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Breville BCG450...modded...now excellent grinder!

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  • RJmultipleO
    replied
    Originally posted by djay View Post
    Had the grinder 7+ years and knew about the mod but never did it because I was doing filter coffee so the grind as ok at max setting. Recently got a pod espresso with reusable pods and then discovered my grind was not nearly fine enough.

    Thing is I tried the clicking the burr into place. The burr was basically loose the whole time. If turned it upside down with the hopper off it fell out. Anyway, as soon as I clicked it in, espresso mode was prefect for espresso, filter is good for filter and turkish is too fine. I'm pretty sure it was always meant to be clicked into place but some how didn't get done at the factory or popped out.
    No idea about the damage thing but I don't dial it up past turkish so I think its fine.
    Better late than never.
    I just got one of these grinders at an op shop in 'as new' condition. Noticed the loose top burr, coarse and uneven grind so was thinking of attempting the mod. Glad I read through this thread because I tried to click the top burr into place with some mild but not excessive force. As you mentioned, now the grinder works perfectly and grinds appropriate to the indications on the hopper. Best $14 I ever spent haha!!

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  • Javaphile
    replied
    Precisely why we so strongly recommend that people upload their pictures on here rather than posting them elsewhere and then linking to them.


    Java "Don't link, upload!" phile

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  • WWWifi
    replied
    Stupid flukn photo-barf-buket

    Originally posted by mayhewga View Post
    photos of the breville bcg450 grinder modification being performed.

    the job took about 20 minutes (however i am a retired technician so probably a bit more used to pulling things apart than most)

    i just follwed the instructions found elsewhere on this board, up to point 7, there was no need to further dismantle anything.

    I used just 4 tools; a flat bladed jewellers screwdriver for the triangular screws holding the base on, a phillips head screwdriver for the 3 screws holding the cover on, an ordinary serated kitchen knife to saw the lug off, and an emery board to smooth it off a bit.

    The instructions at paragraph 2 mention 7 screws, note there are 4 beneath the feet, then after you prise off the base you find 3 down the holes holding the cover. There is no need to remove the 2 triangular ones holding the round power cord cover.


    the tools i used (with optional view).


    removing the feet.


    unscrewing the four screws holding the base, then prise off the base.


    removing the three screws that hold the cover.


    slide off the cover.


    taking care not to lose the plastic bit under the start button.


    the cover is off.


    heres the bit that has to go.


    cutting it off with a serrated steak knife (dont tell my wife).


    smoothing it with my wifes emery board.


    the little blighter after its removal.

    The end result is a grind as close as i can feel, to that which my local coffee shop supplies so i am happy. *

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  • djay
    replied
    Had the grinder 7+ years and knew about the mod but never did it because I was doing filter coffee so the grind as ok at max setting. Recently got a pod espresso with reusable pods and then discovered my grind was not nearly fine enough.

    Thing is I tried the clicking the burr into place. The burr was basically loose the whole time. If turned it upside down with the hopper off it fell out. Anyway, as soon as I clicked it in, espresso mode was prefect for espresso, filter is good for filter and turkish is too fine. I'm pretty sure it was always meant to be clicked into place but some how didn't get done at the factory or popped out.
    No idea about the damage thing but I don't dial it up past turkish so I think its fine.
    Better late than never.

    Leave a comment:


  • RMOLD
    replied
    Originally posted by blend52 View Post
    .
    ??..to me, a tap washer is rubber, compressible, ...is that really what you mean ?
    No, sorry, what I mean is a fibre washer. A Google search of the phrase "fibre washer" will show you what I'm talking about.

