Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

New Coffee Machine Advice...

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • New Coffee Machine Advice...

    Hi All

    I am after a new coffee machine. The budget is set to 2000-3000. What I am looking for is PID with Heat Exchange and a very good brand. Would love to have dual boiler but they all seems to be over 3000....

    Now brands and models... my father in law have Rocket R58 which looks awesome and making great coffee so I was looking a rocket one but also found Profitec brand
    The models I looked so far are Rocket Mozzafiato and Profitec Pro 500.. Looking at the reviews and features as well as brand reputation,, both seems to be similiar as per reviews etc... These two are about 3K which is higher mark and I am willing to pay but I was wondering if there a cheaper machine out there whcih same features and from a reputable brand... Would not mind if I can some some money...One of my friend was recommending Isomac brand and they seems to be around 2500ish range.. but not sure about quality and features etc...



    Any help would be awesome... Thanks heaps in advance..

  • #2
    Once you get into this $ territory in "traditional" machines, IMO they are all great machines (I'm talking traditional machines, not specced up Breviiles etc) and the limiting factor in producing a ripper brew would be your technique and ingredients (assuming your grinder is semi decent, dont forget the grinder has a big impact). Almost all should be decent quality.

    The rest is mostly what you find appealing in looks and layout. Many machines look almost the same (say most E61s), but its the small details that define them.

    Best bet would be to go to a sponsor or two and see and feel them in the flesh and preferably have a play.

    Cheers

    Comment


    • #3
      R58 is over $3K, especially if you need a grinder.

      I was in your position recently and settled on the Expobar Office Leva.

      It's been making a dozen or more coffees a day for a few months without any issues except for some adjustments required out of the box (which the retailer could have done if I had asked them to).

      I prefer HX, the water doesn't sit in a boiler.
      Dual boilers aren't better machines, just different.

      You'll first have to also yourself what your requirements are imo.

      Comment


      • #4
        I’ve learnt. Buy once buy right. If you love the R58 perhaps save a little more. If your budget is 2-3k and a R58 is about 3.7k it’s worth saving some more. Look at second hand perhaps.

        Only reason why I say that I went through this and went breville dual boiler to heat exchanger to ecm synchronika dual boiler to linea mini. I should of just bought the one I wanted to start with.

        As was mentioned once you get to that 2k mark it’s mainly just down to looks and personal preferences.

        If I was you send a quote request on the site and see what demo machines are out there if you want. Maybe someone has a demo R58

        Comment


        • #5
          yeah, buy once cry once. if you want a dual boiler, save up for one. otherwise every time you look at your HX you will sigh just a little bit until upgrade-itis takes you.

          Comment


          • #6
            iffarukh;

            Check this one, https://dibartoli.com.au/profitec-pr...ys-collection/ think is in your buget, we have sold few of then everyone is happy

            Regards

            Renzo

            Comment


            • #7
              An R58 is $2K more than the Expobar and, for my use case, wasn't better, no faster either.

              I think the advice to pay a whopping $2K more for a 'better' machine 'could' be bad advice.

              The difference in cost is a very, very nice grinder which would make all the difference vs virtually no difference for the machine upgrade.

              If it wasn't clear, I advise to very closely asses your use case, is your palette going to taste the difference between HX and DB? Mine can't and I've run coffee shops and been drinking for 35 years, some will and justify the extra cost though, so do the work to taste the difference.

              Otherwise you're wasting $2K and that's not something you should just go ahead and do without any testing imo.

              Actually, now that I compare my notes, I preferred the Expobar taste very slightly. My budget would have stretched for the R58 but I put a good amount into my grinder (modified M7D) instead of the machine and I'm very happy I did.

              Comment


              • #8
                Experience tells the story here - don't cheap out by just a few hundred....a solid E61 will probably outlive you, so do some research based on those features that are important to you, then go get it. Many believe there's no real diff between a heat exchanger and a dual boiler, but they are incorrect in that line of thinking. Yes, both have the capability of making a great espresso and milk based drinks but that comes at a price in terms of the coffee making process you will have to go through. Sure the heat exchanger will cost less but there's a reason for that. You don't want to buy the wrong machine and then in a few years go buy yet another one.

                A heat exchanger only has one boiler, the hot water/steam boiler, so there's a cost savings right there as compared to a dual boiler. The heat exchanger uses a separate tube that runs through the boiler for its coffee water. Since you need a very high temp in the boiler to get steam, the coffee tube that runs through the boiler gets too hot for making coffee. So, when you lift the brew lever in a heat exchanger machine, you need to let the water run through the brew group and into the drip tray in order to decrease its temp by virtue of new cooler water flowing into the coffee tube. Some people add a thermometer that screws into the E61 head in order to know when you have the right coffee temp, others just wait till the water coming out of the head stops spitting and sputtering and then connect their portafilter and brew. Once you have made your coffee and lets say you have to make four coffees, by the time you dump the spent grounds from the first coffee, grind and prepare your portafilter for your next coffee, prepare the milk if people want a latte or cap, the water temp has risen again and you have to do another cooling flush, if you remember! Its just a pain in the ass.

