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Need a little help with consistency please

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  • #31
    Took a video of a shot I pulled this morning. Can't seem to upload it. Surprisingly, the shot in the video actually tasted good! I didn't do anything different except use a naked portafilter... Same basket, same dose, etc. Anyway, I'll keep trying to post the video. Thanks

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    • tompoland
      tompoland commented
      Editing a comment
      Simple solution then: video every shot! Problem solved!

  • #32
    Originally posted by Adam76 View Post
    Took a video of a shot I pulled this morning. Can't seem to upload it.
    Post the video on Youtube and link to it here.


    Java "Video files uploads not supported" phile
    Toys! I must have new toys!!!

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    • #33
      Still confused. Pulled a great shot yesterday -- went to repeat the exact same procedure and first shot was much slower to pour and less in volume compared to the yesterday's. So I dropped the dose down from 21g to 20g and the pour was slightly faster but the extraction and flavour weren't great. . I've been doing this for over 20 years with good results and any time I've changed any of the variables, the results have always been consistent and predictable... I just would like to know if it's the grinder or the machine. Might be time to take it to a tech? Thanks, I'm still working on that you tube video.

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      • #34
        As a matter of interest, are you purging the grinder after making setting changes, before dosing and pulling a shot?
        You could be chasing your tail otherwise...

        Mal.

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        • WhatEverBeansNecessary
          WhatEverBeansNecessary commented
          Editing a comment
          Smart man. We have all been guilty of not doing this and making changes before previous changes even really take affect!

      • #35
        Thanks Mal, yes I am giving the grinder a good purging after each change 😁

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        • #36
          I'd be trying a different grinder altogether.
          Then perhaps looking at machine. Maybe pump or opv? Does opv still kick in at normal pressure (eg. with blind basket when backflushing)?

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          • #37
            https://youtu.be/fWfXqkGWvGg Hopefully this link works. Thanks

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            • #38
              Originally posted by PiccoloLatte View Post
              I'd be trying a different grinder altogether. Then perhaps looking at machine. Maybe pump or opv? Does opv still kick in at normal pressure (eg. with blind basket when backflushing)?
              Thanks, How do I check that the pump is working properly? When I pull a shot the pressure goes up to just shy of 10 on the gauge and then slowly bleeds off to just shy of 9 bars as the shot finishes. I assume that's normal. And yes, when I backflush it, I'm pretty sure the opv is doing its job?

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              • PiccoloLatte
                PiccoloLatte commented
                Editing a comment
                Yeah, it's probably working just fine. I'm only throwing out other ideas because it all seemed fixated on the grinder.

            • #39
              Hi Adam76 .. Video worked for me.

              Always brave to put yourself out there. - good on you for that.

              FWIW I see approx 8 second until first drop ( ref on video 15sec to 23 sec) and then over 40 second shot, with considerable blonding and without weighing the end result, i am guesstimating it was quite a heavy result in the cup ( maybe 50 - 60 gms?)

              The puck prep and very even naked PF action would seem pretty good to me - From my own tasting - i would suggest cutting down your shot time and definitely measure your weight out - my thinking is allowing too much of the tail is giving rise to too much bitterness and the beans have done their best work ( on that dose and grind) at closer to 30 second total shot time.

              So my suggestions - weigh at least a few of the shots outputted in gms, to give you your ratios to think about again and easier still , shorten your shot and try that for a couple of drinks to compare.

              You will probably get lots of feedback, and if like any forum a lot could be conflicting !!!!!!! so just be methodical and only change one thing at a time and give that change a couple of tries to come through ( especially changing grind settings). Cheers D

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              • #40
                Thanks D, Yes the one thing I didn't have on was the timer - hence the 40 sec shot. I needed 3 hands. 😁

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                • #41
                  Adam76 great video thanks. Comments as follows:

                  You've got a lot donuting at the start of the shot. Very dark, on the perimeter initially. Not ideal but normally relatively easy to fix with a puck rake. There is a lot of guesswork with espresso but this is one area that is a definite area you can improve upon.

                  The pour stated at the 23 second mark in the video and you cut it at the 1 min 17 sec mark so a total of of 54 seconds pouring. Way too long. Not because 54 seconds in and of itself is a bad thing but because of how dark the pour was at the start versus how blond it was at the end. Your espresso is likely to be a mixture of some bitter and quite a lot of sour flavors, not ideal. If you did everything the same, but cut it after 30 seconds your espresso would have tasted less sour and it would have been thicker. So that's another definite area for improvement.

                  The biggest mystery to me is why than half the pour is a gassy crema. That will happen with beans that have not degassed enough but there may be other reasons too. I am aware that you have a proven, quality roaster but I'd still be buying 250 grams from somewhere else and make sure that it's at least 10 days post roast before you grind, just to be safe,

                  What temperature were running at? And I'm guessing that the bean were dark roasted?

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                  • #42
                    Originally posted by tompoland View Post
                    Adam76 great video thanks. Comments as follows: You've got a lot donuting at the start of the shot. Very dark, on the perimeter initially. Not ideal but normally relatively easy to fix with a puck rake. There is a lot of guesswork with espresso but this is one area that is a definite area you can improve upon. The pour stated at the 23 second mark in the video and you cut it at the 1 min 17 sec mark so a total of of 54 seconds pouring. Way too long. Not because 54 seconds in and of itself is a bad thing but because of how dark the pour was at the start versus how blond it was at the end. Your espresso is likely to be a mixture of some bitter and quite a lot of sour flavors, not ideal. If you did everything the same, but cut it after 30 seconds your espresso would have tasted less sour and it would have been thicker. So that's another definite area for improvement. The biggest mystery to me is why than half the pour is a gassy crema. That will happen with beans that have not degassed enough but there may be other reasons too. I am aware that you have a proven, quality roaster but I'd still be buying 250 grams from somewhere else and make sure that it's at least 10 days post roast before you grind, just to be safe, What temperature were running at? And I'm guessing that the bean were dark roasted?
                    Hi, thanks for the reply. Yes I was thinking of getting a puck rake, but the only ones I've seen and used at the roastery are very expensive. If you read the post #48 you will see that the video time doesn't correlate with the shot pour. The pour actually started at around 8 seconds and I let it run to just over 40 secs. I did let it run much longer than the 30 secs I normally do because I didn't have the timer on and so I just let it run longer. Yes, you are correct with the bean roasting and freshness -- the beans were only 3 days post roast, so may too fresh for an accurate assessment. Thanks.

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                    • #43
                      @adam78 thanks for your last post. It's all adding up now.

                      1, Definitely leave the beans another week, that will fix the gassy crema issue

                      2, Sorry didnt' see the part about the pour duration but it makes sense and is a really easy fix: grind finer. That will improve extraction/flavour and viscosity. Go for 18g in (or whatever you prefer) and double out in 25 - 30 seconds

                      3. Puck rake is very impactful. They can be pricey for sure. Etsy have reasonably priced ones. Search youtube for james hoffman's latest video and you'll see how a pro uses them.

                      Mate I reckon those three things will fix your issues and will have you pouring some pretty good espresso, time after time..

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