old but it would seem that that is the source of my frustration. I picked up a new seal today and that will go on tonight along with a spacer just to be sure and with any luck the "old version" 6910 with live a little longer.

    It hasn't really all been for nothing. The researching has been interesting and also a good reality check for when I start dreaming about some lovely double boiler shiny Italian bit of machinenery (I note your comments about how big the budget would need to be to achieve a significantly better coffee. I can hear the Mrs now "is the coffee you make with that machine really going to be $1500 better?" ).

    My take home message from all of this is that really I am not going to find a significantly better machine that makes significantly better coffee in my budget. I will still be keeping an eye out for the next machine but it will probably be another 6910 or the 7000 and I will just have to get used to it.

    I have certainly been motivated to take better care of the existing 6910. In all honesty it rarly gets a descale *hangs head in shame* so it is a wonder it has lasted as long as it has. Maybe I got lucky and got a good one. When I took the screens off this morning to get at the group head seal they were pretty bad. I also suspect that my poor cleaning habits have been a contributing factor to the failing of the seal. The group head itself is VERY corroded and pitted. Can't be good for the seal to have to be pressing against that? I nearly took a photo to post here but then thought better of it .

    No doubt having just said how tollerant the old machine has been it will suffer a terminal event next week.

    Thanks to all of you for your input and advice.
    If your group head and screen are in a bad way you might be out of luck, but I'd suggest giving them a really good scrub with steel wool or some sort of scourer to clean them up and smooth them off a bit then try your new seal without the spacer. I get the concept of a spacer, but it's a real band aid solution and sometimes it can cause more problems than it solves. One little tip I've got is to make sure the group handle is locked in properly when you use it. I've noticed on these sort of machines that use a soft silicone gasket that you don't always get a good seal first go. What I do with my EM6910 is I lock the portafilter in place firmly, but not too hard. Then I place my cup underneath, then I try to tighten the portafilter again. I don't go too crazy as I don't want to damage the collar, but I find that most of the time the gasket has a little bit more give and if I don't do this it sometimes leaks. I just fitted a new collar and I still need to follow this method as I'm using non-standard baskets. Might not work for you, but could be worth a try.

    Leave a comment:


  • level3ninja
    replied
    Originally posted by Mattm14 View Post
    LOL I think I'll use that level3ninja
    Best part is I told my wife what I wrote and she laughed and said "I like it" so I may end up using it too!

    Leave a comment:


  • Mattm14
    replied
    Originally posted by level3ninja View Post
    The answer to that question is always, always one of the following two options:

    A) "Yes."

    B) "No it'll be about $200 better and $1500 more fun, so it's a bargain really!"
    LOL I think I'll use that level3ninja

    Leave a comment:


  • level3ninja
    replied
    Originally posted by Mattm14 View Post
    I can hear the Mrs now "is the coffee you make with that machine really going to be $1500 better?"
    The answer to that question is always, always one of the following two options:

    A) "Yes."

    B) "No it'll be about $200 better and $1500 more fun, so it's a bargain really!"

    Leave a comment:


  • Crema_Lad
    replied
    Originally posted by TampIt View Post
    Hey Crema_Lad

    Your sympathy is quite misplaced.

    SB do not make single boilers (and as for the "too small single boiler" machines I don't believe anyone else should either).

    Back to Mattm14 - the only sympathy he needs is the hard cold fact that a rock bottom minimum budget of $2k+ for a basic manual lever is the only way he will not go backwards. The semi-pro machines around $3k+ will not give him a better cuppa, so in semi autos he will have to go some way up market from there. Of course he can always do a big upgrade by picking up a Strada for a mere 20k+...

    TampIt
    Hey TampIt

    Yeah my bad referring to a single boiler SB, Think I got my threads crossed

    My sympathy however remains in that the OP had budget and size constraints that limited his upgrade path. Agree a 'true' u/grade will likely cost much more $$ and kitchen real estate than OP's current restrictions allow. (That can probably be said for many suffering from a case of upgraditis!!)

    A lot of interesting info btw, although I think I got a little lost in there somewhere and went to make a coffee

    Mattm14 - glad a bit of clean and repair job was all that was needed to start making great coffee again. And some lessons learned along the way, it's all good! Now that had to be one of the smallest and cheapest upgrade ever!! The WAF will be very high indeed

    Leave a comment:


  • Mattm14
    replied
    Originally posted by TampIt View Post
    Hey Crema_Lad

    My own personal comparison between the Breville DB and the SB "later 6910" / 7000 / 7100 based solely on the quality of the coffee - perhaps the DB by the slimmest of margins as it has a smidge more tolerance of stuff ups (although they vary a fair bit). Not enough of a "coffee difference" to overcome the extra cost & excessive warm up time of the DB. The earlier 6910 - trounces all of them by a wide enough margin to be significant - and yeah, they vary a bit too.

    Back to Mattm14 - the only sympathy he needs is the hard cold fact that a rock bottom minimum budget of $2k+ for a basic manual lever is the only way he will not go backwards. The semi-pro machines around $3k+ will not give him a better cuppa, so in semi autos he will have to go some way up market from there. Of course he can always do a big upgrade by picking up a Strada for a mere 20k+...

    TampIt
    Interesting you say that TampIt because this may have all been for nothing. Because I was getting sick of the old machine spitting water/coffee every time I attempted to pull a shot I took the group seal out this morning thinkning I was going to insert a spacer to compensate for my worn collar and the seal was stuffed. A bit surprising because it is not that old but it would seem that that is the source of my frustration. I picked up a new seal today and that will go on tonight along with a spacer just to be sure and with any luck the "old version" 6910 with live a little longer.

