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  • redzone121
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Originally posted by 17333A3A39390317332F31335C0 link=1233652993/9#9 date=1233790274
    The only way to stop overdosing is trial and error
    Every machine has a unique and corresponding depth level of the tamped puck
    You need to find that depth level in your filter basket and use it for all future reference

    You should aim for a hairs whisker of clearance
    KK

    Exactly KK

    I was surprised in the difference between beans also and the freshness too. We might be mad but we are in good company !
    CB ;D

    Leave a comment:


  • Koffee_Kosmo
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    The only way to stop overdosing is trial and error
    Every machine has a unique and corresponding depth level of the tamped puck
    You need to find that depth level in your filter basket and use it for all future reference

    You should aim for a hairs whisker of clearance
    KK

    Leave a comment:


  • hotshod
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    I also have been over dosing lately with my VBM ......

    So I have been dosing & tamping and a light polish....... Then dry the shower head about 3 times with a tea towel..... place 5cent piece in the middle of the PF , then quickly put the PF in the group for a second. Remove and check to see how much of an impression the shower has made on the 5 cent or pushed in right into the grinds.......

    5 cent measures just over a mm in thickness....

    loony stuff this espresso maddness...!!!!!!!

    Leave a comment:


  • Tony_Allwright
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Many thanks for the comments.
    Managed to make a black coffee for wife today which she said was ok. Not a huge complinent but, as a black coffee drinker, she knows all about bitter coffee from second rate cafes.
    Naked pf arrived today so will be trying the above tips tomorrow.

    I had noticed the same thing as Fringe Dweller re dosing directly into the pf. Two taps on the bench during the filling and then level off with a straight edge and pf was over full, puck touching the shower screen. Had to level off with a curved edge to get the correct dose when dosing directly into the pf. Started dosing into a small bowl to break up any lumps which fluffed the cofee a little. Then fill and level with straight edge and all was good.
    Tried TGs method and works well also.


    Tony


    Leave a comment:


  • gregpullman
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Originally posted by 073B263D373621343C37530 link=1233652993/4#4 date=1233714532
    Originally posted by 3124333126233A3A3B3738560 link=1233652993/3#3 date=1233708611
    Weighing would be a good idea as TG does
    Correction Greg...I said Ive weighed to prove that my measuring, using the basket, is reasonably consistant.

    You use two scoops, I use one LM double basket.
    I stand corrected! :-[ Thats what I get for reading too quickly!

    Leave a comment:


  • fringe_dweller
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Originally posted by 3A2F383A2D283131303C335D0 link=1233652993/3#3 date=1233708611
    Depending on the freshness of your beans, the consistency of distribution and the evenness of tamping, you may need to tweak some of those parameters.
    This is one area Im not so keen on with the M4D. The coffee comes out quite densely, so a standard dose is always below the rim of the pf (on my machine at least). Makes distribution a real pain.
    To overcome Ive started "fluffing" the grinds myself in a little porcelain cup and then adding them to the pf. I end up with a slight mound and a decent pour afterwards.

    Grant

    Leave a comment:


  • Thundergod
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Originally posted by 3124333126233A3A3B3738560 link=1233652993/3#3 date=1233708611
    Weighing would be a good idea as TG does
    Correction Greg...I said Ive weighed to prove that my measuring, using the basket, is reasonably consistant.

    You use two scoops, I use one LM double basket.

    Leave a comment:


  • gregpullman
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    I have the Minore 3 and a Mazzer Super Jolly so close enough for comparison.

    I put two scoops of beans into the grinder, start grinding and dose continually so each dosing sweep only removes a small amount of coffee. This helps the grinds getting to know each other too well and clump together. Once the PF is overfull all the way across the basket, I scrape the mound with the back of a knife back into the doser, then gently drop the bottom of the portafilter twice on the dosing forks to collapse the grinds. I then dose some of the just scraped grinds back into the PF and repeat this process. If theres not quite enough bean to do the job I pop a few more in. Weighing would be a good idea as TG does if I had scales of that resolution, but this works fine provided I keep the technique the same. Perhaps a bit of a slow process but it minimises wasteage. After that, a firm tamp with whichever tamper comes to hand (I have a flat Barista and a convex Deluxe at the moment). I havent had time to work out which shape works best in this setup thus far.