    Leave a comment:


  • RMOLD
    replied
    Originally posted by cyrus View Post

    A washer under the rotating burr.
    I considered this to be possibly the best suggestion, as it is non-destructive and reversible if required.
    On disassembling the machine, I found that the suggestion of putting a washer under the rotating burr to reduce the clearance between the burr halves is a furphy. The machine is designed in such a way that putting a spacer under the rotating burr will not raise the burr, it will lower the driven shaft instead, along with it's clutch and gear assembly.
    Please note, if you wish to disassemble your grinder this far, the threads on both ends of the burr shaft are LEFT HANDED.
    Placing a spacer under the burr does not only not reduce clearance, but will allow the burr shaft to float up and down, creating the risk of the burr halves clashing.
    This is not my experience. If you remove the nut on the other end of the driveshaft, and DO NOT unscrew the bottom burr, then the only consequence is that the bottom burr is lifted. The rest of the motor unit is stationary - it is screwed to the body casing of the grinder unit - it can't move. You do, however, have 0.6mm less driveshaft upon which to reattach the nut.

    I'm happy to be proven wrong, but it definitely worked for me!

    Leave a comment:


  • RMOLD
    replied
    Originally posted by blend52 View Post
    .
    ??..to me, a tap washer is rubber, compressible, ...is that really what you mean ?
    Nope, sorry, what I mean is a hard, fibre, washer (like these (not a recommendation, just an example): Kinetic Assorted Sizes Fibre Body Washers - 30 Pack | Bunnings Warehouse)

    Leave a comment:


  • blend52
    replied
    .....Simply slip an ordinary tap washer in here,
    .
    ??..to me, a tap washer is rubber, compressible, ...is that really what you mean ?

    Leave a comment:


  • RMOLD
    replied
    Hi all

    I have signed up just to post this reply (to what is a very old thread now). Having taken this grinder apart, and performed a couple of mods - I can tell you what (in my view) is the best option for improving your grind.

    Thanks to all of the people who have already posted previously and given great guidance.

    Ok - before modding, it is useful to understand how this grinder works mechanically. Once that is understood, the first and least destructive mod is to (as suggested elsewhere) add a fibre shim/washer underneath the bottom burr. Once you realise that you do NOT have to unscrew the bottom burr, this is simple. At the bottom of the motor unit (inside the machine) is a nut and bolt. The thread on this is opposite to usual (think righty-loosely, lefty-tightly). The threaded bolt is the drive shaft that turns the bottom burr. Unscrew the nut, carefully pull out the bottom burr and shaft (from the top). Once you do this, you'll see the mechanism by which the burr is turned. Simply slip an ordinary tap washer in here, reassemble, and away you go. You have raised the burr by the width of your washer. As suggested elsewhere, I'd say around 0.6mm is right - and (on my Gaggia Classic) gives a "slightly too fine" going when the modded grinder is set to espresso. So, almost perfectly fixes the problem.

    This mod is sufficient to allow the burrs to touch when over tightened (not that this is desirable).

    For some however, this might be too fine (perhaps). If this is the case, then the "remove the limiting tab" mod works well too. Once disassembled, it is obvious that the threaded plastic component (that lowers the top burr) is simply clipped into position to the body of the motor. Without the limiting tabs, it can simply spin freely indefinelty (I.e., continuously spinning past 360 degrees). It is only the tabs that stop it. These serve a few functions. Turning the coffee hopper backwards, the tab is positioned to perfectly line up the various components so that the hopper and top burr can be removed easily (otherwise, they are locked in place if out of alignment). The other tabs, on a clockwise turn of the hopper, simply limit the closeness of the burrs. It is not clear why they are limited to the degree that they are.

    Although all tabs can be removed (I think there were three), there is a downside in doing so. Because of the way the thing is put together, tightening too hard (when assembled) can cause the threaded plastic part to pop it's clips (the pressure of the top burr component on the little plastic clips is simply too great). So, for this reason, tightening to a great degree is not recommended by me. I'd use the the "washer" method above. But...if you don't need to tighten right down hard to get a good grind for your machine - then removing the tabs should work fine.

    This is not a tutorial of how to do these mods - but just a rundown of my experience with it. Happy to answer any questions people have (if anybody still looking at doing these mods). I can say that, in my experience, the washer mod has increased the fine-ness such that I can choke my Gaggia Classic. It might not be as consistent a grind as a better grinder (I couldn't say one way or the other) - but for basically nothing, you can pick these up second hand and get something acceptable (freshly ground coffee at least!).

