Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
yes
Cheers
Announcement
Collapse
No announcement yet.
Does a grinder really matter that much.
Collapse
X
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
loved this comment on utube for that vid
"
Amateurs. First, they merely copied the cryo-extraction technique, but didnt have the insight to freeze the beans themselves[ch65279] -- wheres the liquid oxygen? Granted, they "get" the 45 degree tamp and macro-grind, but one must compensate for the coarse grind with a restrictive filter. Pros use organic, unbleached toilet paper, 6-10 layers. The world champion used an emptied maxi-pad, in a "maxi-pod" format. Brilliant. Depending on its pre-owned state, blends with luwak. Bloody brilliant."
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
is this the famous barista in question?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0vEfbO1hLlA
Luwaks (who just spent some hard-earned upgading to a Rocky from an EM0480 and is looking foraward to tasting the results when it arrives.
)
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
Id say its worth trying out grinders in the 2,3,4 range on Chriss scale.
First of all, get an unpressurised double basket for your machine though. Perhaps your barista friend could teach you how to use his grinder (ideally a doser grinder at the 4-5 mark so you pick up the variety of dosing/distribution skills) and then let you borrow both his delonghi and one of his big grinders. For yourself, see if you can get the shot quality out of the DL that you would out of the big one, and repeatably.
I agree with what many people say here - I can make a great coffee, people I know (Scottie Callaghan, please stand up) can make a better coffee in every shot, and others I know wont make a coffee on their own machines/grinders if Im around. I can make a great coffee on a Sunbeam EM6910 + 0480, but I know its owners struggle with it.
J
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
Redzone, Im glad my form of ignorance is your form of entertainment! ;DOriginally posted by 5B4C4D5346474C181B18290 link=1246006661/40#40 date=1246271487Thanks for the entertainment EmoWink
Yes epic76 - mere mortal I am!
Lizzi, my mouth was watering just reading your attempts. Ill be sure to hit you up with advice on how to tune the M4D if I eventually get one!
agreed - thanks for the help everyone - look forward to learning more from everyone.Originally posted by 4F45504747485C5A290 link=1246006661/42#42 date=1246274308dont think there can (or should) be any more added to this thread than what has been already covered here and elsewhere. But I agree with redzone that it has been entertaining.
Will post pics when I eventually get a good coffee machine/grinder combo.
emo
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
Sorry emo, I dont get it. On one hand you say that there were only a few forward thinkers, but at the same time you suggest that the people in CS regress...Originally posted by 40484A250 link=1246006661/35#35 date=1246262698
Hmmm. As above - the world was once flat to all but a few.Originally posted by 5A524A405D390 link=1246006661/31#31 date=1246241706Apart from that emo, even though I have never tried other grinders, the sheer weight of responses here saying that it does matter makes me believe it. The people here are very particular about their coffee, after all.
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
What - the bit about round earth, flying or the bit about the horse? ;DOriginally posted by 6E5B56516579555C5C5F5F3A0 link=1246006661/43#43 date=1246275493Yes- interesting comments Flynn,
I posted before I read your previous post but I noted this commentI wondered what would be the minimum emo should aim for when I was writing my post.Originally posted by 6E5B56516579555C5C5F5F3A0 link=1246006661/36#36 date=1246266804follow your barista friends advice- buy an inexpensive grinder as it wont make any difference whatsoever.
I will stand by my statement about challenging accepted wisdom:
I made myself a coffee this afternoon with the single basket for no other reason than to try it on the GPP. It was a great shot, every bit as good as ones I have made with a double basket.
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
This sounds very familiar with my Rocky!! LOL....Originally posted by 72414E44597F670E200 link=1246006661/27#27 date=1246213672When I got my Kony (which replaced a Rocky), my wife immediately could taste the difference in her cappuccino. her total sum nomenclature for describing coffee taste is:
- too coffeeish
- its bitter
- MMmmmmmmmmmm, good.
I changed the burrs in Rocky about every two years or so.
And since the Kony arrived to mate up with the VBM DS, she says, "Its always good."
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
Yes- interesting comments Flynn,Originally posted by 63697C6B6B647076050 link=1246006661/42#42 date=1246274308...I dont think there can (or should) be any more added to this thread than what has been already covered here and elsewhere. But I agree with redzone that it has been entertaining.
emo, go and buy the best grinder you can afford. It will be better than not having a grinder and having to rely on pre-ground. I dont know how much a $800 - $1000 will make over a $150 - $200 Sunbeam with your current machine. Checked the Sunbeam website and it recommend the EM0415 grinder as a match.
For my first machine (pre-CS days) I relied on pre-ground for a while but my coffee tasted much better when I bought a grinder and even supermarket beans were an improvement when ground fresh.
Enjoy!
(BTW, the Earth really is round but I dont think man will ever be able to fly nor will the car replace the horse :P)
Id go as far as to suggest:
1. Choppy bladey grinder- dont bother
2. Plakky top burr grinder- Sunbeam, Ascaso, Nemox et all...pretty much the same. Price ^^^ delivers mainly bling and perhaps a little usability. These are 1-3 yr propositions and then you will probably ditch them...or go deaf :
3. Better constructed metal burr but generally stepped- Rocky, ECA KS etc...Not bad but you will probably upgrade someday or mod. them
4. Infinite adjustment in one way or another- K3T through to Mazzer major et al...Bling, speed
5. Big Conicals...Mazzer Kony, Robur, K10, BNZ et al...another big quality jump in the cup...
Without generalising too much, jump a bracket and you see a difference in shot quality. Shop within a bracket and you will generally get speed and/or usability...
