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Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

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  • Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

    Hi Guys,

    First post on the forums, ive been doing a bucklet load of research and noticing heaps of links coming back to CS. Ive also done alot of flicking through here, but again im sorry its another help me choose a machine thread.

    I am not biased, i wont ignore your assistance so please do offer assistance as long as its factual and not just because you love your own machine.

    Were looking at opening a small coffee bar in Brisbane. I have a fantastic head barista lined up, venue, and fitout starting this week ( fingers crossed ).

    I need a value for money 2 group machine. I am not brand specific, and looking at the budget probably looking for a refurbished machine. I appreciate good coffee, and need help getting the best machine for the budget around $3 - $5k if possible that will make great coffee, silky milk and is reliable. Were not a 500 cup cafe, will be small and ramped but looking at 100 - 200 cups per day over a 6 hour period.

    Any advice is much appreciated.

    I am getting mixed opinions, so very confused. I was recommended the Boema Cafe Caffe CC-2V15A and also a rancillio 2 group, but then have heard bad reviews as well.

    Been recommended the La Marzocco machines but again $10k for 2 group is just out of the question.

    In the area is coffee club and gloria jeans which imo takes like what i presume toilet water tastes like * no offense intended.. well not much. :P

    Any help, much appreciated. Obviously with any new business in the rope between cost v quality.

  • #2
    Re: Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

    Originally posted by 53544F5047350 link=1334638564/0#0 date=1334638564
    First post on the forums

    Originally posted by 53544F5047350 link=1334638564/0#0 date=1334638564
    as long as its factual and not just because you love your own machine.
    two quarters of coffeesnobs just sat down...

    Originally posted by 53544F5047350 link=1334638564/0#0 date=1334638564
    Were looking at opening a small coffee bar in Brisbane
    There goes the another quarter who only make it in their own homes...

    oh no, were loosing altitude fast! OK Im a bad joker, but what I hear the ex-sperts say in this situation is email the site sponsors with this address:

    stating your requirements and budget, and those that are interested will respond.

    A few sponsors will probably ask you to visit - go for it! Have a play, see their demo stock, find a good service agent, and tell us the address when youre open so we can all taste and comment Good luck!


    • #3
      Re: Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb


      Thanks a bunch for your comments. I didnt realise most of the demo here are for home... eek

      I;ll send an email now and hopefully get something back. Still interested to get any advice.


      • #4
        Re: Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

        well, I havent taken any statistics, theres probably quite a few non-sponsors who work as baristas, roasters, etc on here, but there are a lot of home users too. And using one machine at work is still different to supplying x machines for other people to work with.

        Id better not give any advice because Im one of the home-users but you will get some comments in the thread. I just happend to be first! (And Im in this part of the woods because I have an appropriately priced machine at home)

        Iain "posts too much" db


        • #5
          Re: Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

          Hello fazer and welcome.

          FWIW, you will need to be SUPER careful here as you are talking mission critical. No coffee = No business.

          Have you chosen a coffee supplier? If so, you should be speaking with them to see how they can assist. If not, the safest bet is to speak with a local company which can provide the level of support and service you require. Many old ex-cafe machines are just that- i.e. clapped out. As an example, there are plenty of old Rancilios out there which may still run, but crucify the coffee as they run stupidly hot. If its old it needs to be good. You need a machine and technicians you can trust.  :-?

          I also worry that funds may be very tight if you only have $3-5k for the machine? Whos paying the bills for the first 12-18 months which a business might take to turn a profit (if it does at all)?

          You may be better on a rent to buy scheme. These can be done with many of the majors and also mobs like silverchef et al.

          Once again, be careful.

          I drove past a cafe I used to own today. Sold it about 4 years ago to a bloke who sold it to a bloke who ran it into the ground. It was closed for a few months. New operator opened last week and was a no show today. Who knows what the reason was, but its not a good look. You dont want this to happen to you with dodgy equipment.

          Good luck!



          • #6
            Re: Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

            yes.....what Chris just wrote.

            And....what is your location?????????????????????????????????????????? ?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ?

            Buy / rent / lease a good current model machine and / or a reasonably late model machine that has been serviced back to proper operating condition by your coffee supplier or service agent, that they trust to do a good job for you to put their coffee through, and dont buy other peoples old rubbish especially on the private market. It isnt cost effective especially as with good turnover the equipment will pay for itself quickly on the basis of gross revenue returned VS raw cost of equipment *** see below.

            Think of the equipment as no more than a means to an end much the same as a vehicle is to a taxi driver, the only 2 pre requisites are that:
            a) must be capable of good performance;
            b) must be reliable in service 

            That will mean this topic is in the wrong section as you are firmly in the way above 3 thou end.

            ***from above:
            The Simplest Possible Example:

            Your figures, say 150 cups per day, say 5.5 days a week. That means 825 cups per week.

            825 cups x say $3.80 per cup = $3135 revenue / week from the coffee machine.

            So in the simplest possible calculation, your new $6300.00 coffee machine paid for itself in 2 weeks.

            Cost of raw materials:
            825 cups per week = roughly 9 kilos useage in this market.
            Say good coffee @ $28.00/kilo x 9 kg = $252.00
            Say milk / sugar = $350.00....whatever.

            Recalculated Weekly revenue from the machine then = $3135 less cost of raw materials @ roughly $600.00 = $2535.

            So incorporating the cost of raw materials only, the machine has now brought in the raw revenue to pay for itself (on the basis of a $6300.00 machine) in 2.5 weeks.

            And so it goes on the more complicated you want to make the calculation, the slower it is to pay for itself but really, however you justify the purchase price of a machine, there is little difference between a clapped out old banger at say 3 thou, and a nice fuss free new one at say around double.

            Always happy to talk about my nice new BFC machines off line 


            • #7
              Re: Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

              thanks for the responces.

              @Fresh_coffee thanks for the detailed responce. Just to clarify my budget up to around $5k was for a refurbished unit and only based on some of the entry models given so far in research.

              I guess i was more looking for suggestions on actual refurbished models to look for. Ive done all the financials.

              Thanks though.


              • #8
                Re: Recommended 2 group and grinder - new / refurb

                Rather than buy a reconditioned machine why not consider a brand new shiny La San Marco Liscia E, a newly released replacement for the legendary Preziosa line. With a body of chromed brass and internals built to last decades, I think it would be hard to beat this volumetric machine for value. It can be had for just a bit more than your stated budget at $5940. I have an LSM at home, one at my roastery and can say that they are pretty amazing machines. In any event... good luck with your search.