    It hasn't really all been for nothing. The researching has been interesting and also a good reality check for when I start dreaming about some lovely double boiler shiny Italian bit of machinenery (I note your comments about how big the budget would need to be to achieve a significantly better coffee. I can hear the Mrs now "is the coffee you make with that machine really going to be $1500 better?" ).

    My take home message from all of this is that really I am not going to find a significantly better machine that makes significantly better coffee in my budget. I will still be keeping an eye out for the next machine but it will probably be another 6910 or the 7000 and I will just have to get used to it.

    I have certainly been motivated to take better care of the existing 6910. In all honesty it rarly gets a descale *hangs head in shame* so it is a wonder it has lasted as long as it has. Maybe I got lucky and got a good one. When I took the screens off this morning to get at the group head seal they were pretty bad. I also suspect that my poor cleaning habits have been a contributing factor to the failing of the seal. The group head itself is VERY corroded and pitted. Can't be good for the seal to have to be pressing against that? I nearly took a photo to post here but then thought better of it .

    No doubt having just said how tollerant the old machine has been it will suffer a terminal event next week.

    Thanks to all of you for your input and advice.

    Leave a comment:


  • TampIt
    replied
    Originally posted by Crema_Lad View Post
    Bugger She needs to appreciate that for your coffee making abilities to expand so does the size of the machine, just a tad . And it's no wider than a toaster but produces something much better than toast

    I feel for you but after seeing the smaller single boiler Sunbeam I do see the size difference. It's gonna restrict your ability to get a machine with improved features vs get a new similar machine. Good Luck!!
    Hey Crema_Lad

    Your sympathy is quite misplaced.

    SB do not make single boilers (and as for the "too small single boiler" machines I don't believe anyone else should either).

    SB and Breville make a range of "toy thermoblock" machines which cannot possibly make a decent coffee. I don't believe anyone should make those things at all - ever. IMO they have set proper coffee back for years and they probably opened the door to pod machines. I keep hearing that Breville make a "proper thermoblock" model however I have never seen or played with one - or in fairness looked too hard I guess, it is not really on my to do list.

    For some bizarre reason thermoblocks are derided in CS circles (due to the toy ones mentioned above? Who knows?). Thermoblocks are actually widely used in chem labs (and some large scale manufacturing) to control temperature precisely & accurately - and they are a lot better at it than boilers. They have far less thermal lag and as long as they are sized and powered correctly they are also way more efficient in terms of power. Hence my "toy thermoblock" comment above - too small makes them completely useless.

    SB make the 6910+ machines with "proper twin thermoblocks" - they will make as good a simultaneous "coffee with frothed milk" as most low end commercial machines (and a few high end ones for that matter). They should - Paul Bassett (world barista champion at the time) got hold of SB's existing 6900 (not a particularly good machine), gave it a massive workover and got it up to standard circa 2006. I used to swap between a friend's cafe LM Linea (w the traditional "single nozzle milk wand", not the 4 nozzle) and the early 6910's fairly often. For a busy cafe the "far more tolerant to any grinding, dosing etc stuff ups" Linea wins hands down, for home save 10k-ish and get the "much less tolerant" 6910... Take your time and set the 6910 up well and the difference in the coffee is minimal - if there is any difference at all. I actually bought my own first 6910 based on my experience at the time (being flat broke immediately post USA divorce was another key factor - budget of "nil").

    BTW, the skills picked up using a 6910 are easily transferable to the mythical "traditional Italian commercial espresso machines" which is another reason I like them. Any small boiler machine (i.e. not just the "too small ones") needs a fairly different technique to make the jump.

    The other home issue is warm up time (and to an extent power consumption). I usually have a coffee about an hour after dawn and then a second cuppa around 6pm. Warm up time is critical unless you routinely leave the machine on all day (and in my case kill a 7000 steam thermostat every year or so doing it... the 6910 has no such issue). The 6910 / 7000 / 7100 warm up in <90 seconds. A quick preflush and the first proper coffee is started at the 2 minute point. They only heat up the water you need, not a whole boiler - which clearly wastes a hell of a lot of power. What about a decent sized twin boiler? My 2 group La Pav takes 35 minutes at 20 amps before you then preflush it and finally get to the point of using the machine - i.e. the first coffee. Admittedly after that the La Pav just pumps them out and is fairly tolerant of dosing / grinding issues but it is designed for cafe use and it shows.

    My own personal comparison between the Breville DB and the SB "later 6910" / 7000 / 7100 based solely on the quality of the coffee - perhaps the DB by the slimmest of margins as it has a smidge more tolerance of stuff ups (although they vary a fair bit). Not enough of a "coffee difference" to overcome the extra cost & excessive warm up time of the DB. The earlier 6910 - trounces all of them by a wide enough margin to be significant - and yeah, they vary a bit too.

    Back to Mattm14 - the only sympathy he needs is the hard cold fact that a rock bottom minimum budget of $2k+ for a basic manual lever is the only way he will not go backwards. The semi-pro machines around $3k+ will not give him a better cuppa, so in semi autos he will have to go some way up market from there. Of course he can always do a big upgrade by picking up a Strada for a mere 20k+...

    TampIt

    Leave a comment:


  • Crema_Lad
    replied
    Bugger She needs to appreciate that for your coffee making abilities to expand so does the size of the machine, just a tad . And it's no wider than a toaster but produces something much better than toast

    I feel for you but after seeing the smaller single boiler Sunbeam I do see the size difference. It's gonna restrict your ability to get a machine with improved features vs get a new similar machine. Good Luck!!

    Leave a comment:

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