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Some technical questions and advice on espresso machine

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  • CoffeeHack
    replied
    Hi akwhsu and welcome to the forum! Your needs sound remarkably similar to mine (I'm not afraid to admit that I'm only a hack as a home barista, hence the user-name) (but that's not to say that you are a hack! I'm only speaking for myself here!). I made the jump from a Sunbeam EM7000 to a 20-year old third-hand Bezerra BZ99 I found on eBay a few years back. The steam module on the EM7000 kept on failing and I didn't trust a machine that had a bunch of buttons due to the higher potential of some electronic component failing. The BZ99 hasn't been failure-proof either however even with my limited skills I've been able to do some things myself like swap out the steam arm, change failed buttons & replace an over-pressure valve. Other things have required the help of professional repairers (mainly a new pump) but that's to be expected considering the age of this thing. The simplicity of just two buttons and two taps gives me a lot more confidence to be able to troubleshoot any problems that may arise, and to swap out components myself more often than not.

    As for the result in the cup, my setup is more than adequate for the 3-4 milky coffees per day plus extras on weekends. I believe the BZ99 has some kind of technology that heats the brew head capsule, so it is probably one of the quicker HXs to warm up. It's certainly not as quick as a thermoblock appliance machine, however as many people suggest on here if you have a regular routine a timer switch is always an option. And I can say I've never found myself being kept awake at night pondering whether I need to install a PID. That's as much as I'll say about that as I don't want to prompt a repeat of the 'Great Coffee Snobs PID War of 2015' and will leave the debate to those who know about these kinds of things a whole bunch more than I do.

    I think if you're confident doing the home barista thing with a BDB, then you'll get a great amount of value and enjoyment out of a prosumer machine. I look forward to hearing about your next moves!

    Leave a comment:


  • hm520
    replied
    By no means an expert here but

    1. How important do you guys think PIDs are on heat exchangers? Not particularly, as the heat exchanger goes to one temp (steam) and the heat exchanges to brew at a lower temp, you couldn't get a set temp on the two.

    2. How important are brew pressure gauges? I noticed that the Profitec 300 does not have one, it only has a steam pressure gauge. I must admit being an amateur at this, when I got my Breville DB, I would adjust my grinder settings and the way I tamp to try and get the pressure range between 8-10. I know there are a lot of other factors that go into making a good coffee but at my entry level, I feel that the brew pressure gauge is quite important to guide beginners or am I wrong? Similar to the Profitec 300, the Rocket Appartamento also doesn't have a brew gauge. Provided the machine is bench tested and well set up, plus OPV set at appropriate temp, it's not mandatory to have brew gauge. My machine, a BZ10, has one, but you can get enough of an idea visually from the machine too. When the machine is serviced they'll also ensure hte pressure is appropriate at the group.

    3. Heat up time would be dependent on boiler size, but also the grouphead. In most Hx machines the boiler is at temp by 10 mins, but as most have an e61 group attached, this takes a total of 30 mins to be at temp due to the mass of it, plus requiring hot water the flow through it. The same can be said for dual boilers with e61 groups. I have a BZ10 with an electrically heated group and its at temp within ~12-13 mins.

    4. I chose my machine (BZ10) based upon it being my first machine 'upgrade' and I knew the electronic group head heats up faster and it is a decent Hx machine, while not costing heaps, allows me to hit the next level without breaking hte bank. YMMV, but most HX machines will have more steam ability than the Breville DB, and you'll be able to churn out the coffees

    Leave a comment:


  • Some technical questions and advice on espresso machine

    Hi everyone,

    Long time reader here, first time poster.

    I've had a Breville DB for 4 years and it has finally died on me. I like milk based coffee and make about 3-4 cups a day between me and my wife, a bit more on weekends. We love our coffee and I also like buying different beans. I am by no means experienced in brewing coffee hence this post. I have tried to look through the forums but can't find the answer to these questions (please redirect me if I've missed the relevant posts). I am in the market for an entry level prosumer machine and have been looking at a few options: Lelit PL92T Elizabeth, Profifec Pro 300, Isomac Tea Due, Expobar minore iv.

    So my questions are below, please bear in mind I am not aiming to perfect coffee brewing at home, I won't be the type to experiment with boiler temps, pre-infusion pressures etc...I am after a machine that is more forgiving to the casual brewer.

    1. How important do you guys think PIDs are on heat exchangers? If I do buy a HX should this matter given that I only make 3 cups max at a time and I am a casual drinker - will I even notice very mild temp inconsistencies? Even with a PID on board do you guys still do a cold flush?

    2. How important are brew pressure gauges? I noticed that the Profitec 300 does not have one, it only has a steam pressure gauge. I must admit being an amateur at this, when I got my Breville DB, I would adjust my grinder settings and the way I tamp to try and get the pressure range between 8-10. I know there are a lot of other factors that go into making a good coffee but at my entry level, I feel that the brew pressure gauge is quite important to guide beginners or am I wrong?

    3. In general, do HX or dual boilers have a shorter heat up time? Eg. the Lelit Elisabeth has a 300mL and 600mL boiler vs the 1.5L on Isomac Tea Due...I presume the smaller sized boilers will have less heat up time?

    4. I know that HX may be more cost effective due to less maintenance vs DB. They are meant to be cheaper than DB, but many of the sites like Jetblack Espresso, Di Bartoli, Talk Coffee sell HX for similar price to DB. So if they are around similar price - what things do you guys particularly look for when buying? For example, the Lelit Elisabeth is only $2400 and is a DB with PID. This is cheaper than several other HX so what makes some of you choose a HX over a DB with similar pricing?

    Any other advice will be greatly appreciated!
    Last edited by akwhsu; 4 June 2020, 03:35 PM.
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