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  • Any servicing guys out there that can help?

    Hello all.

    I have recently had my 13yo Vibiemme Domobar Super in for a service. It has a lever operated E 61 group head. It was overdue and needed quite a few bits and pieces replaced, including a washer kit as well as a new pump. To be expected with its age, so no big deal

    One of the issues I was having with it prior to the service was that while pouring a shot, I would get some water bypassing the group head and spitting out of the drain chamber.
    Upon picking my machine up and bringing it home I was a bit dirty with the fact that it was still venting to drain when the group head was under pressure, such as when the blind filter was installed or when pushing water through freshly ground coffee.

    I took the machine back for the service person to check it out today. He pulled down and checked everything before testing it and found it to be fine. When I picked it up, he even plugged it in ran the pump and showed me. The machine wasn't up to temp, but the drain was dry with the blind filter installed and the pump up to operating pressure.

    Got the machine home, plugged her in and got her up to temp only to find that the damn thing was once again bypassing into the drain. Now it isn't a massive leak, but it is annoying the hell out of me. The fact that I've spend several hundred Australian oasis to maintain it and it is doing this still is a little upsetting.

    Anyhow, I've decided to pull it down myself and check things out. Just wanted to tap into any knowledge available here to help identify possible causes. Is their a Vibiemme specific issue I need to be a w are of, that perhaps my local service guy isnt aware of? Could it be a spring issue? As in the old spring becoming weak over time? Or perhaps a different type of washer material needs to be installed for the pre-infusion or drain valves?

    Any help would be appreciated in trouble shooting this.

  • #2
    They probably used Faema E61 parts rather than VBM E61 parts during the rebuild. The brew valve, drain valve and springs are the same between the two but the infusion valve and spring are different and are not compatible.

    Ordering a new infusion valve and spring (about $32 from Coffee Parts) will probably get you up and running again. Before placing the order, fully inspect the other valves, cam and cam seals for any problems. Who knows what else they possibly missed or did wrong.

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    • #3
      Thanks for your help.
      I will pull the old girl down over the weekend and check it all.

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      • #4
        If the place you got it serviced were super dodgy and didn't replace the rubber seals in the valves particularly the brew valve. I just worked on an Expobar which had a leak like you describe and it was fixed one I put a new rubber seal in the brew valve (I had already replaced the seals on the drain and infusion valves).

        I think it is more likely though what noidle22 mentioned above.

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        • #5
          It's the drain valve not sealing that's the issue as that is the valve that is closed while making a shot. If it were a brew valve seal issue, the drip would be while the machine is idle rather than while pulling a shot.
          The most likely cause is that the seal in the drain valve is worn and has not been replaced. Do you know what bits and pieces where replaced in the group?

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          • roosterben
            roosterben commented
            Editing a comment
            You could be right I just read that again, if the op is meaning draining into the drip tray while running a shot post service. The leak I fixed with the brew valve was a slow dripping from drain once heating up and while the machine was up to temp.

        • #6
          Yeah it's only when running a shot and only when the machine is warm. When first turned on, you can put a blind filter in and it is leak free. Once warm, different story.

          So infusion valve ( that's the one directly below the cam from the lever right?), or drain valve?

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          • #7
            It would be the drain valve. The drain valve should be closed and fully sealed when brewing, whereas the infusion valve is designed to open slightly and fill the pre infusion chamber as the pressure builds so there is a slow ramp up of pressure and the coffee puck doesn't get hit with 9 bar straight away.

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            • #8
              Originally posted by Sir View Post
              It would be the drain valve. The drain valve should be closed and fully sealed when brewing, whereas the infusion valve is designed to open slightly and fill the pre infusion chamber as the pressure builds so there is a slow ramp up of pressure and the coffee puck doesn't get hit with 9 bar straight away.
              I gave whoever looked at the machine the benefit of the doubt in that I hope they wouldn't miss a faulty drain valve twice. It does seem more that way though.

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              • #9
                Yeah I'm a little dirty actually.
                The machine actually had several issues after it was serviced. It's just that the others were sorted on the 2nd visit where as this wasn't.

                If I'm honest, it appears that whoever worked on it initially had no pride in their work, or simply didn't care. I reckon that's unacceptable.

                As a plumber, I'd actually like to do it myself. I cant see replacing washers and springs and making adjustments all that different to what I do when servicing a backflow prevention valve or a thermostatic mixing valve. Imust admit that I dont know how to adjust things like brewing head pressures, but with a small investment in the right gear, and a bit of a play, I think I'd figure it out pretty quickly.
                I got a coffee machine guy to do it though, because I thought I'd be better off leaving it to someone who knows these machines and what to look for, particularly a machine with a bit of age on it.



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                • #10
                  Originally posted by craig View Post
                  I got a coffee machine guy to do it though, because I thought I'd be better off leaving it to someone who knows these machines and what to look for, particularly a machine with a bit of age on it.
                  There's cowboys in this industry just like them all unfortunately, finding a good workshop with technicians who actually care can be hard.

                  E61 HX machines are really not too difficult to work on, with a plumbing background you'd be able to pick it up easily. They look intimidating but there's really not much going on.

                  There's lots of good videos online showing how to make adjustments and replace basic parts too. Rick from The Coffee Machinist did this video covering the Faema E61 group recently. A bit different to the VBM but very similar in terms of replacing/lubricating parts. Probably the most comprehensive and informative video currently out there. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1C0VdpfGXhc&t=563s

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                  • #11
                    Agree with noidle22 on two points, first with an adjustable spanner (two is easier) some electrical tape on the spanners to protect the bolts and some acid to soak the parts in pulling apart an E61 group is very simple. Just a bit daunting the first time you do it. Second there are some really ordinary coffee techs or coffee tech business out there.

                    I have bought a few machines second hand to fix/repair/flip. A few from Brisbane have even come with $500 recent service receipts from coffee technicians. When I have gone through the machines I wonder what the techs have been doing, seized OPV running 13 bar, pressure stats running so high the boilers or pipes could be easily damaged. E61 groups full of scale with rubber gaskets which are so hard you end up breaking the E61 valves trying to remove them.

                    There is one particular coffee repair business I keep seeing the stickers on machines in terrible states. I won't mention it here though as you never really know the full history of how the machines were looked after by owners (or how long since the last service) and what sort of water they have been fed.

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                    • #12
                      I'm on the Sunshine Coast, and if I could find someone who gave a rats and knew their stuff I'd be more than happy to use them. I had a business that I used to use, but they changed hands and the new owner isn't interested in servicing domestic stuff.
                      I'd even be happy to drive my machine down to Brissy to get it done properly. It's just knowing where to take it.

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                      • #13
                        I'd recommend the acquisition of proper sized Open Ended spanners or Hex Sockets over the use of shifting spanners. Far less risk of galling the finish on the chromed brass fittings...

                        Mal.

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                        • #14
                          So I should put my 12" footprints down?

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                          • Dimal
                            Dimal commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Eh, what???

                          • 338
                            338 commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Mal, pommy pipe wrench like stillsons. Have only heard it used by a British guy I knew, even though I think they might be sold here

                        • #15
                          Yeah they were originally a British made thing. Aussie plumbers use them. They are kind of a cross between stillson and multi grips, well kind of. I suppose they are a medium duty wrench. Multi grips are light duty and when you pull out the stillsons, things just got real!!
                          https://tradetoolsupplies.com.au/foo...BoCCBwQAvD_BwE

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