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The only difference I've noticed starting and stopping is that you don't get quite as much out with a stop in the middle compared to one unbroken grind. E.g. 15s = 20g, but 7.5s + 7.5s = 19.2g (rough estimate from memory).
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Originally posted by Hoggers View PostI would have thought the 'top up' dose would have the same consistency as the initial grind as you are really just pushing out beans that have been ground during the first 20 seconds.. for all intensive purposes you are purging and unless the 'top up' goes for more than 3 seconds are unlikely to be getting newly ground beans (these wont be expelled until the next purge)Ah that's interesting... I usually dose about 2/3 of the shot, collapse, then dose the last 1/3. Have had consistency issues before but after changing burrs it seems to have settled, but I'll keep this mind anyway. Maybe will just dose the whole lot and collapse halfway while it's still dosing...Originally posted by level3ninja View PostThis is exactly what I find. As long as the top up is short it's identical.
I wonder why stopping the grinder then restarting would have an effect, like what reason would it create inconsistent grinds if the burrs are still the same distance apart?
Perhaps upon starting grinding there is some other vibrational movement before it stabilizes, thus creating a slight change of grind size? Just hypothesizing hehe
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This is exactly what I find. As long as the top up is short it's identical.Originally posted by Hoggers View PostI would have thought the 'top up' dose would have the same consistency as the initial grind as you are really just pushing out beans that have been ground during the first 20 seconds.. for all intensive purposes you are purging and unless the 'top up' goes for more than 3 seconds are unlikely to be getting newly ground beans (these wont be expelled until the next purge)
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I would have thought the 'top up' dose would have the same consistency as the initial grind as you are really just pushing out beans that have been ground during the first 20 seconds.. for all intensive purposes you are purging and unless the 'top up' goes for more than 3 seconds are unlikely to be getting newly ground beans (these wont be expelled until the next purge)
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Some great points thereOriginally posted by dbaus View PostA bit late to the party but I just saw this thread and as an incredibly fussy espresso drinker with an Atom for almost a year now thought I may be able to help you - assuming you still have the Atom
First, are you filling the hopper at least half full?
Initially I was hopeful of single dosing the Atom - this was a very frustrating experience with inconsistent grinds and many wasted kilos of good beans
Having it at least half full will produce amazingly consistent grinds and therefore shots. I use an Acaia Lunar for measuring grinds as well as every shot and once dialed in, can reproduce D:20g, Y:43g, T:28 seconds all day long (using a Expobar Minore IV).
Second, adjustments are incredibly sensitive on the Atom. You should DEFINATELY stick to one bean until you feel you've mastered it. The smallest possible adjustment (approx 0.5-1mm of a turn) can result in ~1-2 seconds extraction time (for the same yield).
My recipe book has grind levels measured in 1.4, 1.5 etc on the grinder - it's hard to judge precisely so i have a small piece of plastic with a marker on it touching against the dial which helps a lot if you want to return to the same grind setting.
Third, when you're talking about different grind time, absolutely it changes with grind adjustment and also bean to bean. If you're going between two beans regularly why not set the single dose preset to one bean and the double to the other? Once you have the adjustments right time should be consistent, but if you want precision you will always have to weigh the output. I generally run 20g doses and have the time preset on the Atom set to give me 20.3 - 20.5 and then use a teaspoon to get back to 20.0.
I can't prove it but I have a strong suspicion that running under 20 and then "topping up" with short bursts produces inconsistent results, compared with one single grind going over the desired weight and then removing the excess.
Lastly, retention may be a lot less than many other grinders, but it's still significant. You need to run 3 seconds of grinds through after making an adjustment to see the difference, so change, 3 second dump, then grind your next dose. At the end of the day you NEED to bag the beans, spoon as much out of the top as possible, grind until empty, vacuum, then dump again and a little bit more will come out. These "leftovers" will not just push out first on the next day, they will mix with your fresh beans and make them taste stale for I don't know how many shots, big waste of time.