    This process ensures a evenly distributed, evenly tamped basket of coffee. Depending on the freshness of your beans, the consistency of distribution and the evenness of tamping, you may need to tweak some of those parameters. However ultimately its best to find a good technique, stick to it and adjust only the grinder.

    If this helps, the rule of thumb Ive found is that the pump should run for about 7-8 seconds before espresso starts coming out, and that should happen when the gauge gets to about 8 bar. Mine has been set to 9 bar at the group with a portafilter pressure gauge, which correlates to about 10 bar on the brew pressure gauge. In most cases it should be a slow pour, perhaps starting with some drips and then changing to a slow stream with a dark colour which gradually lightens as the pour progresses. You may see flecks of dark and light coming out, thats fine; but when you see a consistent stream of a lighter colour amidst the darker espresso, thats blonding; best to stop the shot there to prevent too much bitterness. Its a bit tricky with the standard Expobar spout; Ive got a set of spouts from a Synesso Cyncra which are nice and open, but the ones from the 6910 (which we sell through our site) are similar in design and no hole at the front so they do the same job, but arent as sturdy as the Synesso ones.

    Good luck!
    Greg

    Leave a comment:


  • Sink_cut
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Originally posted by 162D2C3B1D032E2E35302B252A36420 link=1233652993/0#0 date=1233652993

      Would like to hear how other expobar users dose their pfs.
    I initially had trouble with consistency when I first got my expobar but after a lot of experimenting with a naked PF I now follow what I believe is a very consistent and controllable method of dosing and  tamping.

    My B2 came with a plastic measuring scoop and crappy tamper. I have cut out a plastic cup to sit just in the top of my basket, this helps with mess  and  allows shakeing and settleing. Its sort of like a short wide funnel.
    - I put 3 scoops of beans into the throat of the grinder and sit the crappy tamper on  top and turn on the grinder
    - when the beans have finished crunching i turn off the grinder, lift the tamper and brush the throat.
    - I then pulse the grinder and then brush the grinds from the chute into the doser. I repeat this step untill the chute is still clean after a pulse
    - brush the adjusting screw in the doser
    - I run about 60 mm of water through my PF with basket in place (you can do this while your grinding)
    - I then wipe the basket dry with a cloth and sit my cut up cup on top
    - clack clack clack fast and hard untill all the grounds are in the PF
    -I then use a wooden skewer to vigorously and quickly fluff up grounds and remove any lumps. (WDT)
    -with plastic cup stll  on  shake gently forward/back left/right untill the top of  the  grounds is flat and even
    - tap  PF straight down TWICE, this is how you control your dose, (you would be suprised the differnce 1 tap more or less makes)
    - remove plastic cup and use the skewer to  level by chopping   forward and  back and left and right. This is what makes it the same dose each time. Do not push any coffee down as  this would be too hard to control, just chop it off. The  surface should be perfectly even and consistent. If there are Gaps in it you did not use enough coffee.
    - Tamp with a good fitting tamper.  (see below for more  detail)
    -flush another 30mm through  GH and then lock  in PF  and  pour shot
    -  tune  speed  of pour with grinder setting,  and tune dosing level by adjusting number of  taps (for single shot I use zero taps)

    This is a lot faster than it looks in print. It takes me about 45 seconds to prepare a shot this way. Longer than a cafe but perfectly  OK  for me  at home.


