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Does anyone know the RPM of the mini? I've searched their website but can't see it documented anywhere. Must be missing it.
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level3ninja having used both the mini and the P64, what's your thoughts between the two? They are obviously very different grinder, but for filter/cupping/the odd espresso what do you prefer? Especially, does one favour clarity over the other?Comment
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Hi Ninja, here is a few quick shots showing the dial dots, button, zero and subtle branding on the base (std not optional). If there is anything more you would like just let me know.
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It's not fair to do a straight comparison, because the Mini only has one option for burrs (or with the Moonshine burrs possibly two options if they get mass released), whereas the P64 probably has one of the widest ranges of burrs flavour profiles available to it because it takes the 64mm Mazzer style burrs. I only tried the P64 by pulling about 10 shots with the SSP MP burrs, which are not comparable to anything traditional. They're super unimodal, very much a single flavour note with minimal aftertaste for normal espresso. They can be fun for turbos. I was playing with a set in another grinder for a week or so but I've given it back now.Originally posted by crazyhakins View Post
The stock P64 Italmill burr is a traditional flat, then there's the SSP HU which is apparently similar but a step towards more clarity, then the SSP LS V2 burrs, which are another step to clarity, then the MP, then the Brew. Option-O also have their own version of the LS in development which I'm guessing will sit between the SSP LS and the MP (pure speculation). Basically if you like flat burr flavour profiles there's sure to be something to suit you in 64mm, and they're relatively inexpensive compared to a whole new grinder (list price around $330), so if you don't like one you can always try another and sell the one you don't like. I've heard a few people say that the 64mm LS burrs are their favourite all rounder burr for espresso and filter.
The Mini burrs are small conical burr high clarity profile. Reminds me of a traditional flat burr, but a bit more clarity/less mud. But I think the shape of the PSD curve will be different.
In terms of workflow the overall steps are similar between the Mini and P64, but the P64 is much quicker, and more easily repeatable finding the same grind setting (the Mini is easy enough, but the P64 is noticably easier due to having the same thread pitch but a larger diameter). The P64 feels like a much more expensive grinder (as it should at 4 times the price!)
If the P64 was a miniature version of the P100 with the auto purge and chute knocker, I probably would have kept my P64 order instead of cancelling it once I ordered a P100. Will I like the 98mm burr profile? Not sure, maybe I'll sell and get a P64.
Sorry this is a bit of a ramble. In short the Mini is somewhat clarity oriented, the P64 can be as clarity of traditional oriented as you want.Comment
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Do not apologise, this is very helpful information. I’m on a very long thought/decision making thread of where I go to with my grinder setup. I have an Atom 60E on my bench (I know you at one time did too) but I’m ready to move to something else. My considerations really are about whether there’s 1 grinder to cover all my needs, or whether I need to, and if so what combination. My Atom will be fine for a while and I think for milk based drinks I would have a preference for something more traditional. My biggest need right now is a grinder for cupping roasts/filter brews/light and medium espresso. I was wondering whether the mini would do that for me. Sounds like it would. -
crazyhakins. For cupping, you can use a variety of grinders, either flat or conical. The main concern is purging and grind retention. You want to keep each dose as uncontaminated as possible.I have used flats and conicals for cupping. The HG-1 is good for cupping as retention is so low, and since the coffee is immersed, the particle distribution is not overly important.
When it comes to brewing filter coffees (V60, Kona, Tricolate etc,etc) the type of grinder/burrs you use is important. If you have too many fines you have to adjust your technique to avoid astringency. I find conicals, as opposed to flat burrs designed for brewing, to produce more fines and resulting brews can have some astringency. I have been considering the Etzinger hand grinder, but initial reviews are that it is multipurpose and can have a touch too many fines. I was hoping they would have a dedicated burr set for brewing. Other hand grinders are probably the same.
Mind you, I am very pedantic with my filter brews and believe that dedicated flat burrs for brewing are the way to go if you are serious about perfecting filter brews. Grind consistency with minimal fines is preferred, especially when brewing highly aromatic coffees.
I am currently putting a Gevi through its paces and have to say the grinder is superb for filter. I use it for cupping and filter brews and have to agree (so far) with what a couple of beta testers said about the grinder.
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Response from Option-O about removing numbers
...sorry for jumping on this late. Just some background as to what went behind this decision (i.e. removing the number) - it wasn't due aesthetic reasons; it may be to some extent...but only a very small part. With the Mini, a lot of our users are actually relatively new to coffee - a completely different user base compared to our P64 and P100 users where most of you know the in & outs/intricacies and why it is the way it is. The zero-not-corresponding-to-numerical-zero situation confused a significant amount of our user, especially those getting the Mini as their first/second grinder. That being said, we do appreciate we also have a lot of users who have high end grinders like the P100 to go alongside the Mini. joy (it's a good combo tbh)
We initially have that number scale printed the way it was, as we know users (ourselves included) would appreciate it for quick dial in and switching between methods, but that's not at the expense of confusing our users - which was happening.
