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  • #16
    Re: sunbeam grinder

    Originally posted by Javaphile link=1181435470/0#14 date=1181621589
    Other than the occassional burr replacement due to wear nothing else has ever been done to it and its still pumping out the same consistantly perfect grounds it did when new. Lets see the Sunbrokes equal that.


    Java "Will stick with his Mazzers!" phile
    Java,

    I think it is a "sign of the times" that we now readily accept things can be "cheaper" and if so - a relatively short life is acceptable. Whatever happened to the "whole of life" cost when purchasing something? It appears to have gone out of the window - totally....

    If something costs twice as much but lasts 3 (or even 10 or more times longer) it IS much better value. (And with my environmental hat on - So much better for the planet)... Whilst I accept that it is harder to find the extra money, it can be done if people are serious about getting quality.

    And even if the reason these units are failing is adjusting the burrs with beans in them and the unit stationary..... (which I agree shouldnt be done) then why is this not a problem with Lux, Iberital and all the other grinders using this burr set. Id suggest the designers took this possibility into account and have used a more robust material which doesnt deform as readily.

    People do make mistakes, people dont follow instructions.... and this must (and generally is) accepted by manufacturers. Whilst the effect of such misuse cant be totally eliminated in all cases, it can be minimised. For example the manufacturer of a childs swing will put an absolute maximum load for safe operation...... but knowing some people wont pay attention.... the actual safe rating will be much higher than that advertised..... an "el cheapo" clone will often fail either just at or slightly above the rating..... the manufacturers rating in the second case is legally correct.... but a little smarter engineering and the willingness for the consumer to pay more for the item pays dividends.

    Comment


    • #17
      Re: sunbeam grinder

      I guess to Sunbeams defence, the sector of the market that their equipment is aimed at is highly unlikely to spend the time and effort that CS members would on dialling in a grind. That said, Sunbeams willingness to replace broken grinders under warranty certainly suggests that they recognise there is an issue and hopefully it will be addressed.

      I may go back to recommending the Lux - Ill have to revisit my friends with Sunbeam grinders and have a close look at the burr mounts.

      BTW There is also a practicality reason why not everyone runs commercial grinders (let alone commercial machines) - the room they take is not negligible, even in this day of MacMansions. And WAF is not to be discounted either.

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: sunbeam grinder

        Marcstolk,

        "reubster, you not comparing Apples with Apples ... $199 grinder to a $550-$600 grinder... If I had the dollars, Id own a Compak ..."

        That a fair comment,

        I raised the "upgrade issue" as an alternative suggestion to simply replacing the Sunbeam with a Sunbeam.
        Then I added the second post [re shot consistancy], as an extended "please explain " response to Kaanage.
        What I outlined [ie the grind adjustments effect on shot consistancy] would also apply to Iberital Challenge which is only marginally more expensive than the Sunbeam,

        Dollars are an issue with me too, hence why I originally purchased the Sunbeam, I was really happy with it for about 3 months, but having outgrown the stepsize I knew Id eventually have to upgrade.
        Once Id experienced the quality issues I could not happliy swap it for another one.


        Im glad yours is still OK, you are lucky.
        Im curious, hypothetically speaking, if yours died tomorrow what would you do?

        [Please dont answer this if you think a response it may curse your grinder....LOL]

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: sunbeam grinder

          Originally posted by reubster link=1181435470/15#17 date=1181626088
          Iberital Challenge which is only marginally more expensive than the Sunbeam,  
          Where? If I could find the Iberital under A$220, Id recommended them, with no qualifiers.

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: sunbeam grinder

            Originally posted by JavaB link=1181435470/15#15 date=1181623194
            Java,

            I think it is a "sign of the times" that we now readily accept things can be "cheaper" and if so - a relatively short life is acceptable. Whatever happened to the "whole of life" cost when purchasing something? It appears to have gone out of the window - totally....
            Yup, blame it on the mass consumption mindset thats got to have the latest toy filling their house. The only way they can do it is to buy cheap. Having the latest toy sitting on their bench now is more important to them than producing a great product from a machine that will last the rest of their life.

            It took me 10 years to find the espresso machine and grinder I wanted at a price I could afford. In the end it was all well worth the wait when after 2 1/2 years of haggling I picked up my 2 group Cimbali M28 and 2 Mazzer Super Jollys for $USD250. Great deals on high-end equipment are out there, if youre willing to put some serious effort into finding them and to live with what youve got until you do.


            Java "It was a long time coming, but now Ive got it!" phile
            Toys! I must have new toys!!!

            Comment


            • #21
              Re: sunbeam grinder

              Originally posted by kaanage link=1181435470/15#18 date=1181627168
              Where? If I could find the Iberital under A$220, Id recommended them, with no qualifiers.
              So now youre saying the Iberital is better than the Sunbeam? 10 hours ago you were saying they were equally capable. :-?


              Java "Have I missed something?" phile
              Toys! I must have new toys!!!

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: sunbeam grinder

                reubster, Id go back to Sunbeam with a please explain... and want a replacement... no one is questioning the "you gets what you pay for" issue... but for the money, the Sunbeam is excellent value and is really not challenged at all at this price range...


                Java, if the Challenge was just $220 Id drop the sunbeam at a heartbeat... and have stepless adjustment... but the challenge is at the $300 area and you can get a Sunbeam for $170 easily... big price difference...

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: sunbeam grinder

                  Originally posted by Javaphile link=1181435470/15#20 date=1181639792
                  So now youre saying the Iberital is better than the Sunbeam? 10 hours ago you were saying they were equally capable. :-?
                  marcstolks reply is the short version.