    Cheers
    Richard

    Leave a comment:


  • drhiii
    replied
    Am coming to this thread that started over 5 years ago. Cool.

    Have had the Breville 450XL for 'bout 4 years. Worked great in the beginning. Then as several have attested, this and that little things just degraded. Everything spins, the timer works, the whole mechanism appears to be working. But am not getting grinds worth a hoot now. I am guessing I need to start by replacing the burr, but... where would you folks start?

    Also, how do you remove the burr? I have had the basket out, tried cleaning everything in sight, not the least being the pathway which I understand is a bit small... but for the life of me I cannot figure out how to remove the burr to just inspect it. Have been to the Breville web site and is a bit disconcerting to read that half the parts for the 450 are obsolete and no longer available. How can that be when Amazon is selling it still? Judt wondered. Where would one get parts for this puppy?

    What else would one look for, or replace, to see about resurrecting the grind which worked well for awhile? And as mentioned, everything else mechanical seems to be working fine. I'd really like to bring it back to life. help?

    Leave a comment:


  • KizZ84
    replied
    Thanks man, I'm going to have to give this a go. I picked one up for $10 with a coffee machine I bought. I pulled it apart and cleaned the hell out of it before I used it and found the same problem with the grind. Just figured I put it back together wrong, but couldn't for the life of me get the top burr back in any better!

    I'll sleep well tonight knowing I can fix it

    Leave a comment:


  • dschmeda
    replied
    Hi Gents / Ladies,
    I am not sure if this is the right place if not please feel free to move.
    I have my BCG450 now for 4 years and I modded it 3.5 years ago. Always worked fine, however since January my beloved BCG450 became temperamental. The grinder just doesn't want to start, I press the start button several times and nothing, I play a little bit with the timer and sometimes that resolves until the next time. I already removed the on off button from the back years ago, and last weekend I tested the start button (with a multimeter) and works fine. I strongly suspect that the timer is playing with me. Does anyone knows if I can just remove the timer and put a normal on/off switch instead?
    Does anyone had had the same issue?
    I love this little grinder and I would like to extend a little more its life, I know that maybe it would be more sensible just o get a new one, but I want to see if I can still fix it.
    Thanks

    Leave a comment:


  • kevviek
    replied
    Originally posted by tee View Post
    Im new to this site. My Breville BCG450 is dying - intermittently. Have come to the conclusion that there is a dry joint in the electronic circuit board so Im looking to the net for inspiration for a solution. And, I found this thread.

    I did not know it is a common problem with grind size until I come to this thread. I had the same problem but lived with it for a year until the warranty ran out. I then took it apart - same procedure as the instruction given by one of the contributors above, but I didnt go cutting or filing the stop out. The burr comprises of two parts - the floating cup on top and the fixed cone below. The gap between the cup and the cone determines the size of the grind - the narrower the gap the finer the grind.

    I unscrewed the cone and placed a fibre washer under it, thus shimming it up to reduce the gap. It worked beautifully (until recently when it is dying due to a different problem); set it to "Espresso" and it gives an espresso grind size (previously, I had to set it to the last notch on "Turkish Extra Fine" to get the same grind size now.

    For those who want to do this mod, just make sure you dont put too thick a washer under the cone. The fibre washer I put in was about 0.6mm thick. From memory, it has a left-hand thread. Due to manufacturing variability, your cup and cone may be slightly bigger or smaller than mine, so after the mod, its best you try a coarse setting first and work your way down to find the grind size you want. You must maintain a "gap" between the cup and cone, otherwise, youll ruin the burr.

    As to my current problem - the grinder refusing to start most times. I now put it in the fridge before using. And, it starts when it is cold.
    So..I bought one S/H for $40, specifically for my weekender and did the push down mod. Worked fine for 30 seconds, then died. The one grind it did was excellent :-(

    Leave a comment:


  • shortboard
    replied
    Thanks for this thread guys, it made this modification super easy to pull off, other than the power button being super-stuck so i had to pull off the case without pulling it out first (it's tough but do-able). The grinder is now alright-ish when paired with my parents Silvia. If you you can spare the cash just get another grinder, if not this mod will do for a while.

