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ECM stiff lever problem- even after lubrication

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  • #16
    Ok... Pull the group valves and then inspect them. The pin edges must be smooth and flat and if they're not, you can either machine them or wet & dry them to to make them flat. If they're then too short, they will not operate correctly. You then either shim or replace them. Try the leva with them out. Inspect the cam for smoothness.

    Lumpy lobes and wear along the shaft = time for replacement. I tend to pack the bush through which the cam passes with lube and then use the shaft of the cam to ensure that the entire assembly including the seals are lubricated. I also add a drop of lube to each pin as I reassemble the group.

    If after all of that it's still crap, something is wrong. Seals, valves, the bush and you start systematically replacing anything which hasn't already been binned.

    There's no rocket science in all of this. Good tools will prevent any damage. Don't use ring spanners on anything!

    Comment


    • wirecutter23
      wirecutter23 commented
      Editing a comment
      Not Rocket science... ECM science

  • #17
    Originally posted by Caffeinator View Post
    Ok... Pull the group valves and then inspect them. The pin edges must be smooth and flat and if they're not, you can either machine them or wet & dry them to to make them flat. If they're then too short, they will not operate correctly. You then either shim or replace them. Try the leva with them out. Inspect the cam for smoothness. Lumpy lobes and wear along the shaft = time for replacement. I tend to pack the bush through which the cam passes with lube and then use the shaft of the cam to ensure that the entire assembly including the seals are lubricated. I also add a drop of lube to each pin as I reassemble the group. If after all of that it's still crap, something is wrong. Seals, valves, the bush and you start systematically replacing anything which hasn't already been binned. There's no rocket science in all of this. Good tools will prevent any damage. Don't use ring spanners on anything!
    OK thanks 👍 the cam lobes are smooth and not worn in any bad way, the next thing I'll try is removing both upper and lower valves and clean and lube both pins. I didn't do that yet, but they looked fine and not worn when I was in there. I also have some Mokykote 111 on the way to see if that is better lube. Cheers

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    • #18
      Not sure if this helps but my Rocket when cold the lever is tight/stiff as in seal type restriction. Once Up to temp it is nice and free, inox food grade grease used

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      • #19
        I was about to mention this too! Mine is also quite stiff at room temp but at operating temp its smooth.

        Comment


        • #20
          Originally posted by Mono View Post
          Not sure if this helps but my Rocket when cold the lever is tight/stiff as in seal type restriction. Once Up to temp it is nice and free, inox food grade grease used
          Thanks for the reply,

          Yes, I checked this very thing this morning and unfortunately it's still stiff even when fully warmed up and pulling shots - pretty much the same as when completely cold.
          So Inox food grade grease is good?
          cheers

          Comment


          • SanderP
            SanderP commented
            Editing a comment
            Yep Inox is the good gear.

            Cheers

        • #21
          Originally posted by Adam76 View Post


          So Inox food grade grease is good?
          cheers
          Morning Adam

          As per my comment in post 11, I find Inox quite satisfactory, I'm sure there are other products equally as good.🙂

          Comment


          • SanderP
            SanderP commented
            Editing a comment
            Dow 111 is also popular.

            I've used both and they appear equally effective however Inox wins out for me as it is more readily available.

            Cheers

        • #22
          Originally posted by Yelta View Post
          Morning Adam As per my comment in post 11, I find Inox quite satisfactory, I'm sure there are other products equally as good.🙂
          Hi Yelta, Thanks for the reply, couldn't find your comment in post #11 but hey that doesn't matter. Appreciate the feedback on the Inox.

          Comment


          • #23
            Originally posted by Adam76 View Post
            Hi Yelta, Thanks for the reply, couldn't find your comment in post #11 but hey that doesn't matter. Appreciate the feedback on the Inox.
            See screenshot attached
            Attached Files

            Comment


            • #24
              Thanks for pointing that out level3ninja, for some reason I'm not seeing any of the "comments" that are put up? Therefore I'm not able to read them. I'll try a software update?