    Tamping,
    Experementing with the naked PF I found out that with the brewtus  I  was getting  a  doughnut shape appearing at the bottom of the basket before filling in. This is due to water running faster around the perimiter of the puck than it was through the center. To fix this I changed to a convex tamper (greg Pullman). When I tamp I use a "nutating" tamp. i.e. i  move the  tamper  around in  a circle at medium pressue before straightening up and  applying full pressue straight down. you  know you have gone too crazy with this when you see a reverse doghnut, so just go  round and round a little bit. When you do this you  can see the first brown liquid appear simultaneausly over the whole base of the basket


    Brew Pressue:
    I found my factory setting too high (14 with the blind/ 12 while pouring). I dont think these gauges are very accurate so youll have to evaluate your adjustment by taste.  I found a huge difference for the better when I dropped my pressure to 10.5 with blind basket (about 10 during the shot).  The shots tasted much better and the pours were more even and stayed darker longer. If you are having channeling problems, brew pressue (along with WDT) will make a huge difference.

    Have  you got a naked PF? I believe Its almost impossible to accurately evaluate your own technique without using one.


    Thanks

    David




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  • Thundergod
    replied
    Re: New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Originally posted by 506B6A7D5B45686873766D636C70040 link=1233652993/0#0 date=1233652993
    Would like to hear how other expobar users dose their pfs.
    I have an Expobar Leva and the Macap M5.

    Close enough for comaprisons by you.

    For quite some time now Ive been measuring my beans into a double basket, level with the top, feel the level with the palm of my hand.

    All that goes into the Macap comes out.
    To get it all out only takes a few extra seconds.
    After all the beans have been ground and the Macap goes almost silent, I switch off and dose about half from the doser.
    Tap the group handle to settle the grinds and dose the rest.
    Tap to settle again.
    There remains some grinds in the chute (finger guard was removed years ago).
    A paint brush (size 10 or 11) removes most of that and a quick burst of power blows out some more.
    At the same time you need to get the hang of puumping the hopper lid by using your fingers on the back toact as a hinge and flipping the lid up with your thumb.
    Your index finger exets the downward pressure and the resultant rush of air clears most of the chute, then one final brush.

    Make sure the motor has stopped spinning before brushing.

    Brush any grinds sitting on top of the hopper vanes and dose the remaining grinds.

    This all seems like a lot but with practice really only takes a few extra seconds.

    Final tap to collapse.
    Strike off any extra grinds with a straight edge (I use an old unused credit card).
    Tamp, polish, done.


    Now with the M4d you may need to vary what I do but I think if you can start with the same measuring technique and manage to get all the grinds out, youll be close to the right dose amount.

    Someone once suggested that their Expopbar needed about 20 to 21 gms IIRC so I measured my way first then weighed the beans and the result was damned close.

    I realise measuring by feeling with the flat of your hand will not be as exact as weighing every time, but its close enough for me and a lot faster.


    Leave a comment:


  • Tony_Allwright
    started a topic New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    New Minore 3 and macap m4d

    Greetings fellow snobs
    Have taken delivery of the above items today and spent the pm getting the feel of them. Was given an initial budget for this project by my darling wife, and with her involvement, ended up spending about that on the grinder and probably 3 times the initial amount overall. I know its goung to cost me down the track.

    Today was my first experience playing barista and the results were about what I had expected, was able to drink the later shots with milk.
    Using the double pf I found I was over filling it at the start and ended up trying various tupperware lids of differing diameter to level off the coffee to find an acceptable dose. Can now dose the pf without the puck touching the shower screen and have cut a piece of plastic card to that curve. Would like to hear how other expobar users dose their pfs.
    Have been trying to dial in the grinder, learn to tamp and use the machine all at the same time. Thats 3 variables and I havent been an espresso drinker so dont have a good reference for the end result.
    Have followed Chriss directions for dialing the grinder and started off a bit fine but think I have gone a bit coarse now. The puck is no longer comming out in one solid block and have noticed a little hole in the top of the puck. Channelling I presume? What causes channelling and what causes the puck to end up a bit wet.
    Have been using scales to check tamping weight, 15 kg, and the shot is taking about 20 + seconds for 60 ml.
    Have read a couple of threads on this site re grinding, tamping and filling the pf but would appreciate any comments before I have another go tomorrow.

    Tony
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