Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

    I also have one of these which I purchased from Amanti via eBay. It runs at 880 rpm. Does anyone have any idea where it fits in compared to the 1000 and 1400 rpm versions mentioned here? It is a good grinder and I am very happy with it.
    Ted

  • #2
    Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

    if it has the foam around the grinder just below the adjustment ring, i think that means its the silenzio model. I also had an amanti one off ebay although i dont know what speed it ran at. Certainly spat the coffee out much faster than a k6 though.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

      Mischa, Mine certainly has the foam as you describe and runs very quietly so it probably is a Silenzio even though it is not labelled as such (as far as I can see though the writing on the label is partly worn off from cleaning). I suspect Compak added the foam at some stage in the development of their grinders and perhaps later decided to market them as Silenzios. Do not believe it would add much to the cost so why are not all their units now Silenzios?

      One of the reasons I bought my eBay unit from Amanti was because it was a 880 rpm unit on the belief that a slower reving unit would heat up the coffee less. It has a 2003 manufacturing date. Have not been able to discover anything else about it but am curious why Compak would make 1400, 1000 and 880 rpm versions? Can anyone help?

      I reckon why the K8 spits out ground coffee quicker than the K6 is because of the bigger burrs.

      Ted

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

        Now we are out of the 4 sale thread 

        Most common AC motors run at a nominal synchronous speeds based on the frequency of the supply (50 Hertz in Oz).
        2 pole 2900 RPM
        4 pole 1440 RPM
        6 pole 960 RPM
        8 pole 740 RPM

        The 880 RPM is likely to be a 6 pole motor while the one in the original 4 sale thread is a 4 pole. Basically it goes to quieter running and generally cooler grinding for a better result. As a general rule motors with more poles to get the same power out tended to be larger and hence more expensive is why we dont all have 6 or 8 pole grinders.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

          another thing to remember is that bigger burrs means that the top and bottom burrs are travelling faster past each other than with smaller burrs.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

            Originally posted by 07233929222B4A0 link=1298928438/4#4 date=1299144582
            another thing to remember is that bigger burrs means that the top and bottom burrs are travelling faster past each other than with smaller burrs.
            Thats absolutely right Mischa.... [smiley=thumbsup.gif]

            Its the Mean Peripheral Velocity that is important not the RPM so much (with Planar Burrs Sets anyway).

            The other characteristic relating to the number of poles in an Induction Motor, is that as these increase so too does the output torque; so long as everything else remains the same. The main reason high number multi-pole induction motors are more expensive than 2 or 4 Pole, is the winding is more complex and in the higher number of poles, the Stator Iron needs to be physically bigger in order to accommodate the usually higher numbers of shorter pitch coils. Theyre also more difficult to wind in small motor sizes and take longer to complete.

            So, quite a few factors add up to a more expensive motor and is one of the main reasons they are relatively uncommon and in even quite large commercial conical grinders, a manufacturer will defer to a standard motor design coupled to a reduction gearbox. It achieves the same end result but at less cost....

            Mal.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

              Thanks all for the discussion on speed and number of poles etc. Most informative.

              I find it curious that Compak would sell a range of K8 grinders with differing number of poles in the motors. Are these grinders typically available to buyers/ importers with a range of options in regard to motors etc similar to cars where you can choose for example from a 6 Cyl or a V8. I would have thought to keep costs down it would be better to use a single motor configuration. I suppose it would be more logical if the design changed over time such as Compak increasing the number of poles in a later batch to give them a marketing edge over their competitors.

              Do for example Mazzer Jollys come in a number of different speeds?