With a clean machine at the start of a new day or when changing to new beans (after dump+vacuum) you need to run through 12-15 seconds of new beans before it starts going consistent. If you try to pull your dump shot with those first 12-15 seconds of grinds it will be way off your expected yield\time so is useless as a dial in shot.
Following the above procedure I can 90% guarantee that after the dump\dial in shot each day, the next shot will be perfect D\Y\T and very consistent in flavour.
Keep in mind, this is coming from a very fussy espresso drinker
Hope that helps.
Ah that's fascinating... I'm wondering if anyone else has found this? Have seen many experts recommend the dose, collapse, dose rest method, but definitely food for thought and something I may play around with..Originally posted by dbaus View PostI can't prove it but I have a strong suspicion that running under 20 and then "topping up" with short bursts produces inconsistent results, compared with one single grind going over the desired weight and then removing the excess.
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A bit late to the party but I just saw this thread and as an incredibly fussy espresso drinker with an Atom for almost a year now thought I may be able to help you - assuming you still have the AtomOriginally posted by Thegrinch View PostI'm usually going from my home roast (which seems to produce a shot far faster than ones I buy) to beans from beanhunter etc. My beans require a reasonable adjustment just to get the shot right, so I generally make it quite a bit finer and the the dose seems to drop from 20 to about 14 grams so then I have to play around with the timer usually adding a few seconds just to get back to the 20 grams. Then going back to purchased beans, try the process in reverse, really frustrating, I do feel like taking it back.
I can't believe its just me and hope the grinder shouldn't work like this as I found it a lot easier with my previous el cheapo grinder.
First, are you filling the hopper at least half full?
Initially I was hopeful of single dosing the Atom - this was a very frustrating experience with inconsistent grinds and many wasted kilos of good beans
Having it at least half full will produce amazingly consistent grinds and therefore shots. I use an Acaia Lunar for measuring grinds as well as every shot and once dialed in, can reproduce D:20g, Y:43g, T:28 seconds all day long (using a Expobar Minore IV).
Second, adjustments are incredibly sensitive on the Atom. You should DEFINATELY stick to one bean until you feel you've mastered it. The smallest possible adjustment (approx 0.5-1mm of a turn) can result in ~1-2 seconds extraction time (for the same yield).
My recipe book has grind levels measured in 1.4, 1.5 etc on the grinder - it's hard to judge precisely so i have a small piece of plastic with a marker on it touching against the dial which helps a lot if you want to return to the same grind setting.
Third, when you're talking about different grind time, absolutely it changes with grind adjustment and also bean to bean. If you're going between two beans regularly why not set the single dose preset to one bean and the double to the other? Once you have the adjustments right time should be consistent, but if you want precision you will always have to weigh the output. I generally run 20g doses and have the time preset on the Atom set to give me 20.3 - 20.5 and then use a teaspoon to get back to 20.0.
I can't prove it but I have a strong suspicion that running under 20 and then "topping up" with short bursts produces inconsistent results, compared with one single grind going over the desired weight and then removing the excess.
Lastly, retention may be a lot less than many other grinders, but it's still significant. You need to run 3 seconds of grinds through after making an adjustment to see the difference, so change, 3 second dump, then grind your next dose. At the end of the day you NEED to bag the beans, spoon as much out of the top as possible, grind until empty, vacuum, then dump again and a little bit more will come out. These "leftovers" will not just push out first on the next day, they will mix with your fresh beans and make them taste stale for I don't know how many shots, big waste of time.
With a clean machine at the start of a new day or when changing to new beans (after dump+vacuum) you need to run through 12-15 seconds of new beans before it starts going consistent. If you try to pull your dump shot with those first 12-15 seconds of grinds it will be way off your expected yield\time so is useless as a dial in shot.
Following the above procedure I can 90% guarantee that after the dump\dial in shot each day, the next shot will be perfect D\Y\T and very consistent in flavour.
