Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

seasoning shot after backflush

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #31
    Re: seasoning shot after backflush

    I try to rememeber to use the caffetto weekly.
    I used to do it fortnightly but then had a look under the showerscreen one time and decided weekly would be better.

    Comment


    • #32
      Re: seasoning shot after backflush

      Originally posted by Thundergod link=1227410944/20#30 date=1227675507
      I try to rememeber to use the caffetto weekly.
      I used to do it fortnightly but then had a look under the showerscreen one time and decided weekly would be better.
      Same.

      Comment


      • #33
        Re: seasoning shot after backflush

        Luca,

        I don’t think anyone here is suggesting that it’s not necessary to regularly backflush with detergent. It’s just HOW frequent that is the question. MaxPower is suggesting to do it EVERY DAY, and that to me seems quite absurd for a home machine pulling like 2 double shots per day – that’s only like 2 shots and then needing to do chemical backflush, followed by another 2 shots, followed by another chemical backflush, etc...... – quite ridiculous and impractical for home use. Wouldn’t that amount of use do more harm than good? Doesn’t the 3-way valve require a film of coffee oil to keep it lubricated?

        If the showerscreen, etc is getting dirty, then of course clean it with detergent. But if it’s NOT dirty, if it’s still sparkling clean from the previous chemical clean a few days ago, why waste your time cleaning something that’s already clean?

        Comment


        • #34
          Re: seasoning shot after backflush

          To work out the frequency of detergent back flushing use your senses.  If you can taste it and / or see it stripping the crema then you should flush more frequently.

          Flushing (or backflushing) with plain water will help too - if done immediately after finishing a round of shots.  It leaves a little less residue to bake on.

          Also the detergent back flush doesnt remove all the residue - just the easier to remove residue which would find its way into the brew.

          Comment


          • #35
            Re: seasoning shot after backflush

            There are a lot of variables as to how often you should do a cleaning regime. The design of the machine, how you use it, and how often you use it also contribute to the possible answer.

            I try not to use detergent too often with the E-61 machine because it is hard on the internal moving parts of the brewhead. On the Silvia I used detergent more often because the 3-way passages are quite small and can become clogged more easily (or at least thats the way it seemed to me). .

            If you tend to updose and often get coffee all over the shower screen you probably need to clean more frequently. If you make two or three doubles a day, then cleaning with detergent once every two weeks is probably sufficient.

            backflushing with detergent is more effective for cleaning the parts you cannot access easily. It is not a replacement for removing the shower screen to clean the screen and brewhead areas. Just because you washed your hair in the shower does not mean that your underarms got cleaned.

            For those in need, I have instructions on removing the E-61 screen posted on my website in the How-To area. They include a simple animation and details that make it easy as well as getting it done without destroying the screen.

            Comment


            • #36
              Re: seasoning shot after backflush

              Coffee "oils" dont have any lubrication qualities...... other than for the coffee consumers tongue! ;D

              In the coffee machine they rapidly oxidise and form a tar like substance.... which gums things up..... and will eventually cause the 3 way to  stick.... All it really needs is water to lubricate the seals.

              I dont believe over chemical flushing will do any harm (other than very minor damage to your bank balance).... but infrequent chemical backflushing will taint your coffee and eventually gum up your machine...

              And because degradation in the taste is gradual.... you might not notice it as much as someone who hasnt had their taste buds slowly skewed by rancid coffee oils (like a visitor)... By the time you taste the off flavour..... it is probably too late! A better test would be to compare the taste before and after backflushing..... and if it tastes better after - you have waited too long :P

              Far better to err on the side of overuse than under use.....

              Comment


              • #37
                Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                Absolutely JB.... Fully support what Luca has written above too and experienced a similar outcome with one of my machines.

                Considering how cheap Espresso Clean is and how little time it takes, coupled with the guarantee that your coffee wont be tainted with rancid oils and tar, why on earth wouldnt you do it at least once a week? Doesnt matter how many shots you pull per day, its all part of the maintenance of your much loved hardware and its ability to keep pulling excellent coffee.

                Its all about the quality of whats in your cup, nothing else really matters and for mine, I dont want anything interfering with that.....

                Mal.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                  Originally posted by Mal link=1227410944/20#36 date=1227690736
                  Absolutely JB.... Fully support what Luca has written above too and experienced a similar outcome with one of my machines.

                  Considering how cheap Espresso Clean is and how little time it takes, coupled with the guarantee that your coffee wont be tainted with rancid oils and tar, why on earth wouldnt you do it at least once a week? Doesnt matter how many shots you pull per day, its all part of the maintenance of your much loved hardware and its ability to keep pulling excellent coffee.

                  Its all about the quality of whats in your cup, nothing else really matters and for mine, I dont want anything interfering with that.....

                  Mal.
                  I agree, however I had read elsewhere that overuse of chemical cleaner could damage your machine, and I wouldnt want to do that. Maybe that information is incorrect though.....

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                    I found on e61 that it makes the lever very "sticky" for about the first 5 shots afterwards. Not sure if that is doing damage, but it doesnt feel quite right. On my rancilio I would not be concerned flushing however often I like.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                      My understanding is that the lever has a small amount of food grade lubricant in there. When the coffee residue joins in, the lever gets progressivley looser. I went too long before a backflush when I first got my machine and found that it got so loose that the lever would jump out of the top position during a shot.

                      When I backflush mine, I get the same tightening up of the lever, but I figure it is all OK unless it actually feels like metal on metal, and then its time to take it apart and apply some grease (or appropriate product).

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                        I think the trick here is to clean it extremely like I do (everyday@end of the day) for a few weeks.

                        Then go back to doing it once a week.

                        You can always go up in quality easily, but its much more difficult to go down in quality.

                        Call it my two week challenge. lol

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                          I must admit that I looked at this a long time ago and was sure that someone with considerable experience told me that too much backflushing was worse than too little (ie particularly if the cleaning process is sufficient to keep the 3 way working properly and with regular mechanical cleaning behind the shower screen and of the dispersal block - it wasnt the cost of the detergent because its cheap, but rather the corrossive effects I was concerned about). The consensus now seems clearly to be the more the merrier, so I will go to once per week. Interestingly with my regime when I pull off the screens I see a pretty clean set up - I also never taste rancid coffee or bitterness. I always clean the screen with the still Palo brush after each shot whilst running a cup of water through, and then do a water backflush.

                          Cheers

                          PS. Learn somthing new every day hey

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                            Originally posted by ozscott link=1227410944/40#41 date=1227750950
                             Interestingly with my regime when I pull off the screens I see a pretty clean set up
                            Maybe cos youre spreading yourself thin over the 2 groups ;D

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                              good point matey

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Re: seasoning shot after backflush

                                Wow, it looks like there is a very diverse range of opinions on optimal intervals between backflushing.

                                I guess I will continue doing what I am doing, as it seems to me to give me my best taste. I may try reducing the amount of cafetto used though and see if there is a difference.

                                Comment

                                Working...
                                X