                My brother in law has a nice heat exchanger E61 machine but I can tell you that both he and I forget to do the cooling flush on a regular basis. I don't know why, we just forget to do it. Your busy with the process, maybe talking to people while doing it, whatever. The espresso doesn't taste good when brewing it at 265 degrees! Plus, its just a sad waste of water if you ask me. A PID based dual boiler solves that issue since it has two boilers, one for coffee with its own temp and one for the hot water/steam at its own temp. You pay more to get the second boiler, but its worth it. You will have more control over your boiler temperatures with a PID dual boiler.

                Now, don't forget that a mediocre grinder will be a sure way to waste any amount of money on any kind of espresso machine so be sure you have a proper grinder before spending $$ on a nice espresso machine.

                ps: You can buy new E61 based dual boilers for $3K and even a little less.

                Comment


                • #9
                  I was down this road just a couple of weeks ago and ended up purchasing the ECM Technika V for $3300+

                  My reasoning was behind the rotary pump which is quieter and supposedly lasts longer plus being able to plumb it in later when i choose to.

                  Now I have had it for only a week and getting used to the steaming and now starting to get a feel for the quality and build of the machine. I havent used other prosumer machines but I can definitely recommend ECM.

                  Click image for larger version

Name:	PSX_20190801_222128.jpg
Views:	1
Size:	621.2 KB
ID:	750399

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    jksniper if you think the Technika is good now wait till you feed it with a proper grinder

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      level3ninja i was looking at getting just the eureka mignon e for now

                      out of budget hehe

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by jksniper View Post
                        level3ninja i was looking at getting just the eureka mignon e for now

                        out of budget hehe
                        There is a second hand Atom in the for sale section

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          My set up, using the Eureka Atom, a very nice midrange grinder that doesn't lose its grind setting when taking it apart to clean it. Its fast and pretty dang quiet, meaning you can grind while talking with someone. Its programmable to two settings.

                          Click image for larger version

Name:	IMG_6983.jpg
Views:	3
Size:	407.6 KB
ID:	750402

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Martino View Post
                            ...

                            A heat exchanger only has one boiler, the hot water/steam boiler, so there's a cost savings right there as compared to a dual boiler. The heat exchanger uses a separate tube that runs through the boiler for its coffee water. Since you need a very high temp in the boiler to get steam, the coffee tube that runs through the boiler gets too hot for making coffee. So, when you lift the brew lever in a heat exchanger machine, you need to let the water run through the brew group and into the drip tray in order to decrease its temp by virtue of new cooler water flowing into the coffee tube. Some people add a thermometer that screws into the E61 head in order to know when you have the right coffee temp, others just wait till the water coming out of the head stops spitting and sputtering and then connect their portafilter and brew. Once you have made your coffee and lets say you have to make four coffees, by the time you dump the spent grounds from the first coffee, grind and prepare your portafilter for your next coffee, prepare the milk if people want a latte or cap, the water temp has risen again and you have to do another cooling flush, if you remember! Its just a pain in the ass.

                            My brother in law has a nice heat exchanger E61 machine but I can tell you that both he and I forget to do the cooling flush on a regular basis. I don't know why, we just forget to do it. Your busy with the process, maybe talking to people while doing it, whatever. The espresso doesn't taste good when brewing it at 265 degrees! Plus, its just a sad waste of water if you ask me. A PID based dual boiler solves that issue since it has two boilers, one for coffee with its own temp and one for the hot water/steam at its own temp. You pay more to get the second boiler, but its worth it. You will have more control over your boiler temperatures with a PID dual boiler.

                            Now, don't forget that a mediocre grinder will be a sure way to waste any amount of money on any kind of espresso machine so be sure you have a proper grinder before spending $$ on a nice espresso machine.

                            ps: You can buy new E61 based dual boilers for $3K and even a little less.
                            There are many HX machines available in Australia which do not need a cooling flush before extracting espresso. If in doubt, ask your retailer or get a demo - the group head should give you water rather than spluttering with steam and water even if the machine has been on all day without being used. However, many can justify the extra expense of a dual boiler due to faster heat up and control of the brew temperature.

                            charlie

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Iffarrukh,

                              Why are you locking a HX with PID?

                              I have a HX and I like this kind of machines. But I believe that a PID is more useful in SD, DB and Thermoblock machines.

                              The PID usually controls the boiler, not the HX.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X