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Help with VST 15g, ECM Synch & Niche Zero - naked extractions

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  • Help with VST 15g, ECM Synch & Niche Zero - naked extractions

    I have recently delved into the realms of coffee and while i'm getting great tasting coffee, I think it can be (a lot) better. I've read HEAPS of threads with people having issues all over the internet so I'm going to attempt to give you all the info you guys need to help me troubleshoot my issues. I'm looking for that perfect naked extraction, and wondering what I'm doing wrong. These photos are of how I typically do it, to be as real as possible for you guys to see the flaws and help me identify how to improve.

    Equiptment
    - ECM Synchronika - 94 degrees
    - Niche Zero Grinder - set to extract 15g basket in 27 seconds from first drip
    - 15g VST basket
    - 58.5mm tamper (more like 58.4 measured)

    Process
    - Weigh beans
    - grind
    - light WDT with bamboo skewer
    - empty niche container into the PF
    - tap vertically once to help settle the grinds. I've done a few different things here like tip in slowly etc.
    - one thing I notice is I can't just level off as the grinds are slightly below the lip of the 15g basket

    Right, onto photos and video

    Click image for larger version

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  • #2
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    Comment


    • #3
      and here's the video of the extraction...



      and the extracted shot...


      Click image for larger version

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      Comment


      • #4
        what weight are you getting in the glass?
        I'm no expert, it seems to be flowing a little slowly??
        Cant fault the prep
        maybe the grind is a little fine?

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by flashpixx View Post
          what weight are you getting in the glass?
          I'm no expert, it seems to be flowing a little slowly??
          Cant fault the prep
          maybe the grind is a little fine?
          That one is a brew ration of 1.7. Seemed to taste good at that range to me. In the video the extraction was 25.7mls

          Comment


          • #6
            What "issues" are you having?


            If you are getting, in your words, "great tasting coffee" then what is the problem?

            I'd count my blessings and keep having that great tasting coffee.

            Comment


            • #7
              Nailing the distribution in the basket in the portafilter is key, yes stirring in the Niche cup helps but once it is tipped into the PF who knows how it is distributed in there. A few lightish angled bangs on the palm (see other posts - takes practice) helps for me, not just in identifying lack of evenness but also in relieving the unevenness problem. Good luck, your video looks good.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Sleeprequired View Post
                That one is a brew ration of 1.7. Seemed to taste good at that range to me. In the video the extraction was 25.7mls
                brew ratio refers to weight in => weight out ie the weight in 15g @ 1.7 would be 25g in your glass.

                From Five Senses:
                Simply put, the brew ratio is the relationship between the amount of dry coffee used (the dose) and the amount of coffee extracted (the yield).
                If you are getting 20g or less in the glass it might be an issue....

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by flashpixx View Post
                  brew ratio refers to weight in => weight out ie the weight in 15g @ 1.7 would be 25g in your glass.

                  From Five Senses:

                  If you are getting 20g or less in the glass it might be an issue....
                  yep so 15g in the basket and 25.7g out. 1:1.7

                  ive tried dosing down a touch and that seems to be helping. Tried exactly 15.0g and it was a much better looking pour. I’ll try to do another video @ 15g, but there’s only so much coffee one can handle lol

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by robusto View Post
                    What "issues" are you having?


                    If you are getting, in your words, "great tasting coffee" then what is the problem?

                    I'd count my blessings and keep having that great tasting coffee.
                    once I nail a great shot and can truly compare I’ll keep trying, but yeah the coffee is nice. I did. Also say I think it could be better. I like to learn, through practice and the benefit of others.

                    having said that I am enjoying the coffee ☕️

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Sleeprequired View Post
                      in 27 seconds from first drip
                      nope. start counting from when you start the pump.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by woodhouse View Post
                        nope. start counting from when you start the pump.
                        ah right. So 32-33 seconds. Generally getting the first drip around 6 seconds. Then trying to pick when it starts to blonde as well.

                        I must be watching too many videos as most say 25-30 seconds of extraction time.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by woodhouse View Post
                          nope. start counting from when you start the pump.
                          Yup. Nope.

                          Both right answers as is usual with coffee.

                          I've had lots of people including baristas tell me from first drip but not everyone agrees.

                          It is like with competition baskets that is what they are for and cafes. I still use mine sometimes.

                          Then if you use a competition basket do you go by their recommended weights?...or dose like I do to the top and smooth with finger as this involves no weighing and is quick and easy...and works?

                          One thing for sure the smaller the weights in the basket, the better your technique has to be and the more issues you may get. A lot of baristas overload competition baskets too and a lot of other baristas disagree with that.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Shot timing starts from the moment you use the brew button, lever or any other device to start the pump.

                            It does not start from when the first drip emerges from the portafilter.

                            In my experience the first drip comes about 6-7 seconds after I press the touchpad. So for a ballpark 30 seconds extraction, the pump keeps going for another 23-24 seconds.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by wattgn View Post
                              Yup. Nope.

                              Both right answers as is usual with coffee.

                              I've had lots of people including baristas tell me from first drip but not everyone agrees.

                              It is like with competition baskets that is what they are for and cafes. I still use mine sometimes.

                              Then if you use a competition basket do you go by their recommended weights?...or dose like I do to the top and smooth with finger as this involves no weighing and is quick and easy...and works?

                              One thing for sure the smaller the weights in the basket, the better your technique has to be and the more issues you may get. A lot of baristas overload competition baskets too and a lot of other baristas disagree with that.

                              yeah interesting. I tried the exact dose and got an improvement. I’ve got a leveller coming too to help with distribution IF it’s below the level of the basket. I’ll give grinding coarser s go and overdose to make levelling easier too. See how that goes.

                              Comment

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