With the non-numbered version, we also increased the number of ticks/resolution, something that some users are asking and so we hope that’s useful. With this version, you would be using it ala Commandante style (counting clicks from zero). It’s a different workflow, but by no mean it is harder to use – perhaps a slight tweak in mindset/approach, but it's something you can quickly adapt to and don't even think about after a few days. We tried it and didn’t think it was any more cumbersome to use… let us know after some of you have used the new style and think otherwise, but we were pretty comfortable it is good enough to use. To cater for scenarios where the users will be switching between brew & espresso, we are also planning (not yet implemented as of yet) to include different stickers that you could apply to mark the grinder – obviously it would have be something that matches the overall aesthetics and not aesthetically offensive. If you feel the new style isn’t working for your need and need something like this, let us know and we can send some for you to try (after we've finalized the selection).Comment
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Moonshine is available to order now. Same 374 usd price. level3ninja as someone that owns the mini, p100 and p64 could u comment on what you think of the moonshine?Comment
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I don't own a P64, have only pulled a few shots on one with MP burrs. Have only had the P100 for 36 hours, have only pulled a dozen shots on it and made a few pourovers. And the Moonshine burrs haven't had much use yet, I needed to leave my wife capable of walking up and pulling a shot so after a couple of other people with the Moonshine burrs said they couldn't grind fine enough for espresso without it stalling since they produced less fines than the Obsidian and needed to be ground finer, I left them out (I have since learned that these people had the old Mini power supply that stalled at espresso settings for a lot of people). I managed to partially resurrect my old Mini that stripped a gear with a motor from AliExpress, but it's way less powerful (around 10%) and even at filter settings I need to drop feed the beans. I found another one that's about 50% of the original motor power, once that arrives I'll have to see how it goes. Otherwise, once I have the P100 dialled in for espresso and my wife can use it, I'll put the Moonshine burrs in the new Mini and do better testing then. So far the 2-3 V60 I have pulled with them were a step clearer than the Obsidian burrs, but still at least a step more blended than my 1Zpresso Q2 Heptagonal (apparently very close to C40 Mk3/4) and a significantly more than truly unimodal burr set (e.g. 64 MP for V60). More testing is needed, as they aren't anywhere near seasoned yet.
I guess as far as ordering with the Moonshine, my only hesitation is the potential stalling, otherwise I'd say go for it because I'm always going to pick clarity at this part of the burr spectrum (at the MP end I would probably want a step more blended for espresso)Comment
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The case is live on the webstore now. US$45!!! The Nintendo Switch case I use with the foam out of the original cardboard box cost me AU$30 on eBayComment
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Can probably guarantee there will be eerily similar products available on AliExpress soon.Comment
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I've been looking at the Mini recently, and specifically the Moonshine 48mm burrs, since it seems to hit the sweet spot for me in many ways, and critically for me can switch from espresso to other styles and back much easier than some of the other options.
The only issue it may have is the recommended number of espresso shots per day is about half of what I'd want. I'd be looking at ~6 shots per day, in sets of two, over the course of a few hours. Current bean is a medium roast, but I change that fairly frequently, and will probably get both darker and lighter roasts for other styles as I find what I like.
It looks like that would still fit in with Option-O's suggested duty cycle, so long as I adjusted my workflow to allow it enough time between the grinds in each set (between shouldn't be an issue, that's usually 30-45 mins between). But since the recommendation used to be ~3 shots a day for espresso overall, I've now got concerns about longevity.
So to those who have the Mini: Can it actually handle a higher workload, or should I be looking at other options?Comment
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I think it would be a big risk and looking at level3ninja's experience in the post below, perhaps not a risk worth taking.
I have one due to arrive next week. I got the obsidian burrs and I intend to use it as a second espresso grinder for the odd decaf or extra special coffee I happen upon. I'm not even sure I'll use it for cupping my roasts yet, I have an Ode that is doing that job nicely.
I don't really think the Mini could be considered an 'only' grinder, unless you only have a couple off coffees a day. Even if you keep it just within its suggested duty cycle, I feel like using it to its suggested limit is just going to shorten its life anyway.
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Quick update on my Mini situation. The second / replacement Mini suffered the same fate as the first, with the brass gear shredding after approximately 4 months. Option-O were very quick to offer a replacement motor and gearbox which I just installed over the weekend. I had a peek and the new gearbox does not have the brass gear that the old ones had, all gears appear to be made of the same metal.
It is important to note I'm using lighter roasts than most. If the roast is done in reference to second crack (before/after) it is considered dark roast and banned from my house. For espresso I'm using either filter roast or omni roast, depending on what the roaster calls it.
I'm going to be using the Mini for filter mostly now to finally get around to properly testing the Moonshine burrs, though I'll use them for espresso too to test and compare to similar burrs in hand grinders.
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Scarey... this can't be good for resale down the track, how would you know if a unit has the brass gears? Allowing these to grind down to espresso but only for specific roast levels is a minefield for problems. Maybe Lagom should consider issuing a V2 of the Mini with the issues fixed? -
Hi there, I'm looking for this electric motor. Do you mind sending the whole name of the item? I mean the entire label. Thanks.
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Hasn't missed a beat with the new motor but it's primarily been doing filter. I've probably only made 30-40 shots of espresso all year with all grinders including dialling in, so it really isn't getting a workout. Still take it away as a travel grinder and it works a treat.Originally posted by tompoland View PostComment
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Pre ordered direct with Moonshine burrs. Going to test it side by side with the Helor 106 (Mazzer Robur 71mm conical) and see which one I prefer in my travel case paired with a Flair 58.
For Medium and Medium/Light espresso (as per the traditional measures).
Any guesses as to the difference in the cup?Comment
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That's a reasonable concern given some of the earlier posts in this thread.
Two mitigating factors though.
1. L3N roasts his beans so light that they almost float out of his tubes when he takes a lid off. I'll be using medium to medium/light beans so that will put less strain on the motor.
2. After some initial testing, it will only be used when travelling which is a maximum of 30 days a year and more likely closer to 14 days. So it's not going to be a daily driver.
That said, it sounds like the newer versions are holding up well to normal daily home use. -
I have had one of the original minis, with obsidian burrs, since February ‘22. I roast beans from light-med through to medium-dark and would make one to two espressos most days, up to four at a time maybe once a week. So far it hasn’t missed a beat. My sister and her husband have the identical setup and would probably do four espressos a day, every day. They haven’t had any issues either. We’re pretty happy with them.
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