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  • #16
    That looks promising...

    How does it compare to expobar minore?
    Commercial non-sponsor link removed as per the Site Posting Policy
    Originally posted by K_Bean_Coffee
    A great compact DB is the Profitec Pro 300 at 25.5 wide. Quick heat up time (<10mins) as well
    Last edited by Javaphile; 30 December 2016, 06:57 AM. Reason: Commercial Link(s) Removed

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    • #17
      Ok...I'm at go figure point....

      I'm keen to hear some rationale as to why you believe that you need a dual boiler machine?

      Comment


      • #18
        Apologies.. did not mean to cause any undue distress : /

        My thoughts are as such:
        - Does not require pre-planning due to faster heat up. work schedule can be quite irregular so timer may not be optimal and environmentally friendly.
        - More idiot proof compared to HX for operation

        Not sure how true either of those points are.

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        • #19
          You might want to have a look at Lelit PL60T if you really want a DB, 10 minutes heat up time. I suspect with expobar minore you still need 30 mins to heat up due to the e61 brew head.

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          • #20
            Hmm.. so the heat-up time is more related to the E61 head rather than the dual boiler?

            Originally posted by symphonie View Post
            You might want to have a look at Lelit PL60T if you really want a DB, 10 minutes heat up time. I suspect with expobar minore you still need 30 mins to heat up due to the e61 brew head.

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            • #21
              Originally posted by Wenzell View Post
              Apologies.. did not mean to cause any undue distress : /

              My thoughts are as such:
              - Does not require pre-planning due to faster heat up. work schedule can be quite irregular so timer may not be optimal and environmentally friendly.
              Depends on which DB you are comparing to which HX machine. Also, the environmental impact is not necessarily a simple linear function of time switched on.

              Originally posted by Wenzell View Post
              - More idiot proof compared to HX for operation
              What were you planning to do to the HX machine? A properly set-up modern HX machine is a pretty simple beast to operate. I can't see how it is any less idiot-proof than a DB, but maybe I lack a bit of imagination.

              Cheers

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              • #22
                Apologies.. did not mean to cause any undue distress.
                Rubbish. You have the right to make as many enquiries as you please without reprimand or admonishment.

                What were you planning to do to the HX machine? A properly set-up modern HX machine is a pretty simple beast to operate. I can't see how it is any less idiot-proof than a DB, but maybe I lack a bit of imagination.
                Good point, Barry. I sense that Wenzell is merely feeling out the respective pros and cons of each machine based on the limited research he's conducted up until this point. I've undertaken the same task myself of late, and have finally resolved to stop ruminating and just get a dual boiler.

                Admittedly there are quite a few confusing discussions relating to HX machines (particularly regarding the supposed need to constantly "flush" and "temperature surf"). I'm sure manhandling these creatures in reality is a far less complex and exacting operation, however you wouldn't know it from scouring the various forum threads.
                Last edited by BalthazarG; 30 December 2016, 12:45 PM.

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                • #23
                  Compact espresso machine and grinder setup

                  Originally posted by Wenzell View Post
                  - Does not require pre-planning due to faster heat up. work schedule can be quite irregular so timer may not be optimal and environmentally friendly.
                  - More idiot proof compared to HX for operation

                  Not sure how true either of those points are.
                  Even if your schedule is irregular, the answer is still - Timer Switch. Get one that is app controlled, like a Belkin Wemo. You can set up a schedule and then override it at any time, from anywhere via the app on your phone. Eg: on the train home from work, suddenly you feel like a coffee... pull out your phone and switch your machine on. It will be ready waiting for you when you arrive home.

                  HX is about the simplest, most straightforward design for your requirements and would be the best choice.

                  There's a long history of users on these boards who have bought a SB as their first machine only to end up upgrading within a year (or months in some cases).
                  Last edited by herzog; 30 December 2016, 08:19 AM.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by BalthazarG View Post

                    Admittedly there are quite a few confusing discussions relating to HX machines (particularly regarding the supposed need to constantly "flush" and "temperature surf"). I'm sure manhandling these creatures in reality is a far less complex and exacting operation, however you wouldn't know it from scouring the various forum threads.
                    Pretty sure you are unlikely to find threads on this forum about needing to temp surf or do cooling flushes on Hx machines. Unless you stumble on someone with a grey import or who purchased from a drop shipper.

                    I have an Hx and have never done a cooling flush or temp surfed it in my life. Can't imagine how you would temp surf an e61 group head.

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Hi Wenzell, and welcome.
                      How's the research going? Pretty sure by now you will have some idea of the many different views and the many directions a thread like this can take
                      My advice to you now, to ensure you end up with the best machine for you is:

                      1. If you haven't already done so, have a look at the sponsers buyer's guides suggested in this thread. This will ensure you have an understanding of the different categories of machines and the importance of the grinder in the overall setup.
                      2. Have a look at the site sponsers. Some have been mentioned in this thread, there are also others quite capable. Pick one or maybe two and give them a call. This will usually cut through the clutter and clear up any questions you may have and address specific requirements all in one conversation. Hopefully by then you will be able to compile a short list.
                      3. If at all possible, get into your closest site sponser and have a look and demo of some machines on your short list. While they all look great on a web site, best to see them up close and side by side. This is when you will notice the little things that may not be apparrent in the photos.
                      If a site sponser is not possible, then try to find a specialist retailer nearby. (What area do you live/work?)
                      4. If you feel the need, seek opinions from members who currently own or have previously owned the machines on your short list about their experiences, what they like or don't like about their machine.

