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  • New to midrange machines need some guidance

    Hi
    I've been trawling through the forums for about 10 days now. Still confused... So thought I'd just ask.

    I've had a Gaggia Classic for around 10 years and it's given good service. My work sent a group of us to do a barista training day (I'm really certified now haha) and from that I kind of figured out the limitations of the Gaggia I had, but was ok with it - would upgrade when it died. Well, the sky fell in last week. Gaggia died. RIP old friend.....

    The households coffee habit is pretty much Flat whites every day - around 4-6 coffee's per day. The occasional short black. I'd like a machine that I can improve my coffee making on - so an upgrade from the Classic is ideal. The calssic did take an age to froth the milk and left a little to be desired in the 'micro foam' area too so an upgrade there would be ideal. From reading the forums I'm starting to lean towards a dual boiler machine as I would rather avoid extended warm up times i tend to get up, put on the espresso machine, feed dogs, cook brekkie and make coffee with brekkie - so 30+min warm ups aren't really going to help my mornings

    I'm looking for a machine that will meet those needs and falls under the $2K price point.
    I was looking at the Lelit PL60 - then I read there are 2 versions of the PL60 one difference being the 57mm Vs 58mm group head. Not sure if this is a big deal for me or not.... but one of the form posts said something about the 57mm not being "standard". The Gaggia uses 58mm.

    The Profitec pro 300 caught my eye but the trip to Australia makes it pile on the dollars versus the rest of the world. $1500US to $2600AU - Is it worth the import hassle????

    So I guess my questions are:
    Is there a specific Lelit PL60 I should be looking at, if so which (and why)
    Is the Profitec pro 300 worth a look/importing
    Is there another machine(s) I should look at

    Thanks all

  • #2
    The HX warm-up issue can be negated with a cheap plug-in timer... if that is a suitable solution for you then you've just open your options up by a few dozen!

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    • #3
      Don't buy a lelit from the US. 110volt machines run very differently to 240v ones. Plenty of disappointed people trying to save a couple of hundred bucks.

      If the budget is tight you could wait for one to appear for sale on the forum. Some good buys had come through recently.

      A none e61 group will warm up faster than an e61 machine. But again nothing a wemo or similar timer wouldn't fix..

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      • #4
        Hi smudge,

        The warm-up time isn't necessarily quicker on a dual boiler versus a heat exchanger. It depends on other factors too like style of grouphead, boiler size, heating elements etc.

        Theres two versions of the Lelit PL60T. Version 1 has the 57mm group, a slightly smaller brew boiler, and different gauge. Version 2 has the 58mm grouphead.
        I've played with the PL60T V2 and it really is a great machine. Quick heatup, PID, small footprint and it steams really really well.

        You may also want to consider a heat exchanger like the Bezzera BZ10. It has a grouphead which is heated via elements (as opposed to hot water like e61 thermosiphon) so it's got a quicker heatup time versus other e61 group machines. It's also around your budget of $2K.

        The Profitec Pro 300 costs more than the Lelit PL60T, but I think the build quality is sturdier, and you get other small but nice features (shot clock, easier to clean water reservoir, quieter, )
        I think they produce just as good coffee as one another. Steaming is probably on par.

        Once you get a short list I found it helpful to play around with each machine to figure out what you like best. I ended up with the Pro 300. (Coming from a Gaggia Carezza).

        Hope that helps.
        Happy shopping! =)

        Kev

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        • #5
          There is a Bezzera BZ99s (non e-61 HX) for sale here on the forum right now. Well under budget and really fast warm up. Great coffee.

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          • #6
            A day to become a certified barista? Curious as to what grinder is paired with the Gaggia Classic that died and it's cause of death.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by CoffeeHack View Post
              The HX warm-up issue can be negated with a cheap plug-in timer... if that is a suitable solution for you then you've just open your options up by a few dozen!
              I use a timer to turn on the machine in the morning which works well. however unless you leave it on all day long say if you feel an urge to drink a coffee during the day it is still a hassle.

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              • #8
                Where-abouts are you located "smudge01"?

                Mal.

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                • #9
                  Located in Samford & Work in the city

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                  • #10
                    thanks for the info - will check out the BZ10. Will have a look locally if I can find a V2 PL60T as well as I was thinking this was a good mix of price vs machine capability (& my skills)

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                    • #11
                      Yeah 1 day. It's the 'basics' barista course - gives you the base entry cert to allow you to work in a coffee shop ie you know what coffee beans look like, what a different grind does, pour times, heat etc etc - the basics. Also teaches you how to make the 'common' Aus drinks - Flat White, Long black, Shot black, mocha and so on. How to stretch milk, foam etc etc.
                      I use a Gaggia MDF grinder and it works a treat. The classic's boiler is 'variable' and the pump has died as well. Enough justification for a new rig.

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                      • #12
                        I am guessing you plan to pair the same Gaggia MDF with the new rig? Good luck with that but be ready to upgrade the grinder next.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by MrJack View Post
                          There is a Bezzera BZ99s (non e-61 HX) for sale here on the forum right now. Well under budget and really fast warm up. Great coffee.
                          That's good for me to know as I just acquired a BZ99s myself and was hoping it had a fast warm-up! I'll be picking it up on Monday however want to sort out my home filtration/softening setup before I start using it...

                          Originally posted by symphonie View Post
                          I use a timer to turn on the machine in the morning which works well. however unless you leave it on all day long say if you feel an urge to drink a coffee during the day it is still a hassle.
                          Yes that was my concern about upgrading from thermoblock to HX, whether there would be those unplanned times to throw the machine on and there wasn't a lot of time to spare.

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                          • #14
                            I live in Brisbane also. I was up at Merlo in Paddington the other day and they have a BZ10 on display if you want to check it out.

                            My Saeco Via Venezia finally died last week. It has been eeking out its existence over the past few months in a downward trend so I have had a little while to check out many forums and read as many articles as I could. I decided on the BZ10 and ordered one through appliances online. They had a birthday sale over the weekend which is now over but it is still listed for $1714 and is free delivery.

                            If we were in Sydney or Melbourne I would gladly pay slightly more and buy from one of the sponsors on this page. Sadly I do not know of anyone in Brisbane willing to part with one for much under the $2195 retail price.

                            I have only had the BZ10 for a day now so am still getting used to grind and dosage parameters. So far though I love this machine. Interestingly they have replaced the chromed plastic switches with metal toggles which I did not know until mine arrived.

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                            • #15
                              So I bought the Lelit PL60T V2 after having some discussion with the guys from jetBlack (Thanks!!!!). Had it for 3 days now and I have to say it's a perfect fit for my needs. It took next to no time to be getting great coffee from it, I'm adjusting to the change in steam power from the Gaggia.... oh boy.... it is FAST!!

                              The heat up time is exactly what I was after - I get up, flick the switch and by the time brekkie is nearly cooked it's good to go. Plus with the Afterburners posing as a steam wand it takes no time at all to get the coffee up and ready (the gaggia would have the steam going while I cooked brekkie).

                              Thanks to all who added the constructive thoughts and comments, and a big thanks to JetBlack for talking accurately about what I actually needed rather than just up selling a more expensive machine!!!! It's a great fit and looks fantastic to boot.

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