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  • #16
    Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

    Originally posted by 232B333924400 link=1300016146/14#14 date=1301051670
    Hi Nader

    I think 9 Bar on the gauge will be too low.

    Scaced my friends one - pressure gauge on machine reads 12, Scace reads 10.

    You are potentially running as low as 7

    By the way, what does the sticker on the back say it is, Minore 3 or 4?
    Whooo That is a fair difference 2bar... When was the scace last checked ?

    And was that with a blind or flow ?

    My unit was so close that the difference was more about parallax error and gauge accuracy... I also cross checked with another standard pressure gauge and then a SB double floor basket..

    Originally posted by 0E21242532400 link=1300016146/13#13 date=1301032077
    Steam pressure came set at <1 bar, which Ive turned up to about 1.2 or so
    Be aware that you have just changed the temp profile of teh feed to the group boiler and this can have interesting effects... Remember the PID is displaying a calculated temp and not the group actual. So changes that effect heat transfer and the thermosypon effects will then be reflected in the head, but you may well not see it on the PID.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

      Originally posted by 767E666C71150 link=1300016146/14#14 date=1301051670
      Hi Nader

      I think 9 Bar on the gauge will be too low.

      Scaced my friends one - pressure gauge on machine reads 12, Scace reads 10.

      You are potentially running as low as 7

      By the way, what does the sticker on the back say it is, Minore 3 or 4?
      Ill check it with a scace when I can get my hands on one, but I dont think its that far off at all. I was pulling shots with my lever (previously tested with a scace) and at the same grind settings with the same coffee and same dose, the Minore is pulling shots at a very similar rate, whereas youd expect it to choke if it were running as low as 7 bar

      I can try post a photo tonight. It says MINORE III on the back though, not IV.

      Originally posted by 547B72706758747B74727078707B61150 link=1300016146/15#15 date=1301067386
      Be aware that you have just changed the temp profile of the feed to the group boiler and this can have interesting effects... Remember the PID is displaying a calculated temp and not the group actual. So changes that effect heat transfer and the thermosypon effects will then be reflected in the head, but you may well not see it on the PID.
      Thanks for the heads up. I dont think itll be that significant an effect. Ill keep it in mind though, if things start tasting a little different or if the inter shot consistency isnt there.

      Love how quick this thing heats up, compared to a two group Z9 Lever :P

      Does anyone know where I can get an accurate group temp probe that fits into that screw??? Id love to have a small readout there all the time...


      Cheers

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

        Originally posted by 7956535245370 link=1300016146/16#16 date=1301091237
        can try post a photo tonight. It says MINORE III on the back though, not IV.
        Mine is a Minor III but has no markings at all ?

        Originally posted by 7956535245370 link=1300016146/16#16 date=1301091237
        Does anyone know where I can get an accurate group temp probe that fits into that screw??? Id love to have a small readout there all the time...
        If you mean the alan head in the front of teh group ? Then there was a large number of posts and a home made kit or DIY on HB.

        The trick is getting the right temp probe and fittings that will seal and be responsive as in time and accuracy.

        If ya do, let us know what and how you go.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

          Does anyone know where I can get an accurate group temp probe that fits into that screw??? Id love to have a small readout there all the time...
          One of these ?  http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1260164655

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

            Originally posted by 537C7577605F737C7375777F777C66120 link=1300016146/15#15 date=1301067386
            Originally posted by 232B333924400 link=1300016146/14#14 date=1301051670
            Hi Nader

            I think 9 Bar on the gauge will be too low.

            Scaced my friends one - pressure gauge on machine reads 12, Scace reads 10.

            You are potentially running as low as 7

            By the way, what does the sticker on the back say it is, Minore 3 or 4?
            Whooo  That is a fair difference  2bar...  When was the scace last checked ?

            And was that with a blind or flow ? 


            The Scace is a Scace 2 and is about 3 weeks old.

            Scace 2 checks with flow.

            Get onto other forums and search and dig and you will find these offsets are quite common.

            More common though in HX a 2 bar differential. Dual boiler is expected to have a lower offset.

            Speaking to my engineering and metallurgy posse they werent surprised either due to the positioning of the gauge and thermal and fluid dynamics.

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

              Originally posted by 745B5E5F483A0 link=1300016146/13#13 date=1301032077
              Steam pressure came set at <1 bar, which Ive turned up to about 1.2 or so, and the pump pressure (with a blind filter) ramped itself up to about 13.5 bar   I quickly reduced that to a max of ~9 bar, which was then comfirmed as the max with a few test shots 
              Hi Nader,

              Its great youre happy with your machine.