                  The long version is that the Iberital is terrific if you only drink one blend/bean at any time as the very fine screw adjuster allows for minute grind changes but is a pain if you swap around - this is a very big issue if you need to use decaf for a partner. Previous to the Sunbeams, the Lux was the other low price alternative and had the advantage of easy adjustability plus was about 15% cheaper but had a fairly large step size between grind settings. Both had excellent grind quality, good durability in a domestic environment but neither was decisively better than the other so choice came down to preference.

                  Then along came Sunbeam with their grinders being around 60% of the Iberital and 70% of the Lux with the same grind capabilities as the Lux, a removable hopper that closed off (which neither the Lux nor the Iberital has), wide availability in department stores that often have substantial discounts, a terrific warranty period that is well backed by a nationwide support network and lastly, rather nice styling.

                  All of these reasons makes the Sunbeam far and away the best grinder for people on a budget. There is absolutely no comparision with any other grinders remotely near their pricing - the previous favorite, the DeLonghi KG100/Solis Maestro, has far worse wear issues with the burr carriers, needs modifiction to grind fine enough for espresso, has far larger grind steps and is nowhere near as well built, generally.

                  Now if the Iberital could be had for 75% of its price, then its advantages would be easily worth the small premium in price but as it stands, the Sunbeam grinders are still outstanding value for money and the potential wear factor through (easily performed) misuse can still be weighed as being worthwhile for the cost savings, given the other factors I have mentioned above.

                  Now for someone who doesnt mind scouring old cafes/ebay/etc for old commercial equipment and then spending the time to recondition them for domestic use, none of this is of any relevance. And those who can afford to throw wads of cash at heat exchanger machines and semi or full commercial grinders wouldnt see the point, either.

                  But I know a heck of a lot of people who do not have neither the time nor skills nor inclination to go the 2nd hand route plus have limited budget (mortgages/kids/non-coffee interests etc). For these people, the Sunbeam is one heck of a deal and if a bit of extra care is what they need to take in order to get decent espresso, then it is still a reasonable recommendation. Or should these people be limited to cafes and plunger?

                  Verstehen sie?

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                  • #24
                    Re: sunbeam grinder

                    Top post kaanage !

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: sunbeam grinder

                      I do agree the sunbeam is hands down the best value budget grinder.
                      Having owned one, it was well featured, asthetically great looking and did the job well for its price.

                      And, I too have recommended them to friends, but with the warning that, I seriously doubt [in their current form] that they would have a useful life of more than two years.

                      BTW, I never adjusted the grind setting with beans between the burrs so in my case the slippage problem was caused by normal useage. The upper burr just sits in the plastic carrier, no glue, no mounting screws and soft plastic, ie poor design.


                      I also totally agree with the Javas re their "disposable culture" arguments, which is why I could not simply replace it with another.
                      Fortunately, I am one of those people who likes to repair/restore/recondition so this gave me a very cost effective way to upgrade, I do appreciate your point that not everyone may have the time/skills/confidence for this choice.

                      What I find a real shame is that the "giant steps" limitation and the slipping burr problem are both simple tooling/manufacturing issues and should/could easily be rectified without effecting the grinders price.

                      What an absolute killer grinder it would be if the step size was halved and the upper burr was more solidly secured.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: sunbeam grinder

                        Originally posted by reubster link=1181435470/15#24 date=1181698827
                        What an absolute killer grinder it would be if the step size was halved and the upper burr was more solidly secured.
                        I dare say its probably coming....

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: sunbeam grinder

                          I just got the Sunbeam last week and I have it at around 6 and still dont chock the espresso. Should I be concerned?

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: sunbeam grinder

                            Originally posted by Nety link=1181435470/15#26 date=1181811745
                            I just got the Sunbeam last week and I have it at around 6 and still dont chock the espresso. Should I be concerned?
                            What sort of beans are you using and how fresh ?

                            Secondly you may wish to read this posts http://coffeesnobs.com.au/YaBB.pl?num=1138058473/300#300 and those before it.

                            At present I have removed the two standard Sunbeam spacers, and used a thicker one.

                            My grind setting has now moved from a 4 to 8 and that puts by Sunbeam 6910 right up into the dark brown. If I tamp a little hard or Load the basket = RED / choke.

                            As to how long before I need to add another spacer .... Who knows, but as I said in the other posts... I have 12months to see how things go and to call upon the Warranty if needed.

                            So do you have a problem ??? Maybe not. However I would keep a close eye on it.

                            Note: Stale beans are a pain, while fresh roasted really do give a nice consistent output and texture etc.

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: sunbeam grinder

                              Hi fellow coffee snobs,
                              Im a newbie to the coffee scene as far as equiptment goes & have just purchased my silvia (after floundering with a cheap delongie machine for a few years)& I need to buy a decent grinder Has anybody got a em480 that works well with a silvia?
                              I have read Alan Frews reviews & it seem to be a good cheap alternative to a Rocky But has any one got some advise?
                              I dont have a big budget ($200)

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: sunbeam grinder

                                What youll find many people saying this grinder has too large of a step in adjustment that it is almost unsuitable for espresso. I have owned this grinder which I did pair with the Silvia and it performed reasonably well given a mixture of dosing techniques to compensate for the large adjustment steps. If you can save another $70 odd dollars I would go for the Iberital Challenge. Same conical burr set as the Sunbeam but stepless adjustment! What this means is that it allows you to really dial in the grind with the Silvia.

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