Keep in mind, this is coming from a very fussy espresso drinker
Hope that helps.
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Was tempted by the 270w but went with this as I believe the build quality is better, its quieter and the tech which is great in the 270w is pushing the limits and I think more likely to fail. Would still consider a swap with $600 cash on a similar age one under warranty.
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Give the guy a break. There's far to much crowing going on now.
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Yep, highly recommend sticking with one bean and not switching so often, having to redial it in etc.. grab a kilo or two of something, and make small adjustments when needed. Noting how that changed the pour, and always only changing one variable at a timeOriginally posted by Casa Espresso View PostAs already observed I think your major issue is changing from home roasted beans to your Bean Hunter subscription beans.
Even by your own observations your home bean settings are very different from the commercially roasted beans.
I can appreciate your frustrations but you are probably not doing yourself any favours by jumping from bean to bean while trying to come to terms with a new grinder.
My advice ? Stick with one bean, including one brand if the bean is from your Bean Hunter subscription for at least two weeks while you learn about try by our grinder.
I sincerely doubt there is anything wrong with your grinder , however changing the parameters as you are may make it appear so.
Cheers
Antony
www.casaespresso.com.au
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Eureka Atom Getting started?
I’m not sure there’s much wrong with the grinder as Anthony has said. I think you probably chose the wrong grinder for “your” needs and would be better with a sette 270w (or any other with same features) that grinds to weight no matter what grind size you choose.
Happy to trade you one for your atom [emoji6]
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Eureka Atom Getting started?
As already observed I think your major issue is changing from home roasted beans to your Bean Hunter subscription beans.
Even by your own observations your home bean settings are very different from the commercially roasted beans.
I can appreciate your frustrations but you are probably not doing yourself any favours by jumping from bean to bean while trying to come to terms with a new grinder.
My advice ? Stick with one bean, including one brand if the bean is from your Bean Hunter subscription for at least two weeks while you try learn about your new grinder.
I sincerely doubt there is anything wrong with your grinder , however changing the parameters as you are may make it appear so.
Cheers
Antony
www.casaespresso.com.auLast edited by Casa Espresso; 26 March 2018, 11:57 PM.
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Have never used an Atom so cant comment, however am following the thread with interest, guess it's easy to sit on the side and assume user error when it may well not be.
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Hi Thegrinch..
I am totally new to the home brewing and coffee scene so have very limited experience to draw on. I also have the atom and it took me a while to get it to the stage where the grind suited my tastes and the coffee 'poured' as i believe it should.
If it is of any help I can have a difference of a gram or so in the basket for the same timed dose. I make no changes to the settings and the difference in weight can be from one grind to the next.
I always aim for around 20 grams in the basket as, for me, this give me the taste and feel I am after and the beauty of this grinder is that I have one button set to 10.5 seconds and one to 1 second (+/- a few seconds depending on first weigh).
My method it is do the first grind and 10.5 seconds, weigh and then grind at 1 second (give or take) to get my ball park weigh (not an exact science). I have got to the stage now where I know how long my second grind needs to be to get me to my target weight zone.
I think you might send yourself mad if you try to be too perfectionist about it as there are so many variables that can affect the end weight and that are largely beyond control.
Still the best grinder for me and the I love the end result
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Hi Thegrinch,
It might not be a bad idea to take it and a bag of beans back to the distributor in Melbourne personally and running through the said issues with them...Originally posted by Thegrinch View PostFood for thought and I'd agree 100% CD if I didn't have a totally different experience with my old grinder.
This one is indeed a fight that I'd like to work with rather than against. The distributer from Melbourne seems to think this is not normal so therefore there is the possibility that something is wrong - I hope so as it is difficult to work with.
Cheers.
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Food for thought and I'd agree 100% CD if I didn't have a totally different experience with my old grinder.
This one is indeed a fight that I'd like to work with rather than against. The distributer from Melbourne seems to think this is not normal so therefore there is the possibility that something is wrong - I hope so as it is difficult to work with.
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