              It really puzzles me though that there are so many resellers out there who think its appropriate to shift a box and take a margin without so much as a bench test.

              Its a 2 minute job on a Minore to set group pressure correctly and there is no excuse for apathy on behalf of a vendor.

              If you buy a car, you expect the mob who sold it to you to have diagnostic equipment and to know how to use it correctly and yet we let lazy vendors do absolutely nuthin

              Id be requesting some answers from bloke who sold it...

              You shouldnt have needed to do anything other than fill and use your machine. Send him an invoice!! :

              Chris

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                Originally posted by 17383D3C2B590 link=1300016146/16#16 date=1301091237
                Does anyone know where I can get an accurate group temp probe that fits into that screw??? Id love to have a small readout there all the time...
                Hi Nader,

                You can purchase the Group Head Temp Probe that Gra has from Eric Svendson in the US:

                erics@erols.com

                Hes a great bloke and retails the stainless steel probes for around $140 including UPS postage.

                If anyone else is interested we can get a better price if we buy a few at a time - happy to buy a few and pass on at cost - just let me know.

                Ive also got more detailed specs in pdf format - too big to post here - but if you PM me Im happy to forward it to you.

                Matt

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                  Originally posted by 7F0C0B3A0 link=1300016146/21#21 date=1301139061
                  Originally posted by 17383D3C2B590 link=1300016146/16#16 date=1301091237
                  Does anyone know where I can get an accurate group temp probe that fits into that screw??? Id love to have a small readout there all the time...
                  Hi Nader,

                  You can purchase the Group Head Temp Probe that Gra has from Eric Svendson in the US:

                  erics@erols.com

                  Hes a great bloke and retails the stainless steel probes for around $140 including UPS postage.

                  If anyone else is interested we can get a better price if we buy a few at a time - happy to buy a few and pass on at cost - just let me know.

                  Ive also got more detailed specs in pdf format - too big to post here - but if you PM me Im happy to forward it to you.

                  Matt
                  Yes there was some chatter about a number of options and was all in the link that Gra put up - Post # 18.

                  For thost that may not be aware The Brewtus (Expobar) Google newsgroup is worth keeping an eye on and can be found

                  here

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                    That probe that Gra has looks like exactly what Im after If others are keen to get their hands on one, then I think a group purchase would be a great idea 


                    Originally posted by 1E2B26211509252C2C2F2F4A0 link=1300016146/20#20 date=1301124885
                    Hi Nader,

                    Its great youre happy with your machine.

                    It really puzzles me though that there are so many resellers out there who think its appropriate to shift a box and take a margin without so much as a bench test.

                    Its a 2 minute job on a Minore to set group pressure correctly and there is no excuse for apathy on behalf of a vendor.

                    If you buy a car, you expect the mob who sold it to you to have diagnostic equipment and to know how to use it correctly and yet we let lazy vendors do absolutely nuthin

                    Id be requesting some answers from bloke who sold it...

                    You shouldnt have needed to do anything other than fill and use your machine. Send him an invoice!! Roll Eyes

                    Chris
                    Haha thanks for the concern mate, but the vendor is a good friend of mine, and I told him not to bother, because I wanted to do it myself. I love tinkering, and Id rather learn how to adjust these things myself, rather than have someone do it for me. The vendor offered to do it for me, but I was in too much of a hurry to get the machine home 

                    Been playing with different temps for different roast profiles and Im loving the difference it makes in the cup! Very keen on a temp probe though, to confirm temps etc...

                    Originally posted by 0B242D2F38072B242B2D2F272F243E4A0 link=1300016146/17#17 date=1301093893
                    Mine is a Minor III but has no markings at all ?
                    Is yours one of the new 2011 models? Mine only just got delivered on Friday, and had only been in the country for a week or so before that apparently.


                    Cheers

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                      Also, does anyone know if the steam tap can be rotated to face upwards? Ive got my hands on a Synesso Cool-Touch steam wand, and would love to retrofit it... Ive heard that the teflon lining in the wand is efficient enough to condense the steam before it exits, and hence it exits pretty wet. If I can rotate the tap to face upwards, Id be pretty keen to give it a go

                      Cheers

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                        Not the best photo...

                        N.B.

