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  • ECM Classika II PID

    ECM Classika II PID

    My coffee style is 45 ml double ristretto, no milk, twice to three times a day.
    This machine fits the capacity bill, seemed to cover off on quality, and also gave me confidence on temps with the PID.
    The PID switching to a timer when the lever is moved, got it across the line.

    Grinder is Breville BCG820.

    Day one review.
    Well packed and delivered from Jetblack Espresso. Box was well organised with accessories and was very well protected.


    Moving from the Sunbeam EM3600, initial shock was at the weight of the portafilters and size of the baskets.
    Turns out the doubles hold about 20grams of coffee (before tamping) and the Naked Portafilter basket is massive - I topped 24 grams before tamping - I have to assume its a triple.


    Jetblack go to good lengths to make sure you do it, and it was easy to fill the boiler with the supplied instructions.




    Pouring the shots once up and running was easy and did not take a lot of time. While I've briefly handled 58mm commercial portafilters before, these ones were so shiny and pretty it makes you cautious to bang them around too much.

    I was seriously contemplating IMS Competition Filters' showers screens and baskets, but seeing the ECM shower screen in actrion, Im not sure I need one. While it can be a little inconsistent, generally the screens is dripping dozens of streams of water at many locations. Looks good.



    Was a bit disappointing that the standard double portafilter does not sit straight in the grouphead and overshoots by a couple of degrees. I really expected this to be perfect.

    The naked portafilter conversely stops short by a couple of degrees. The two portafilters actually seem to be different sizes - the ECM Naked was an accessory. Again, I kinda expected this to be perfect.


    The PID controlled temperature out of the box was set to 94 degrees, and I assume Jetblack adjusted this from the 93 default from ECM. It was easy to adjust the temperature (which I did down to 92 immediately) and its simple to set.
    I note the confirmation of the chosen temperature was a little bit up in the air though. Leaving the menu without going through the steam temperature setting doesn't seem possible. You press minus to get back, but minus is also the button for getting to steam temperature setting. Maybe its just me.

    The timer is magic and I could not be more pleased. Moving the lever to full position kicks off the timer.
    The shot below is at about 50mls in this image.


    It's not the machine, but let me relay this experience, just to inform other noobs (like me).

    I just cant seem to get the grind right for this first couple of days. I have been perfecting my techniques for my previous machine for few months. But I noted that these beans have been extremely problematic since I bought them last week. Took me about 12 failed double shots before I got the good flavours from my old Sunbeam EM3600. These beans are called Exotic 7 - a blend of 7 Arabica's that seem to be freshly roasted due to the huge amount of foamy crema, but have been a hassle to dial in.

    My first two shots on the ECM with the naked portafilter were controlled with no spurts.

    But dwell time was low at only 4 seconds, and then I had 4 or 5 streams of rushy liquid for about 6 or 7 seconds - before it became a single stream. The single stream seemed to be pouring fast. Looking at the footage its actually about 30ml in 10seconds...

    But at 24 grams of coffee, on an adjusted (formerly known as Shimmed) Breville grinder on finest setting - that fast pour was a very worrying sign. The beans certainly have something to do with it, but I'll have to max out the Breville for this PF with this bean.
    After 8 pours over two days, things are not looking great. All shots so far have been black swill, with only one yesterday showing the some flavour about halfway through the cup, but only about 5mls of Caramel flavour, if you catch my drift.
    This is a worry because the sunbeam was able to produce 45ml of gold (with 5-10ml of crap foam on top) - the kind of viscous liquid that makes you want to tongue the glass after its finished. I can confirm no channelling - the tamps were level and grounds well distributed. Doesn't appear to be any issues there.



    One other problem I noticed, was that the twin spout portafilter seems to hold water. No matter how much I shake it out, angle it and otherwise "let it dry", there seems to always be water trapped in there somewhere. Again, I expect better than this, but Ill play a bit more to make sure its not user error. I do a pressurised rinse as well as wipe etc.


    The warm up time is fantastic. Claimed 300 seconds is close, and the recommended 600 seconds seems to be enough for the grouphead.
    Time to steam is about 1 minute, which is totally fine for me. If I choose to experiment with steam, it wont be a rush job anyway.