    Leave a comment:


  • cyrus
    replied
    Hi,
    I'm a new member here, and joined specifically in response to this thread.
    First, thanks to all who have volunteered information on modifying this grinder. It has been of invaluable help to me.
    I would like to post some comments of my own too.
    OK, having owned a commercial espresso machine and grinder in the past, the BCG450 is, as sold, a pretty woeful grinder, but you all know that already. However, after thoroughly pulling the machine down to bare bones, In can say that the machine has quite some potential. This is coming from someone with 35 years experience with mechanical engineering in practical fields.
    The main bearing is a substantial bronze bush that is well lubricated. The gear case contains an ingenious clutch mechanism that will protect the gears and motor in the event of a jam up. The grind adjuster is not very dissimilar to a commercial Italian machine.
    The only real design faults are that the grind can't be made fine enough, and that the adjuster allows the ring of the burr pair to rock a small amount.
    Now, onto the modification(s).
    I have considered each of the modifications suggested here, and have made the following findings:

    A washer under the rotating burr.
    I considered this to be possibly the best suggestion, as it is non-destructive and reversible if required.
    On disassembling the machine, I found that the suggestion of putting a washer under the rotating burr to reduce the clearance between the burr halves is a furphy. The machine is designed in such a way that putting a spacer under the rotating burr will not raise the burr, it will lower the driven shaft instead, along with it's clutch and gear assembly.
    Please note, if you wish to disassemble your grinder this far, the threads on both ends of the burr shaft are LEFT HANDED.
    Placing a spacer under the burr does not only not reduce clearance, but will allow the burr shaft to float up and down, creating the risk of the burr halves clashing.

    Spacer between top half of burr pair and it's plastic carrier.

    This suggestion may be very good on machines where the burr ring is a loose fit in the carrier. In my particular case the ring is a snug fit, and there isn't really any room for more than perhaps one sheet of aluminium foil. Nothing to be gained for me, but if yours is a loose fit by all means tidy it up with a shim. Perhaps thin plastic, as could be cut from a milk carton or similar would make a stable hygienic spacer.

    Removing the plastic stop lug.
    This is really the only effective modification able to make a dramatic improvement in the machine's performance. One major caveat though; After removing the stop lug, I would strongly recommend keeping the bean hopper full. The reason for this is, as mentioned, the top half of the burr pair can rock slightly. With only one or a few beans entering the throat of the grinder, there is the possibility of the grinder ring being pushed out of flat, and one side might clash with the rotating burr. I believe the risk of this occurring is slight, and only with the hopper turned to, or close to, the limit of travel in the fine direction.

    "O" Ring between top of burr halves and bean hopper.
    This modification could help to hold the burr ring flat, and also take up the small amount of free play in the grind adjustment thread that allows the burr ring to rock. However, if the ring is too thick, it will also place the small lugs of the burr ring carrier that engage in the thread to be stressed. This may, over time, induce stress fracturing, and the lugs breaking off.

    Forcing the Top of the Burr Pair into the second turn of the grind adjusting thread.
    Pressing the top burr ring downwards so it "snaps" into place will indeed reduce the clearance between the burr halves. Two potential problems arise;
    First is that if done repeatedly, the risk of the adjustment lugs breaking away becomes increasingly great. Also, as the ring is forced downwards, the lugs can become distorted, and will spring back over some time, creating the problem of inconsistent fineness of grind.
    The second is that the bur halves are much closer than designed to be. Care in adjusting the grind must be used to prevent the burr halves clashing. (Don't let the kiddies twiddle with it.)
    Definitely not a recommended procedure.

    My grinder has only had the first stop lug removed, and now produces a very fine consistent grind with particle sizes also satisfactorily even. It still doesn't do "Turkish" grind, but that's OK for me. I usually make coffee in a Sunbeam Coffeemaster C30A automatic vacuum pot. However, I also like an espresso first thing, so being able to do a fine grind is good.

    Thanks again to all who have contributed to this thread. It turned a nasty thing into a useful tool.

    Leave a comment:

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