                      Best of luck, enjoy the search, don't get too hung up the little things that won't make any difference to the quality of the coffee.

                      Mal

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Originally posted by trentski View Post
                        Pretty sure you are unlikely to find threads on this forum about needing to temp surf or do cooling flushes on Hx machines. Unless you stumble on someone with a grey import or who purchased from a drop shipper.

                        I have an Hx and have never done a cooling flush or temp surfed it in my life. Can't imagine how you would temp surf an e61 group head.
                        Trentski is right on the money, have never had to temp surf or do a cooling flush on my HX machine.

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Originally posted by Brewster View Post
                          3. If at all possible, get into your closest site sponser and have a look and demo of some machines on your short list. While they all look great on a web site, best to see them up close and side by side. This is when you will notice the little things that may not be apparrent in the photos.
                          If a site sponser is not possible, then try to find a specialist retailer nearby. (What area do you live/work?)

                          Mal
                          Brilliant advice, Mal, thank you for that


                          If I may add a point here I thought worth mentioning. From experience working with over 10,000 home Baristas over the last 12 years, some people aren't comfortable discussing their needs over the phone. Either from fear of feeling embarrassed of not being proficient with the terminology or from the fear of being pushed and sold to when they don't feel ready to buy. And I understand that very well. No matter how many testimonials sponsors will have here and elsewhere on being friendly, professional and helpful, human's instinctive reaction can be also self preservation and cautiousness rather then face to face or voice to voice engagement.


                          From that reason, and in order to support and empower any aspiring home barista to conduct their research successfully online with minimum contact (not ideal but a reality that needs addressing), we have taken the insights extracted from a survey conducted among over 4,000 home Baristas in 2014, and designed an online tool that not only takes in consideration most common parameters people base their buying decision on but also whether those parameters stood the test of time, and what has really made a difference (as oppose to what they thought will make a difference) in real life, in people's kitchens, after a year, 2 years, 3 years, 4 years and so on. (We have been collecting data in this field since 2005).


                          Those parameters were integrated into a questionnaire, people like the OP may find beneficial, as comes a point in time, where after reading all buyers guides and forum opinions, one remains as overwhelmed as before and the question that arises is: 'what now? I get all the techy bits and users opinions, but what does it all mean to me?'

                          And while they may get that answer calling or dropping by a sponsor (which all do a phenomenal job with that, by the way), they may find calling or dropping by inconvenient or intimidating. But that doesn't mean there is no alternative. They can now engage online with this tool that gives us the information needed to design the best tailored solution based on their coffee culture space, as I call it (taste preference, point of experience, location, bench space, consumption pattern, budget, aesthetics preference, environmental awareness and few more..). As a result, they receive an expert customised advise with 2-3 shortlisted models that best suit their needs (now and likely in the future), even if they are not entirely certain what those needs are. From here to a new beauty landing on one's bench, the road is usually short and quick.


                          My 2 cents. Hope it helps.
                          Ofra

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                          • #28
                            Pretty sure you are unlikely to find threads on this forum about needing to temp surf or do cooling flushes on Hx machines. Unless you stumble on someone with a grey import or who purchased from a drop shipper.

                            I have an Hx and have never done a cooling flush or temp surfed it in my life. Can't imagine how you would temp surf an e61 group head.
                            Not on this forum I haven't, but I have come across a lot of them on Home Barista.

                            Again, my point is that, if you're a newbie, it's often difficult to figure out what's what. One person who has already owned (or already owns) an HX machine is a different story from an individual who has never operated an espresso machine to begin with.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Yeah I think it would be best to go check it out in person. I'll probably head down to a store later to look around.

                              Originally posted by Brewster View Post
                              Hi Wenzell, and welcome.
                              How's the research going? Pretty sure by now you will have some idea of the many different views and the many directions a thread like this can take
                              My advice to you now, to ensure you end up with the best machine for you is:

                              1. If you haven't already done so, have a look at the sponsers buyer's guides suggested in this thread. This will ensure you have an understanding of the different categories of machines and the importance of the grinder in the overall setup.
                              2. Have a look at the site sponsers. Some have been mentioned in this thread, there are also others quite capable. Pick one or maybe two and give them a call. This will usually cut through the clutter and clear up any questions you may have and address specific requirements all in one conversation. Hopefully by then you will be able to compile a short list.
                              3. If at all possible, get into your closest site sponser and have a look and demo of some machines on your short list. While they all look great on a web site, best to see them up close and side by side. This is when you will notice the little things that may not be apparrent in the photos.
                              If a site sponser is not possible, then try to find a specialist retailer nearby. (What area do you live/work?)
                              4. If you feel the need, seek opinions from members who currently own or have previously owned the machines on your short list about their experiences, what they like or don't like about their machine.

                              Best of luck, enjoy the search, don't get too hung up the little things that won't make any difference to the quality of the coffee.

                              Mal

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Hi Guys

                                Thanks for your inputs

                                I think I will be going with the Expobar Minore/ Mazzer-E combination

                                Really appreciate the time and assistance to everyone, especially BalthazarG.

                                Comment

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