  • #2
    Re. portafilter position

    I think you'll find most portafilters sit like this in the grouphead - my previous Silvia and current ECM have the same locked position. Enjoy!

    Comment


    • #3
      Love the shot clock.
      Time for a new grinder [emoji12]

      Comment


      • #4
        For those interested, here is a terrible video of about 21g in the double (I removed the triple)

        Comment


        • #5
          Day three, and I'm loving the texture of the crema. Crema was never important to me before, although I always had plenty of it. The taste of it has no bitterness at all, no real flavour either to be honest. But the texture is luscious. So soft light and viscous. Amazing, fine and luxurious.

          On another note, The OPV is so important I've realised. Makes me rethink so much of my technique and over compensations I was making in the non OPV machine.

          Comment


          • #6
            By a weird twist of fate:

            The Jetblackespresso Precision Tamper is precisely the same weight as the ECM Naked portafilter with double basket!
            Very handy when weighing my grind and I forgot to zero out the scale.


            I have also recently seen some other e651 machines around, and am starting to really appreciate the quality of the ECM.
            From finish, to style, to details it strikes me as a higher quality machine, than say the smaller Isomacs and Vibiemmes.

            Comment


            • #7
              Nice post Holyfrog .... I am looking at picking up the same machine from Jetblack ... I will let you know how it goes.

              Comment


              • #8
                They are back in stock Bonsa. Call before dropping in because we were only getting a couple in:

                Jetblack Espresso Home Barista Centre

                charlie

                Comment


                • #9
                  Thank you for the review. It is or was good. Why I did not find it before? Could I ask other coffee snobs who have or had this ECM classika PID espresso machine to share their experience? Would be nice to have more info about this machine.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    ECM classika PID espresso machine owners, please, share your experience!

                    Dear Coffee Snobs, If anybody have or had any experience with ECM classika PID machine, could you, please, share your experience. This is a single boiler machine (need to refill boiler every time after using steam) designed in Germany (but manufactured in Italy???). This is the first puzzle for me. I bought this machine, looked everywhere, but could not find where it was actually made? I found the old (2014 short review on this machine), but nothing else. I am sure that many coffee snobs may have this machine.
                    Thank you very much for your reply in advance. Cheers

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I think you'll find it is built in Italy. There is not much in the way of user reviews for this machine on CoffeeSnobs at the moment. Hopefully your request might encourage a couple owners to share their thoughts.

                      You may have already seen this YouTube review from the USA on the 110V model but in case you haven't - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsZqSoQWC0I. Although it's a comparison review, you get a good look at what's inside the ECM Classika PID.

                      As with any Single Boiler, it's a good idea to refill the boiler immediately after steaming using the hot water button. Run enough through to bring temp down. If your only doing Espresso, It's a good idea to flush some water through when you switch on the machine and after brewing. Helps keep water fresh in the boiler and minimises any build up of undesirables inside the boiler (hopefully).

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by CafeLotta View Post
                        I think you'll find it is built in Italy. There is not much in the way of user reviews for this machine on CoffeeSnobs at the moment. Hopefully your request might encourage a couple owners to share their thoughts.

                        You may have already seen this YouTube review from the USA on the 110V model but in case you haven't - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AsZqSoQWC0I. Although it's a comparison review, you get a good look at what's inside the ECM Classika PID.

