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Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

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  • Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

    Hi all,

    Theres two Boema Espresso machines coming up at an Auction, for which I will have a few hours to inspect soon.  Apart from that I dont know anything about them yet.

    Any Boema would be good to cure my upgraditis since Ive come to the limit of my Breville, and Im happy to put in a small amount of time servicing and changing seals, etc (Im capable at taking apart and making small mods, with some electronics experience, but dont want to completely rebuild the thing).

    I dont expect an evaluation since I dont even know what the machine is yet, but my question is this: what should I look for, given Ill have a few hours to inspect it and probably wont have the chance to turn it on (although I may be able to twist an arm there if I smile nicely).

    Also, to bring the wife on-side, what can I tell her about Boema usability and lifetime?  Will one of these machines last "forever" (if serviced & cleaned)?  She is quite happy with the Breville quality, so she wont be won over by the promise of better tasting coffee until she actually tastes it

    I really appreciate any quick help from the snobs!

    thanks,

    Iain.

  • #2
    Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

    Sorry but you are in a no win situation.  If the machines cant be inspected in working condition ( ie turned On & used) there is precious little you can check.

    To answer your other questions. Nothing wrong with a Bo-Ema machine. Just like everything else, if you specify the correct equipment for the application, it will do the job. When in good condition and set up properly, Bo-Emas work well. As you do not know the model, it is hard to say whether they will be small volume machines or medium volume machines (or high volume).

    That said the coffee made from a Bo-Ema in good working condition ( commercial HX)  cant help but be a trillion times better than that made by any small (domestic) machine, which is what you are asking I believe.

    When you inspect, take the lid off (if you can...suggest you take a normal and a phillips head screw driver although in most ccases the top plate screws have been lost years ago...).

    Look at the way the groups are fitted to the machine. If the groups are bolted to the chassis, and from there, individual copper pipes run to the boiler, then the machines may be worth picking up at the right price.

    If the groups are actually welded solid to the boiler...walk away. This type of Bo-Ema is older than Noahs ark and due to the groups actually being part of the boiler, they run far too hot and burn coffee to your hearts delight.

    Note older Bo_Emas do not enjoy the same quality of build as their european counterparts. Buying an old Boema is like buying a 15 yr old daihatsu charade..... Is this what you want? (apologies to old boema and daihatsu charade owners hehehe).

    Newer Bo-Emas are quite nice small volume machines!

    Be careful that reading what many coffee snobs get up to in their chosen hobby, doesnt influence you to take a bigger step than you can cope with.....you are a brave man frontig up to an auction to buy an old coffee machine.

    Suggest a better way is to pay more but buy a tangible, working machine from someone, that doesnt need work, and enjoy the coffee.

    Good luck,
    Attilio
    very first CS site sponsor  

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

      Originally posted by 4B7F687E65524E626B6B68680D0 link=1274333836/1#1 date=1274334649
      Be careful that reading what many coffee snobs get up to in their chosen hobby, doesnt influence you to take a bigger step than you can cope with.....you are a brave man frontig up to an auction to buy an old coffee machine.

      Suggest a better way is to pay more but buy a tangible, working machine from someone, that doesnt need work, and enjoy the coffee.
      While the whole post was great...

      Those last two par put it into perspective..

      What is good for one, may not be so palatable for another OR just outright bad.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

        Originally posted by 7B4F584E55627E525B5B58583D0 link=1274333836/1#1 date=1274334649
        Sorry but you are in a no win situation.  If the machines cant be inspected in working condition ( ie turned On & used) there is precious little you can check.
        If I could turn it on and put water in it, what would you suggest I check (apart from no obvious fountains in unexpected places!)?

        As you do not know the model, it is hard to say whether they will be small volume machines or medium volume machines (or high volume).
        I rang and asked for some info - the first Bo-Ema is a small 1 gp model, probably the 1 gp caffe by the sounds of it.  The second is a larger 1 gp model, with a few more dials and knobs, so it sounds like the 1gp Deluxe perhaps.  The lady was "not very good at describing things" in her own words, but I will of course check it out tomorrow, and take some photos.


        That said the coffee made from a Bo-Ema in good working condition ( commercial HX)  cant help but be a trillion times better than that made by any small (domestic) machine, which is what you are asking I believe.
        yes  I expected it to be better, which is why I dont want to pass up the opportunity to get a Bo-Ema IF all factors are good!

        When you inspect, take the lid off...
        Ill definitely check the group / boiler attachment, this is the sort of thing I wanted to know

        Note older Bo_Emas do not enjoy the same quality of build as their european counterparts. Buying an old Boema is like buying a 15 yr old daihatsu charade..... Is this what you want? (apologies to old boema and daihatsu charade owners hehehe).
        No, if it was that old I would probably leave it alone.

        Be careful that reading what many coffee snobs get up to in their chosen hobby, doesnt influence you to take a bigger step than you can cope with.....you are a brave man frontig up to an auction to buy an old coffee machine.

