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  • Busted Silvia... little help?

    Hi All,

    I took Miss Silvia on a family holdiay in January. She was doing great until the kettle and toaster were on at the same time and tripped the safety switch. Once the switch was reset, Little Miss slowly cooled down and wouldnt get hot again. I was hoping that it was just the safety thermostat that had come on, but when I opened her up the little red button hadnt popped out.

    Ive read quite a few forums to see if anyones had the same problem, and there are a few out there. Typically the problem seems to be the thermostats, which apparently you check with a multimeter. Im really hoping that it isnt the heating element, because that would be a bit pricey to fix. I did read somewhere that if the element is gone then white powdery stuff will come out with a blank shot.

    My multimeter off ebay arrived today, but Ive got no idea how to use it to check if the thermostats are ok. Ive done some googling, but to no avail. Can anyone help me please?

    Thx,
    Adrian

  • #2
    Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

    Triping your (home power supply?) safety switch is done when an appliance leaks electricity to earth -- very very dangerous and potentially fatal were it not for the safety switch.

    Make sure your machine is disconnected from the wall socket before using your multimeter.

    If you set your multimeter to read ohms, and place the red and black probes on the heating element terminals, it should read virtually zero, indicating no break in the element.


    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

      Sorry, Adrian, I was called away before finishing the post.

      When you re-set the safety switch, and tried to use the coffee machine again, did it trip? Maybe its the kettle which is at fault.

      If its the machine, once again, make sure the machine is unplugged from the power point before using your multi-meter.

      The element gets power via the on/off switch to the thermostat to the element.

      The thermostat wil only allow power to flow if the water is cold enough, so simply placing your probes across it wont tell you much.

      To see if theres a leakage to earth: place one probe on any metal part of the machine, and another on the switch terminal from the power cable (have the switch on but disconnected from the power pointl)

      If you get a zero reading from the multimeter, thats very bad news and you should take it to a repairer.

      Zero readings on the ohms setting mean zero resistance which mean no break in electricity flow. If thats the case from this test, electricity will flow straight to the case when switched on and thats lethal to touch.

      If you feel you dont understand the processes, best to skip all this and
      take a shortcut to the repairman.

      Hope this helps,
      Robusto

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

        Thanks Robusto, thats v. helpful.

        I dont think theres a problem with the machine leaking to earth. I might have lead you astray by saying it was a safety switch - perhaps it was just a resettable fuse that got overloaded? I thought all those sorts of things were called safety switches.

        Im fairly confident, b/c I did have the machine running immediately afterwards without it tripping again, plus I tried it again when I got home with no problems (apart from the heating up of course).

        I tried to get a reading off the switch as you suggested, but couldnt get anything at all off the wires going into it (the multimeter just showed 1). I did get a resistance off the power wire to the boiler though.

        In the other forum I read about a guy with the same problem, Im pretty sure he said that he checked the continuity of the thermostats and that they were no good. Do you know how I can do this? Does the machine need to be plugged in?

        Cheers,
        Adrian

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

          Gday Adrian,
          I apologise if the following instructions sounds overly simplistic, but I dont know your level of sparky skills.

          Make sure that you disconnect the power cord before doing any of the following, no live testing.
          Set your mulitmeter to a low ohms range.

          Looking at the top of the boiler youll see the 2 thermostats at the front of the boiler. Remove the wires from one of the thermostats (spade connectors) and then put one of the multimeter probes on each of the lugs on the thermostat.  You should get a very low reading, nearly zero. Replace the wires and then repeat the process for the other thermostat. With both readings being nearly zero, you can rule the thermostats out. If the reading is 1 on either thermostat, ( I assume that you have a digital multimeter) this means that particular thermostat is cactus. If both are OK, then onto the next step.
          Youll see the heater element connections on either side at the top middle area of the boiler. Remove the connectors from the boiler and put the multimeter probes on each lug of the element. You should get a reading of about 50 ohms. Again, a reading of 1 this time indicates that the element is cactus.
          Heres a link to the circuit diagram http://www.quiknet.com/frcn/Coffee/silviawire.html
          Hope this helps,
          Steve.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

            You could also try this site on re-setting tripped overheating thermostat:


            http://www.terrystockdale.com/coffee...ing_silvia.php


            Robusto

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

              Thanks guys.

              So this is bad then?


              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                Spewing!  :-[

                I always think tronics stuff is all smoke and mirrors and leave it to the experts. But even I can see that 1 is not the answer wanted.

                ..the computer says "nooo". Cough.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                  I gather you tried to re-set the overheating switch (the little red one on the side of the boiler just under the left-hand thermostat).

                  But unfortunately, "1" means a break in the circuit -- in this case, the heating element.

                  But before you write it off, touch the two probes together to make sure you get a zero reading -- that shows the meter and setting is ok.


                  Robusto

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                    I you guys mean well, but FFS a little information is a killer when playing with electrons and the paths they travel.

                    GET a sparky and may be he can teach you but do not go inside it with the POWER on. If you do your in breach of every Electricty Act there is...

                    AM

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                      Originally posted by AngerManagement link=1141116117/0#9 date=1141465479
                      I you guys mean well, but FFS  a little information is a killer when playing with  electrons .... do not go inside it with the POWER on.  
                      AM
                      all very true, its also what each of the guys offering advice said before anything else.

                      It does make me wince a time some of the advice Ive seen offered on other forums, eg  take the back off your CRT monitor to adjust focus pots, even with power disconnected those things have enough capacitance to blow you across the room if you short the wrong bits

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                        Absolutely correct. Which is why, if you read back through this post, cautionary advice has been given: TURN OFF POWER and unplug first and if you are not comfortable dont do it.

                        Robusto

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                          Do not want to get too far off topic, but even working on it with no power is only HALF the problem.. Problem is that this part is the Safe half.

                          1: Pluging it in and turning it on, with out having had it tested is in breach of the LAW, and
                          2: This is when you plug it in, turn it on and KILL yourself or someone else.

                          Please be careful... Been there done that, it is Not good and I do not wish the experience on any one!

                          PS. Safety switches do not cover you when your the load between Active and Netural.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                            Thanks for the warning AngerMan.

                            So does anyone know where I can go in Sydney (preferably inner city) to get her fixed? From what I read on Terry Stockdales site, this repair is going to be beyond an amatuer like myself.

                            Do any of the sponsors do repairs?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Busted Silvia... little help?

                              Dang,

                              After doing some searching I can see that the whole boiler is going to have to be replaced. After about 2000 they started welding the heating element into the boiler (presumably to stop the common leaking problem). That will up the price a bit.

                              I checked 1st-line and they only have the 110v version ($86US). coffeeparts.com.au dont list it on their site (as far as I can see) but Ill e-mail them and see if they can get it.

                              Any tips on where I can buy a new boiler?

                              Comment

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