              Comment


              • #25
                Hey guys, also wondering what the consensus is on backflush after making a few coffees in the morning each day? 1. No water backflush at all. 2. One water only backflush. 3. Backflush with water only every second or third day. Thanks. I want to keep the machine clean, but don't want to over backflush and wash out all the Inox grease that is supposed to keep my lever nice and smooth... Cheers. Please keep in mind I can't see any comments - only actual posts for some reason.

                Comment


                • flynnaus
                  flynnaus commented
                  Editing a comment
                  I do a water only backflush after each day's use and a chemical backflush once every 2-3 weeks using 1/4 tspn of backflush detergent.
                  The chemical backflush frequency depends a bit on how much use your machine gets. If you are making several shots a day, you might do it weekly; one shot a day or less and you might consider doing it monthly.

              • #26
                Originally posted by Adam76 View Post
                Hey guys, also wondering what the consensus is on backflush after making a few coffees in the morning each day? 1. No water backflush at all. 2. One water only backflush. 3. Backflush with water only every second or third day. Thanks. I want to keep the machine clean, but don't want to over backflush and wash out all the Inox grease that is supposed to keep my lever nice and smooth... Cheers. Please keep in mind I can't see any comments - only actual posts for some reason.
                Morning Adam, I back flush with water after every session, usually twice a day, chemical flush about every 10 days.

                Yes, flushing does remove the grease, however you will find after the moving parts wear in coffee oils tend to take care of the lubrication.

                If you want to grease the E61 cam without dismantling it try removing the mushroom along with the spring and valve, the cam should be visible (you may have to use a torch) I use a long thin satay stick with a dab of Inox on the tip, then carefully insert it and apply to the cam, the grease will migrate around the mechanism.

                You will find with use the assembly will bed its self in and become much smoother, a bit like running a car in.

                Hope this helps.🙂

                Comment


                • #27
                  Originally posted by Yelta View Post
                  Morning Adam, I back flush with water after every session, usually twice a day, chemical flush about every 10 days. Yes, flushing does remove the grease, however you will find after the moving parts wear in coffee oils tend to take care of the lubrication. If you want to grease the E61 cam without dismantling it try removing the mushroom along with the spring and valve, the cam should be visible (you may have to use a torch) I use a long thin satay stick with a dab of Inox on the tip, then carefully insert it and apply to the cam, the grease will migrate around the mechanism. You will find with use the assembly will bed its self in and become much smoother, a bit like running a car in. Hope this helps.🙂
                  Thanks Yelta, much appreciated 😁

                  Comment


                  • #28
                    Hi Yelta, I didn't have the large enough adjustable spanner - 36mm I think you remove the top mushroom or lower section, but I did pull it apart again to take another look inside. Both top and bottom mechanisms in the pic I have posted seem ok but the top one does not move as freely as the bottom one. Is that normal? It takes much more force to push the top one in compared to the bottom one which pushes in a lot easier, even after lubing? Is that normal?


                    I'll reassemble and see how I go

                    Thanks
                    Attached Files

                    Comment


                    • #29
                      Originally posted by Adam76 View Post
                      Hi Yelta, I didn't have the large enough adjustable spanner - 36mm
                      Why not buy one? handy addition to the tool kit available for less than $20 from Bunnings.

                      You will use it again in the future, I have one stashed under my machine and use it regularly, cheaper than paying a tech to do the job.🙂

                      Comment


                      • SanderP
                        SanderP commented
                        Editing a comment
                        And a properly sized spanner protects all that highly polished shiny stuff from damage.

                        Cheers

                    • #30
                      Originally posted by Adam76 View Post
                      for some reason I'm not seeing any of the "comments" that are put up? Therefore I'm not able to read them. I'll try a software update?
                      Using Tapatalk? It's a problem with Tapatalk, it ignores comments (silly but true) and they have known about it for long time but haven't fixed it.
                      Read in a web browser on a PC or your phone and you'll see them fine.

                      Comment

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