                        As with any Single Boiler, it's a good idea to refill the boiler immediately after steaming using the hot water button. Run enough through to bring temp down. If your only doing Espresso, It's a good idea to flush some water through when you switch on the machine and after brewing. Helps keep water fresh in the boiler and minimises any build up of undesirables inside the boiler (hopefully).
                        Dear CafeLotta,
                        Thank you very much for the reply. I've seen that video on youtube where they compare classika and BZ. Unfortunately, other video about classika on youtube are in different languages (French and German). Single boiler like classika is OK for me (I like black coffee without milk). At this stage I am enjoying good espresso shots with some consistent quality when I could get it. I have a lot to learn about making great espresso, because sometimes I could not get it right. Interesting to notice that ECM improved the portafilter handle and I have mine leveled in the flat table for easy tampering. The locked position (see video) of the portafilter improved as well (it is straight now). The only thing is not improved is the residual of water inside portafilter (as HolyFrog mentioned in his review in 2014):" One other problem I noticed, was that the twin spout portafilter seems to hold water. No matter how much I shake it out, angle it and otherwise "let it dry", there seems to always be water trapped in there somewhere. Again, I expect better than this, but Ill play a bit more to make sure its not user error. I do a pressurised rinse as well as wipe etc." He received a bottomless portafilter together with double one with the Classika in 2014. I did not. I am wondering why? May be Jetblack espresso company started to remove bottomless portafilters and sell them separately to increase the margin (price is A$ 129.00 in their web page)? I would like to ask Charlie about this, but would not like to be nasty with my questions.
                        Hope that current owners of classika may give some info. Do they have bottomless ECM portafilter together with standard one or not?

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by ilichev View Post
                          Dear CafeLotta,
                          Thank you very much for the reply. I've seen that video on youtube where they compare classika and BZ. Unfortunately, other video about classika on youtube are in different languages (French and German). Single boiler like classika is OK for me (I like black coffee without milk). At this stage I am enjoying good espresso shots with some consistent quality when I could get it. I have a lot to learn about making great espresso, because sometimes I could not get it right. Interesting to notice that ECM improved the portafilter handle and I have mine leveled in the flat table for easy tampering. The locked position (see video) of the portafilter improved as well (it is straight now). The only thing is not improved is the residual of water inside portafilter (as HolyFrog mentioned in his review in 2014):" One other problem I noticed, was that the twin spout portafilter seems to hold water. No matter how much I shake it out, angle it and otherwise "let it dry", there seems to always be water trapped in there somewhere. Again, I expect better than this, but Ill play a bit more to make sure its not user error. I do a pressurised rinse as well as wipe etc." He received a bottomless portafilter together with double one with the Classika in 2014. I did not. I am wondering why? May be Jetblack espresso company started to remove bottomless portafilters and sell them separately to increase the margin (price is A$ 129.00 in their web page)? I would like to ask Charlie about this, but would not like to be nasty with my questions.
                          Hope that current owners of classika may give some info. Do they have bottomless ECM portafilter together with standard one or not?
                          Illchev, not unusual for coffee machine companies, cars, etc to finetune the accessories to keep products competitive in their pricepoint. A machine for $1995 without naked portafilter could attract more interest than a price of $2130 with. This often happens due to fluctuations in the Aus dollar, there has been quite a bit of variation in the last few years. I am guessing English isn't your first language, you say you don't want to be nasty to Charlie but thought it ok to denigrate him on a public forum? I would consider a personal email more polite. You even put a dollar value on the 'taken' item, some detail on this percieved misdirected item. Their website doesn't mention an included naked portafilter, so why do you expect one? Jetblack isn't even the importer, but am sure the reason will be the importer adjusted their product offering. I genuinely hope Charlie sees this and responds, rather than others reading this thinking they take parts from machines.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Definitely no stealing of portafilters going on. We do open the box, prime and test the machine, make sure there are no blemishes, and everything is as it should be. Importers can usually specify inclusions and this can vary.

                            charlie

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by ilichev View Post
                              .................He received a bottomless portafilter together with double one with the Classika in 2014. I did not. I am wondering why?
                              If you check the ECM website listing, you'll see that ECM supply the Classika PID with 1 portafilter as standard. A bit miserly I would have thought for a machine of this quality/price, especially when a bottomless portafilter would be a useful tool for espresso lovers, who this machine is aimed at.

                              https://www.ecm.de/en/products/detai.../classika-pid/

                              In different markets, (especially the USA), there are differences in what is supplied probably due to a more competitive retail market. Its not uncommon in the USA for machines to come with a bottomless portafilter as well as a 2 year warranty. Here in Australia we usually get the bare minimum, with 1 year warranties the norm, making our coffee machines probably close to the most expensive in comparison to the rest of the world.
                              Last edited by CafeLotta; 11th June 2019, 12:41 PM. Reason: added quote

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