        Suggest a better way is to pay more but buy a tangible, working machine from someone, that doesnt need work, and enjoy the coffee.
        I understand that just because some people here have expensive machines, doesnt mean I need one too (or does it?!), but I am working my way (slowly) up the coffee snob ladder, and one day Id like to be able to roast, brew, and art!  I watch auctions regularly, and I understand the risk with buying duds, but I usually know more about the product than I do in this case.

        Hopefully with a bit of time, some good knowledge about the machine, and a little bit of luck I can snag a bargain.  Im also quite happy to walk away and look another day, but if the opportunity is there I dont want to miss it.

        Thanks for the advice, I really appreciate it

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

          Couple of potential traps you can avoid.

          Do they have pumps internally or not or do they come with one? If not add $150ish S/hand for one or $400ish new.

          General idea of how they were last treated is look at the shower screens for grot and under the baskets in the portafilters. Clean and tidy shows regular maintenance and hopfully a goer.

          If 2 group pay no more than $2-300, single groups will go for more due to the better WAF on the kitchen bench, not unusual to see them sell for $1k on evilbay :-/

          Factor in $2-300 service if you are not up to the job yourself and another $0-300 for parts (if you need an element, autofill etc). This may be $0 but to not buy with your eyes fully open is a bad thing.

          Caveat Emptor, there is a LOT of second hand machines available out there so walk away if it doesnt look good.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

            if they are 1 grps they may be 10amp machines and you might be lucky to just plug them in and turn on to test a little.....

            you then might be able to hear the pump run and if you quickly press buttons or switches you will at least know they "work" to some extent.

            if you turn them on and "nothing" at all happens then they might be DIA and be worth very little

            dont leave them on long, i normally would flick them on for about 5-10 secs waiting for the pump to fire up and at the same time try to get solenoids to "click" by pressing buttons etc. If the pump does not run at all when pressing the buttons (they normally just keep running if empty) then yes its more likely to have some issues.

            that said if with no water connected its very hard to test them to any extent.

            I have bought a few old machines as others have said $2-300 is maybe worth a punt but 1 grps often have unrealistic prices at auctions imo.... i would think that there are not a lot of chances to find them in Darwin so i would be going to the auction if i was there......

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

              personally I would probably avoid unless there is some assurance it all works. or buy it, but budget lots of money for repairs, and if you fix it yourself lots of time also. maybe have a look on coffeeparts and find out what some of the bits will cost you - they are not cheap, so while you pick up thmachine realy cheap it costs lots to repair.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

                Originally posted by 29252C212128440 link=1274333836/5#5 date=1274347650
                I have bought a few old machines as others have said $2-300 is maybe worth a punt but 1 grps often have unrealistic prices at auctions imo.... i would think that there are not a lot of chances to find them in Darwin so i would be going to the auction if i was there......
                AND

                Originally posted by 2621252A22283D2D2A23440 link=1274333836/4#4 date=1274338878
                Caveat Emptor, there is a LOT of second hand machines available out there so walk away if it doesnt look good.
                AND the following are very wise words; that a few of us need to reflect on at times...

                Originally posted by 023621372C1B072B22222121440 link=1274333836/1#1 date=1274334649
                Be careful that reading what many coffee snobs get up to in their chosen hobby, doesnt influence you to take a bigger step than you can cope with.....you are a brave man frontig up to an auction to buy an old coffee machine.

                Suggest a better way is to pay more but buy a tangible, working machine from someone, that doesnt need work, and enjoy the coffee.

                Further more..

                Originally posted by 2025292D252A75440 link=1274333836/6#6 date=1274348255
                but budget lots of money for repairs, and if you fix it yourself lots of time also.  maybe have a look on coffeeparts

                Coffee parts has a good range; but they do not cover every brand and only some things can be interchanged..

                While they do their best; they do not have a Tec that is across every piece of equipment out there and nor can they spend hrs searching and measuring and testing to see what may or may not suit....


                Baby steps... and move forward... No playing on the top stairs; before you can walk them...

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

                  I recently bought a second hand Bo ema, and I got it worked fine, as though I justed wanted to see what it was like inside the boiler, whilst doing so some of the bolts were well rusted, and the gasket also fell apart, so I found myself on the phone to Bo ema, next working day the parts were at my house, (Sydney to Outer Adelaide), good luck with your purchase.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Advice for Inspecting Bo-Ema at Auction tomorrow

                    OK, some good things to keep me thinking.  Ill tone down my faith in my own refurbishing ability a touch

                    So about the Bo-Ema itself - why are they so expensive new ($3k to $7k) but so cheap second hand?  Is this the way with all second hand machines or do people just not get rid of them until they are dead?

                    What Im really asking is how does a $3-7k Bo-Ema compare to $3-7k your-favourite-machine?  I dont see much mention of them here, so if theyre only an average machine I should probably be looking for a second-hand something-else!

                    I also checked out coffeeparts.com.au, but they dont seem to have any Bo-Ema parts at all.