              Ted

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                Originally posted by 1835313D305C0 link=1298928438/5#5 date=1299159473
                large commercial conical grinders, a manufacturer will defer to a standard motor design coupled to a reduction gearbox. It achieves the same end result but at less cost.
                Mazzer Robur, Compak K10, Versalab, DRM Cimbali (one version with Flat grinder burrs) are a few of the reduction drive burrsets on the larger end of the market. There are also some consumer/prosumer ones too where the case size is kept down by the use of DC motors Vario or one of the Isomacs i think (bound to be others too)

                Originally posted by 3D292F282839385C0 link=1298928438/6#6 date=1299189753
                Mazzer Jollys come in a number of different speeds
                Not that i have ever seen. one of my drms is a 4 pole direct drive and the whole grinder, motor and the resulting beans are noticeably warmer when you start to crunch out the shots in a hurry, partly why I did ask about motor speed in the 4 sale. In the case of a home user never going to be a problem.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                  Yes reduction gear boxes and DC motors are other ways of getting speed reduction.

                  What I was really asking is why do Compak make a specific model (eg K8) with different speeds? Also do others such as Mazzer also do it?

                  Ted

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                    Like a lot of specialised manufacturers in the world if you ask, take enough of them and pay your bills they will make them ;-)

                    Compak as a company has tended to make changes and tweak products on the fly as needed so the Silenzio is more an evolution of the old instead of a totally new product or made at someones request.

                    Mazzer seem to have stuck to 4 pole with all their flat burrs and gearbox reduction for their conical grinders. Never seen a Royal but it seems to be a 6 pole with i am assuming flat burrs being to odd one out?

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                      Beanflying, Thanks.

                      Perhaps Amanti imported a special batch of 880 rpm K8s for some reason to lease out to coffee shops.

                      Regards
                      Ted

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                        Originally posted by 24303631312021450 link=1298928438/8#8 date=1299202362
                        Yes reduction gear boxes and DC motors are other ways of getting speed reduction.

                        What I was really asking is why do Compak make a specific model (eg K8) with different speeds?  Also do others such as Mazzer also do it? 

                        Ted

                        Or maybe its just a case of chinese whispers regarding the speeds of these k8s....

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                          Anyway some of the large bag/deli grinders run at 2800ish RPM, and their motors are thermally separated from the burrs. So i dont think its just a case of RPM alone, more a case of how the whole grinder is designed.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                            Mischa wrote "Or maybe its just a case of chinese whispers regarding the speeds of these k8s...."

                            Mischa, Had a closer look at my K8. It also has a manufacturers label under the bottom which reads "RO9CB K8 880 RPM 21 Jun 2007" . I would suggest it is a fact rather than chinese whispers that Compak K8 grinders come with a number of different speeds.

                            "Anyway some of the large bag/deli grinders run at 2800ish RPM, and their motors are thermally separated from the burrs. So i dont think its just a case of RPM alone, more a case of how the whole grinder is designed."

                            I suppose it would be a positive for large bag/deli grinders to run at 2800ish RPM so as to speed up the process as quick as possible in that environment. Not really applicable in a home .

                            I would have thought the grinding process itself generates heat which is why I would prefer a lower speed grinder. In the case of the large deli grinders I am not sure the insulation you refer to is to stop motor heat adding to the grind heat or to stop grind heat further heating up the motor.

                            Ted

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: What Makes a Compak Silenzio....

                              Originally posted by 495D5B5C5C4D4C280 link=1298928438/13#13 date=1299445507
                              manufacturers label under the bottom which reads "RO9CB   K8  880 RPM 21 Jun 2007" .
                              Thats a strange speed for a 50Hz motor though Ted. Maybe that is for a 60Hz supply with an 8-Pole motor which would make more sense. Actual speed then, for running at 50Hz, would be about 690-710 rpm depending on Rotor design (more Iron less slip and vice versa)...

                              I just cant imagine a company would produce a commercial rated grinder for 50Hz operation with a rated speed of 880 rpm, which would have to be a 6-Pole Motor running at a Rotor Slip of 12% - That would be very high indeed and create lots of heat within the Rotor. A more acceptable amount of Rotor Slip would be no more than 5% at most. Thats why I think the nameplate rated speed may be for a 60Hz supply.

                              Could be wrong of course but this would imply that the motor design of this Compak Grinder is very ordinary indeed.....

                              Mal.

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X