                        Gday "Nader"...... [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

                        Can you keep image size to a maximum of 800(W)x600(H) pixels (about 100KB) please mate? Larger images can slow down page loading considerably, especially for people with limited bandwidth connections.....

                        If you are unsure about how to easily resize your images,
                        this link will hopefully assist .

                        Thanks,
                        Mal.



                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                          Originally posted by 143B3E3F285A0 link=1300016146/23#23 date=1301193190
                          That probe that Gra has looks like exactly what Im after  If others are keen to get their hands on one, then I think a group purchase would be a great idea 
                          hey what is your main purpose in wanting that thermometer?

                          the reason I ask is that I bought one, but found it wasnt *quite* as useful as I hoped it would be.  I was having difficulty working out the cooling flushes on my HX machine (not something you need to worry about with a Minore) and hoped that thermometer would help to know what the machine was doing - I wanted to know how long to run the cooling flush and what the shot temps would be.   In the end I had more success with one of these digital multimeters, using the bead type TCs that is available for it - just loop it over the rim of the basket before you lock in the group handle - works good.

                          just to give you an idea... at idle, depending how long the machines been on for, or whether my air-conditioner is blowing across it or whatever, the thermometer might read 95 - 99 deg C.  Ill run a cooling flush (displayed temp goes up to 100 or 100.5 deg then slowly drops) until the hissing stops (after about 10 to 15 seconds as the temp drops below 99.9).  about 30 seconds later when I lock in the group handle it reads about 95.5.  start the shot (97-98) and it drops to about 94-95 by the end of the shot.  if Im making consecutive drinks, it hangs around the 93-95 mark until I start the second shot (back to ~97 as the shot starts again).
                          the digital multimeter during all that records temps in the basket at a steady 94-93 deg - doesnt really correspond at all with the grouphead thermometer, except that usually by the end of the shot the two devices are recording fairly close numbers.  you wouldnt run as high pressure on the Minore brew boiler as you do on a HX, so the numbers will be different to mine.  maybe on a DB machine the group thermometer will be better???

                          I still find it useful in a way - I can see at a glance if its fully warmed up and ready to go, but for recording shot temps, the digital multimeter was better, but even then it was a case of using it a few times to understand how it would run under different conditions (ie what its like with or without a cooling flush, temp of consecutive shots etc) and havent really touched it since. 

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                            Apologies for the image size, I uploaded from my phone, not realising that the forum maintains original image sizes :|

                            Originally posted by 577B7B647166222D47140 link=1300016146/26#26 date=1301273013
                            hey what is your main purpose in wanting that thermometer?
                            Yeah you have a good point... Ive got one of those bead type TCs and Ive used that technique before on my lever. I will probably just stick with that for now. Ill see how much the temp probe is though, and if its not too dear, then I wouldnt mind an extra bit of information, even if its just to tell me if the group has reached proper temps

                            On another note, I borrowed a makeshift Scace device this arvo and with the gauge on the Minore reading ~9 bar, the gauge on the group handle was reading about 9.5 :-? I was a bit confused, to say the least... The scace had only just been tested on a Synesso and seemed very accurate, so I was more than confused when I saw the slight offset was entirely different to what Id expected, especially based on previous observations of shots. Maybe Expobar calibrated it to make up for the offset?


                            Cheers,
                            Nader.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                              Originally posted by 5976737265170 link=1300016146/27#27 date=1301301737
                              On another note, I borrowed a makeshift Scace device this arvo and with the gauge on the Minore reading ~9 bar, the gauge on the group handle was reading about 9.5 :-? I was a bit confused, to say the least... The scace had only just been tested on a Synesso and seemed very accurate, so I was more than confused when I saw the slight offset was entirely different to what Id expected, especially based on previous observations of shots. Maybe Expobar calibrated it to make up for the offset?

                              Now that IS weird based on what we saw on our friends machine...

                              Didnt do any adjustment at the time, due to various constraints along with Expobar not telling you where the adjustment is  :-?, but will be playing with it this weekend.

                              Ill let you know what we come up with Nader.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Expobar Minore IV ?

                                Originally posted by 052A2F2E394B0 link=1300016146/27#27 date=1301301737
                                and if its not too dear, then I wouldnt mind an extra bit of information
                                pretty sure I paid about $140. its a very neat setup, fittings that fit perfectly, only takes a couple of minutes to install and looks very tidy

                                Comment

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