Chris
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
I dont think emo is trolling and I am pretty sure I know who hes been talking to
I dont think there can (or should) be any more added to this thread than what has been already covered here and elsewhere. But I agree with redzone that it has been entertaining.
emo, go and buy the best grinder you can afford. It will be better than not having a grinder and having to rely on pre-ground. I dont know how much a $800 - $1000 will make over a $150 - $200 Sunbeam with your current machine. Checked the Sunbeam website and it recommend the EM0415 grinder as a match.
For my first machine (pre-CS days) I relied on pre-ground for a while but my coffee tasted much better when I bought a grinder and even supermarket beans were an improvement when ground fresh.
Enjoy!
(BTW, the Earth really is round but I dont think man will ever be able to fly nor will the car replace the horse :P)
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
hi emo.
i must say i shared the feelings of Chris (TalkCoffee) in regards to the troll thread... i was starting to get the feeling the whole discussion was a tad skewed towards needling passionate "enjoyers" of a beverage which, with the right equipment but absolutely in the right hands, can exhibit an extremely complex flavour profile.
it did cross my mind that, if this thread was genuine, your barista friend must be nothing short of a genius with tamping and setting up his shot to be able to produce coffee with flavour/aroma/crema characteristics so similar that they are almost indistinguishable no matter what grinder he uses.
if he is indeed a naturally gifted barista, good luck to him!!!
he is sure to make a fortune and his customers will revere him! (and i am jealous!!
)
now, back to your original question: does a high priced piece of equipment indeed make a difference or is it just an ornamental piece of bling .
weeell, the M4D arrived today (thanks Chris
)... Ms Carimali is sitting somewhat forlorn on the floor in the office and, using the same roast-batch which went through the Carimali yesterday i dialled the M4D in...took about 6 shots /adjustments before i got to about the right grind, then, the next 3 or 4 shots were brilliant.
those 4 shots were followed by another 4, and all of those 8 shots were done on slightly (micro-metric) different grind settings; all of them thick, syrupy, stripey and very sweet.
the next shot ( the 9th) was off: bit too fast, not sweet.
from there on any adjustment to the grind worsened the shot.
considering that Ms Carimali has a stepped adjustment ( and probably , being old, a pretty coarse one) and i really did not have to adjust her once the grind was set for the bean, i assume 8 micro-metric adjustments on the M4D would equate to the same "play" in the burrs of 1-2 steps on the Carimali.
however, i have never, EVER, had the sweetness, the caramel flavour which i experienced today.
ofcourse, the extra day resting of the beans could be a factor, but for me the grinder made the difference.
and that difference was much more than i expected, the Carimali being a commercial, solidly built machine.
a blind test with these two grinders? yes, i would be game.
in the right hands both are great grinders....but i suspect the M4Ds grinding is just that little more consistent and that shows in the cup.
it ticks all our boxes: it is quiet, has a small footprint, very easy to program and does an awesome grind.
worth the money? i saved about 2 years for this, and honestly: yes!
hope this helps
L
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
Thanks for the entertainment Emo
As Chris said enjoy the ride, its all good !
CB
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
Emo, lets just say that old mate can get $1,000 performance out of a $200 grinder.
Weve all seen Paul Bassett get great results out of a Sunbeam, can find Tiger Woods on youtube hitting a spectacular right handed shot with a left handed club and Top Gear fans will recall seeing Lewis Hamilton cane a Daihatsu sh!tbox around the circuit faster than a layperson can drive most sports cars. So the million dollar question is:
"What can you do with the Delonghi?"
If you can produce repeatable Mazzer Mini performance from a Delonghi, then best of British luck to you sir. Hell, Ill come knocking on your door for a lesson!
But...if youre a mere mortal like myself, you may very well benefit from a bit of quality kit.
Epic76
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
cuppacoffee, I think youll find he was refering to talk coffee.Originally posted by 6B7D7878696B676E6E6D6D080 link=1246006661/34#34 date=1246262210I dont think there has been any reference made to suggest that emos barista mate is a site sponsor, and I dont think ANY site sponsor would spout this sort of garbage.Originally posted by 6172656476637E7B72170 link=1246006661/33#33 date=1246260871Wow, if ever I needed some indication as to which site sponsors to steer clear of, I guess those few paragraphs would suffice.
But youre right - neither my barista nor his cafe are site sponsors! ;D
- Flag
Leave a comment:
-
Re: Does a grinder really matter that much.
This is quite a passionate thread!
A great idea. Ill admit Im a quality junkie, although there is a point where it turns to posing, when your gear far outweighs your needs. However, that being said...Originally posted by 555D5F300 link=1246006661/35#35 date=1246262698Hmmm. As above - the world was once flat to all but a few. But having said this I am going to take the advice of the forum and buy something in the range of the M4D when finances are in order.
A beautiful acoustic guitar DOES sound better, feel better and play more easily than a cheapy...
A 1200 roadbike DOES eat up the miles with less effort at the same speed than a 250 sportsbike...
An industrial MIG welder IS far easier to use...
A powerful stereo at low volume DOES sound better than a small one at maximum pace...
A CD will always sound better than an MP3...
A pair of Oakleys will ALWAYS look, wear and feel better than a pair of servo specials...
My beautiful chefs knives sharpened lovingly on Japanese water stones DO cut, handle and hold an edge better than a staysharp.
Am I an obsessive compulsive? Probably!
But my M4 is consistent, effortless, quiet, precise, solid and will probably outlast me. Did I achieve good coffee (occasionally! :
) with my Cafe Roma and Gaggia? Yes. Would I go back? Not a chance! And the process of using such beautiful equipment is a pleasure in itself.
And only a true coffee snob would understand...
- Flag
Leave a comment:

Leave a comment: