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ECM Mechanika Slim - not getting to temp/pressures. Advice on what to check?

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  • bkpr
    replied
    Righto everyone.
    1. I've spoken with a woman from Vic Consumer affairs, she agrees that "return to base" warranty can be a thing because such things are/should be outlined in the T&Cs of the contract of sale. I didn't read these of course. So it's possible, and probably likely, that's what I signed up for. I typically make large purchases like this closet to home, but pandemic situation and desperation forced my hand. Anyway, the repair + once-over cost me ~$280. I'm happy to let this dog lie and move forward with coffee again
    2. I've fiddled with the pressure stat to get the boiler down to 1.5bar on the gauge (1.25bar in reality). Seems ok now. At least I'm confident I can fiddle with this in the future to change if needed.
    3. @kofekitt All good points. a) I often keep large boxes for 'a while' before discarding, but evidently not two years Big bloody box! b) According to the ECM distributor there is *man shrugging*. The place had what seemed like the full range of ECM machines there as well as what looked like a comprehensive workshop. They looked as 'official' as I would expect, but also agree it could simply be a contractor Espresso Connect organised (at the lowest price?) in my state. 3) Yeah, I fully understand the issues of working on something that someone else tinkered with, and I was never in dispute of this part of a warranty. 3b) I was surprised after finding out the manual for my machine stated a 1–1.25bar pressure setting and my machine was run-in 2.25 after the service. I won't take my machine there again for this (and another) reason. I have several other *non-authorised* shops closer to me that I'll try in future.
    Final thoughts:
    • Thanks to everyone for all the advice you've given during this saga. Especially in the diagnosis stage of the sick machine. I've learned a lot and hopefully can manage repairs myself (with help from people like you, in forums such as this) in the future.
    • If buying expensive items interstate, read the T&Cs, or at least ask what happens if there an issue. I see my $3k for a machine like this is not just for the machine, but for aftercare as well.
    • I'm not sure whether I could recommend ECM machines after this though. At least not until the memory of the last couple weeks fades, and only if the machine performs well over the coming years.
    Thanks again friends!

    Leave a comment:


  • kofekitt
    replied
    Some important points here

    - if you buy a machine interstate, if at all possible keep the original box and pallet for future freight if needed . You are always going to get better warranty service if you can return it to where you bought it . You can quite often arrange return freight thru who you bought it off - most likely significantly cheaper than the cost of the parts you bought because some internet experts told you to....
    - There is no such thing as "authorised ECM repairers" Australia just doesn't have the training facities or infrastructure to support it . Most likely it's a local repairer who the seller has contacted and asked "hey mate, can you look at this machine for me" They may or may not have ever even seen an ECM machine before....
    - If you do take it somewhere after you've taken it apart, it becomes much harder for them because they not only have to find the original intermittent fault, but also determine if it was there before or after you tried to fix it . I'd be concerned if they gave you back a machine that was going to 2.25 on the gauge

    In short - Return to base, or take it to agreed repairer always when in warranty .

    Leave a comment:


  • WhatEverBeansNecessary
    replied
    Good luck with it all. Sounds like a right headache and certainly ECM and/or Espresso connect should be footing the bill for the repair.

    Interestingly straight from the ACCC website: https://www.accc.gov.au/consumers/pr...-refund-cancel

    "
    Responsibility for returning products
    Consumers are responsible for returning products that can be posted or easily returned.

    Businesses are responsible for paying for the shipping costs or collecting faulty products that are large, heavy or hard to remove, such as:

    widescreen televisions
    beds
    installed appliances, like stoves or dishwashers
    extension ladders stuck in an extended position.
    This must be done within a reasonable time.

    Return costs
    If the business confirms that the product does have a problem, it must reimburse the consumer for any reasonable return costs they have already paid.

    Consumers should keep receipts for postage or transport costs so that they can be repaid by the business.

    If the business finds that the product does not have a problem, it can make the consumer pay the collection and inspection costs. To do this, the business must give the consumer a reasonable estimate of these costs before collecting the product.
    "​

    Very much sounds like to me that ECM/Espresso Connect confirm there is a problem and they are liable for fixing it + costs to ship the machine under Australian Consumer Law.

    Leave a comment:


  • bkpr
    commented on 's reply
    I have now contacted vic affairs to see what they think.

  • Birkin7
    replied
    That is pretty crap service from Espresso Connect, I would certainly contact choice and the office of a fair trading to see what your rights are.
    A pretty clear case of supplier not passing the Pub test.
    Maurice

    Leave a comment:


  • roosterben
    replied
    Sounds like total hogwash;

    https://www.choice.com.au/shopping/c...onsumer-rights
    ​​​​​​

    ​​​​​​I would be enforcing your rights and if the reseller doesn't play ball give them shitty reviews on all their social channels.

    Pretty sure according to ACL you have the right to get it repaired at any authorised ECM repairer.

    Leave a comment:


  • bkpr
    replied
    Originally posted by bkpr View Post
    The steam pressure seems a bit high at 2.25 bar but I'm really only comparing it to when the machine was sick and the pressure was sitting at ~1.5 bar (when it heated all the way). I'll have to find out where it *should* be sitting and adjust. The gauge sits at 0.25 bar at rest so the pressure is actually at ~1.75–2bar.
    The official manual makes repeated references of "Wait until the pressure gauge indicates approx. 1.0–1.25 bar". Seems I need to twerk the pressure stat to …take the pressure down (thanks Farnsy!). Currently at ~2bar which is obviously too high. Resting pressure says 0.25, so will aim for 1.5 bar.

    https://coffeesnobs.com.au/forum/equ...im-user-manual

    Leave a comment:


  • bkpr
    commented on 's reply
    Good question: especially since I did it with advice/instruction from the mechanic at the shop I bought it from. The guy (owner?) at Espresso Connect was very stern on the opening of the machine point, saying that "voids the warranty anywhere in the world". *man shrugging emoji*
    Last edited by bkpr; 23 October 2022, 10:08 PM.

  • Blues1143
    commented on 's reply
    Is it legal to void a warranty in Australia based on opening a machine????

  • bkpr
    commented on 's reply
    I should probably also say, I don't know whether the 'return to base' warranty is from Espresso Connect (Aussie distributor) or ECM itself.
    Last edited by bkpr; 23 October 2022, 08:54 PM.

  • amberale
    commented on 's reply
    Hmmm.
    OK, AA puts in reminder folder, never, ever, purchase machine imported by Espresso Connect.

  • bkpr
    replied
    Hi Maurice. I 100% agree with your thought, but as it turns out, this was a massive headache I wasn't going to mention. But, seeing you asked I'll lay out the order of events:
    1. According to the interstate** shop I bought my machine from, apparently it has a "return to base" warranty (and preferably on a wooden pallet!). And given all initial research pointed toward a $20 part, I wasn't prepared to pack and post it back to NSW from Vic. **I bought interstate right when there were shutdowns of manufacturing around the world due to the pandemic, and was desperate to find anyone who had one in stock. None in Vic at the time unfortunately.
    2. After contacting ECM's Aussie distributor (espresso connect in NSW) they found me an authorised repairer in Vic, about an hour away from me. So that's where I took the machine on the Friday morning. I had ordered the pressure stat, vacuums breaker, and solid state relay by this point.
    3. Around Friday noon, Espresso Connect called me to inform me that they've cancelled my warranty repair because a) "return to base warranty", and b) I removed the cover to the machine therefore completely voiding my warranty.
    4. I went back to talk with the repair shop to do the repair with my money. Interestingly, they were reluctant, citing a fear that I would attempt to get my cost reimbursed with ECM after the fact, and they didn't want to deal with that headache (direct quote). In the end I pinky swore I wouldn't do that so they would repair the machine.
    5. The repair shop couldn't replicate the problem, but replaced the pressure stat and SSR based on the video I sent them of the flickering light. They also replaced the vacuum breaker because it was leaking. The exact same parts I ordered that were in transit to me, which I'll now hoard as spares The shop gave it a proper once-over, descaled, cleaned, replaced a rubber bung on the steam tap.
    ///

    Epilogue: I've been using the machine the last five days and it's been working well. The steam pressure seems a bit high at 2.25 bar but I'm really only comparing it to when the machine was sick and the pressure was sitting at ~1.5 bar (when it heated all the way). I'll have to find out where it *should* be sitting and adjust. The gauge sits at 0.25 bar at rest so the pressure is actually at ~1.75–2bar.

    I'm still a bit dubious about a 'return to base' warranty, or the idea that a particular machine couldn't be repaired by *any* authorised repairer. Seems like they were trying to wiggle their way out of a warranty repair cost (or some sort of deal that guarantees the seller gets the repair work), but I'm generally pretty cynical about such things. I understand the rule about opening the machine and voiding the warranty.


    Leave a comment:


  • Birkin7
    replied
    I don’t know why your original service tech did not tell you or why you didn’t just take it to an ECM authorised repair centre when the trouble first started especially as it is still under warranty
    if the parts you have ordered were purchased through this service tech just return them for a refund.
    Maurice

    Leave a comment:


  • bkpr
    commented on 's reply
    UPDATE: Have a found a local ECM authorised repairer so despite having ordered the parts mentioned above, these guys will repair under the few weeks warranty I have left on the machine Chuffed. Plus, I'll have $100 worth of spares should any of the above mentioned things fail in the coming months/years. Will update once I know the cause/treatment.

    Thanks again for everyone's help and attention.

  • Dimal
    commented on 's reply
    Agree with WEBN...
    With that extra information, sounds like the p/stat needs checking/replacing...
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