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Pressure(?) problem with Rocket Giotto

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  • Pressure(?) problem with Rocket Giotto

    Hi,

    I bought a Giotto ex-demo almost 2 years ago from a reputable snobs sponsor, and it's been great so far aside from eventually needing a pump replacement.

    I replaced the shower screen + seal a short while ago, and ever since then it seems to be losing extraction pressure through the drain valve at the bottom of the group. I worry that my "gentle persuasion" of the shower screen, when removing it, has done something but I honestly can't guess what it would be.

    The water isn't draining slowly, it is actually draining rather quickly and I think the brew pressure is degraded as a result.

    Any thoughts?


    Thanks

  • #2
    G'day shiny,

    Time to check and repair or replace the seals in the group valves.

    Sometimes the cam followers on the valves can be worn or the seals have had it.

    You will need to be prepared for new valves as the cam followers can break off when seal replacement is attempted.

    Cheers

    Chris

    Comment


    • #3
      Sounds to me like the lower valve and/or seal is gone. Parts are cheap and the E61 group is very simple to service at home. Site sponsors have the parts, I know DiBartoli does as I ordered some cam lever seals recently for my giotto. I recommend ensuring you get appropriate grease.

      I don't recommend regular chemical back-flushing of E61 machines. The coffee oils help lubricate the cam and valves. chem backflush results in squeeking metal-on-metal noises. If you do, ensure you re-lube.

      Speaking of giotto issues, my steam wand tap recently refused to work. just kept unscrewing. discovered the valve's c-clip had popped off. luckily easy to fix

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by JamesM View Post
        I don't recommend regular chemical back-flushing of E61 machines. The coffee oils help lubricate the cam and valves. chem backflush results in squeeking metal-on-metal noises. If you do, ensure you re-lube.
        Anyone who doesn't chemical backflush their machine drinks rancid shots. Coffee oils go off and they adhere to the internals of the group. We see the results every week.

        CS'ers, I can only recommend that you ignore this advice. We are here after all for coffee quality.

        Go easy on the backflush detergent and you will be fine. The service job is simple and quick. No way would I compromise my coffee with poor hygiene so as to avoid routine maintenance.

        Comment


        • #5
          Chris, I meant to say regular chem backflushes without re-lubing the E61. Obviously it strips all coffee oils and wear of the valves and cam is the result. I do a fortnightly chemical flush on my machine and it makes 1x shot on weekdays and about 3x shots per day on the weekend.

          Comment


          • #6
            For someone not confident in lubing the E61.. backflush all you like and have a reputable technician lube it for you every now and then

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
              Anyone who doesn't chemical backflush their machine drinks rancid shots. Coffee oils go off and they adhere to the internals of the group. We see the results every week.

              CS'ers, I can only recommend that you ignore this advice. We are here after all for coffee quality.

              Go easy on the backflush detergent and you will be fine. The service job is simple and quick. No way would I compromise my coffee with poor hygiene so as to avoid routine maintenance.
              Reading and asking around I have found/heard at least 6 different opinions on how often a chemical back-flush is required. What say you fine gentleman??

              Pete

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Pete39 View Post
                Reading and asking around I have found/heard at least 6 different opinions on how often a chemical back-flush is required. What say you fine gentleman??

                Pete
                Well I'm certainly no fine gentleman :-) but I CF fortnightly. Average of 2 shots per week day & 8 over the weekend. Seems to keep things in check.

                Steve.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Steve, sounds good. I guess everyone is different. I do a no-chem backflush far more regularly. Like Chris said, rancid coffee = bad.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Pete39 View Post
                    Reading and asking around I have found/heard at least 6 different opinions on how often a chemical back-flush is required. What say you fine gentleman??

                    Pete
                    Yeh, some time ago I did a similar search and found the same anti-consensus. I back-flush with water every day (after a quick once over with grouphead brush) until water in the blind filter is clear (usually only takes two or three flushes). Every 3-4 weeks I do a chemical backflush. Yes, this feels like it has de-lubed some parts, but this 'seems' to go away after a couple of coffees.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I use my machine (Rocket PP) 3 times per day every day and chemical flush every two weeks. With the chemical in I cycle it 5 times then wash out the blind filter and flush with 10 cycles with the blind filter on. I find that at about the tenth flush the handle movement seems to feel smooth and free through its whole travel. After each use I back flush with water only and cycle it three times. Again the handle movement appears smoother. As I am relatively new to the PP I am interested in what others find.

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                      • #12
                        Thanks for the tips, I'll give it a shot.

                        Cheers.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          After each use: once over with brush and water back flush 2 cycles

                          Fortnightly: chem back flush - do not follow instructions indicating a whole scoop of detergent as i doubt those instructions are meant for people like me who water back flush after each use

                          have not had any problems and more importantly i know my coffee isn't being tainted by anything hanging around from previous shots

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                          • #14
                            I water backflush every day and use chemical every couple of weeks or so.
                            I've lubed my cam a few times too, is there anything else requiring lube apart from the cam area?

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by JamesM View Post
                              Steve, sounds good. I guess everyone is different. I do a no-chem backflush far more regularly. Like Chris said, rancid coffee = bad.
                              OOps, my post may have been a bit misleading. I DO back flush after every "session" but flush with chemical fortnightly.

                              Steve.

                              Yes, rancid oils=bad coffee

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