                    Thanks guys, Ill inspect tomorrow better equipped  Ill take my camera, and get back to you tomorrow arvo!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

                      i would buy one if the price was right just to see how it went one has yet to appear in my shed..... but give it time

                      they are a bit of an ugly square box but..... and dont have a lot of style about them (much like my Brugentti)

                      Attilio has discussed the Ghead issue and i just think they get a bit of a bad rap in general and are often seen in places where the coffee might be below average. but well loved i reckon they would make great coffee

                      I am no expert but..... lol

                      go check em out, if any good go to auction day.... throw in a bid maybe ??

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

                        Originally posted by 0901090E0402600 link=1274333836/9#9 date=1274363478
                        So about the Bo-Ema itself - why are they so expensive new ($3k to $7k) but so cheap second hand?  Is this the way with all second hand machines or do people just not get rid of them until they are dead?

                        What Im really asking is how does a $3-7k Bo-Ema compare to $3-7k your-favourite-machine?  I dont see much mention of them here, so if theyre only an average machine I should probably be looking for a second-hand something-else!
                        Because businesses buy them and depreciate them over the first few years, then move on. At one stage (may still happen) coffee companies were giving away free new machines with contracts to supply coffee (which is why we save so much buying green ) so there was a supply of second hand machines spare.

                        I bought my Bo-Ema classic new some 10-12 years ago, get it serviced every 2 years or so, and it simply works every time. Had I spent the same $ on a consumer unit then, it would be in the bin by now! A mate bought a Giotto at the same time on the grounds that it looked better and still hasnt got a decent cup out of it.


                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

                          Originally posted by 2A21232C21322B213533400 link=1274333836/11#11 date=1274386314
                          coffee companies were giving away free new machines with contracts
                          ...and effectively selling those machines to their contracted clients in overpriced coffee and supplies....

                          Originally posted by 606B69666B78616B7F790A0 link=1274333836/11#11 date=1274386314
                          I spent the same $ on a consumer unit then, it would be in the bin by now!
                          A Sunbeam, yes....If youre referring to a good prosumer machine, sorry, but thats absolute rubbish.

                          Originally posted by 5952505F524158524640330 link=1274333836/11#11 date=1274386314
                          A mate bought a Giotto at the same time on the grounds that it looked better and still hasnt got a decent cup out of it.
                          Clearly, your mate needs to adjust the nut on the group handle :

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

                            Find out who the local Boema service agent is. (Their sticker might be on the machine). Sometimes these guys refurbish old machines and you can pick up a working, checked and operational machine for $1000-$1300, usually no more than 10 yrs old. They can also service the machine for you if you have major problems. All the advice above is excellent, and use it as a guide. The machines are solid and very easy to work on. Parts are available direct from Boema, and their service is very good.
                            Being built like a tank they will last for a long time, I have no regrets in buying one, and yes you can learn to make very good coffee on these machines ( no disrespect to any other machine, the topic is Boema).
                            If you can pick it up at a good price, budget $300 min for parts, just to be on the safe side.
                            Remember this is a commercial machine designed for lots of use, so all the parts are built accordingly, and have a good chunky feel to them.
                            As to prestige, doing a search on coffeesnobs will reveal some "surprising" owners of these machines. You either love them or hate them, but many seem to have a soft spot for them.
                            Best of luck, but do not get carried away with price, there are many units available second hand.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Advice for Inspecting Boema at Auction tomorrow

                              Originally posted by 7077626D60030 link=1274333836/13#13 date=1274393311
                              Find out who the local Boema service agent is. (Their sticker might be on the machine). Sometimes these guys refurbish old machines and you can pick up a working, checked  and operational machine for $1000-$1300, usually no more than 10 yrs old. They can also service the machine for you if you have major problems. All the advice above is excellent, and use it as a guide. The machines are solid and very easy to work on. Parts are available direct from Boema, and their service is very good.
                              Good call... Local if ya can... Build a relationship with the locals.. It is after all about community.

                              Originally posted by 7077626D60030 link=1274333836/13#13 date=1274393311
                              and yes you can learn to make very good coffee on these machines ( no disrespect to any other machine, the topic is Boema).
                              Some love to hate various machines / models / manufacturers etc etc

                              All too often a comment such as
                              Originally posted by 6962606F627168627670030 link=1274333836/11#11 date=1274386314
                              A mate bought a Giotto at the same time on the grounds that it looked better and still hasnt got a decent cup out of it.
                              And we all know that comes back to PEBFAG big time.. The crappiest most basic machine can make a good coffee... It is all about the operator and how they treat their raw components and teh machine.

                              A better built machine will never be a one size fits all... The operator has to take 90% plus of the responsibility for any shot..

                              Boema wre started and made where ?


                              iaindb - Ignore some of the tripe

                              As said previously along with others..

                              At the right price, with ya eyes open GO for it... Coffee is about the road trip and these little detours as to machines, is part of the journey.

                              If it was easy, you would never appreciate what in the cup. So get out there and report back... Pictures please if ya can.

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