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  • #16
    Thanks for sharing that Katsuya. Looks like a great single dose grinder for price Id be interested to hear your thoughts on the grind retention without the bellows in a couple of weeks once it's run in and grounds have filled up in all the little nooks and crannies

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    • #17
      Originally posted by katsuya View Post
      Day 2 with DF64

      I started with 18g of coffee, grind without using the bellows to show you how it functioned, I didn't spray any water. The grinder stops automatically at 30s. Basically, without using the bellows during grinding process, the grinder retained 1.2g of coffee between the burrs. I was able to get the rest of ground coffee out by turning on the grinder and use the bellows to blow all the retaining coffee out.

      Therefore, the correct way of using this grinder is push the bellows while grinding, then you will get almost no retention.

      https://photos.app.goo.gl/nQaTNd4HMQDHWfwi9
      Yes good share, thanks for the thoughts and experience with this new equipment

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      • #18
        katsuya - hows the experience now a week or so in?

        Very interested in getting one of these or waiting several months to get in the next Niche order. Personally I'm not a big fan of the Niche styling and like the look of the DF64 more. But interested to see how functionally they are and if they perform to a level like the Niche.

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        • #19
          Bump.. how is it going so far katsuya - keen for more of your thoughts on it

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          • #20
            FYI Bplus also sells the DF64 for cheaper price

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            • #21
              I've had this grinder for about a month now and it has been working well. My previous grinder was a eureka specialita with a 3d printed hopper with bellows for single dosing. I didn't have both grinders at the same time so any difference in taste might be placebo but the Df64 seems more balanced. Dose out had always been within 0.2g of dose in with RDT and I don't have any issues with static. Doesn't look as good as the specialita but feels more solid.

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              • #22
                Bit the bullet and placed an order for one tonight. Will play around for a bit an put out a bit of a review.

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                • #23


                  For those interested, this might offer some extra insight on making a decision.

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                  • #24
                    Originally posted by Thom View Post
                    For those interested, this might offer some extra insight on making a decision.
                    The link isn’t working. Is it the Dave Corby YouTube video?

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                    • #25
                      Originally posted by LeroyC View Post
                      The link isn’t working. Is it the Dave Corby YouTube video?
                      If the link isn't working then it's a problem on your end as it's working for for others.

                      It's a James Hoffmann video on YouTube. Direct link: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=53lTlpjM2sQ


                      Java "Working fine here!" phile
                      Toys! I must have new toys!!!

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                      • #26
                        Hi all, sorry I have't come up here much. After two months of using this grinder, i'm generally happy with it. There always a bit of fines at the end of grinding process, which is explained in James Hoffman's video, something I might try to find a solution to. It also create quite a big of mess, James suggests to add some water, I did that and I don't see much benefit. There was this once I put too much water and I guess the coffee became too slippery, the grinder couldn't get the retention to grind the coffee, so it just spins lol.

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                        • EdH
                          EdH commented
                          Editing a comment
                          I’d recommend getting a spray bottle instead of just adding water manually (a cheap one from Daiso is more than sufficient). I live in a dry area in Australia and with RDT I never had any issue with static at all.

                      • #27
                        By the way, coffee tech failed to send me the plastic dosing cup and would not send me one without me paying extra postage again. a bit of frustration there... please bear in mind that I paid NZ$68 for the grinder to be shipped to AU.

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                        • #28
                          Morning all,

                          My DF64 arrived yesterday afternoon so had a (very limited) setup and play.
                          I can't comment on the Niche vs DF64 debate as I have never used the Niche. But I have owned both a large conical and a flat burr grinder.

                          Order: 4/5
                          Ordered Thursday 10 June in the evening via the sole distributor for AUS/NZ (non CS sponsor so won't link or name but it's not hard to figure out who it is). Order was sent 16 June (long weekend and the importer had an expo on in NZ). Unfortunately the stock burrs were sold out and only the titanium nitrate coated ones were available for an extra $100. Importer let me know there was a pretty big delay in getting more and it would be several months so I decided I would just pay the extra to get it here.
                          Arrived 21 June after a short delay in transit through Sydney then Melbourne and finally onto Adelaide.
                          I have spoken with the importer on the phone a couple of times beforehand and shared a number of emails. He is a nice guy and is apparently one of the original designers of the machine (or at the least had some initial input into the design).
                          Service was really good from them, only giving them 4/5 because it took a few extra days to get the order out from the warehouse and they couldn't guarantee they had stock despite the website saying they had 2 on hand.

                          Unboxing: 5/5
                          Nothing exceptional here, standard box. All the parts came as expected including the dosing cup katsuya mentioned was missing in his order.
                          Well packaged with materials so no chance of anything breaking and well marked as fragile.


                          Setup: 5/5
                          Super easy. Everything came out of the box ready to go.
                          I did do a semi-burr alignment with a marker test and rotating the burrs to find the best orientation. I did not shim at this point as I am not convinced it was needed, but might give it a go on the weekend when I have some more time and after some beans have gone through it.
                          Checked all 3 orientations and the last one seemed to be the best overall. Bit hard to see from the photos but the alignment was reasonable without being perfect. This again was really easy to do.
                          I also found the zero point was about half a mark from the zero on the dial which was a bit of a fluke but convenient.
                          The box came with 4 rubber (or maybe silicone) sleeves to go on the portafilter/dosing cup forks. I only used two on the bottom as it was already a tight enough fit.
                          The adjustment collar is easy to spin and I used the suggested range of about 15 marks from the zero point (this was from various forums/users not an official guide) and found I needed to go just a touch finer at maybe 13/14.
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                          Style: 3/5
                          It's not for everyone, but I quite like it.
                          Honestly the DF64 looks much better in person than any of the photos I have seen. I went for the carbon fibre look wrap which is probably a bit more glossy than I would prefer.
                          It also struck me that it was more 'stocky' than the pictures seem - as in wider and not as tall as I thought. This is great because I have a lowish shelf above which makes dosing into the Mazzer a pain, but not for the DF64.
                          The bellows look a bit strange on a grinder but they don't feel cheap to me. It's pretty solid rubber and the lid fits nicely on top of the bellows and on the grinder throat itself. I did find it a little too snug on the throat and if I weren't using the bellows it might be a pain to lift it on and off. I also found that removing the bellows and dosing into the throat easier than removing the lid on top of the bellows.
                          The construction is solid and doesn't feel cheap. The portafilter holder is metal and plastic only on the face plate where the on off switch is, exit chute for grinds and the adjustment collar. The comic sans-esque writing on the adjustment collar while not the best font isn't as bad in person and an easy fix to print a new sticker for if so desired (I would be inclined to do so just to have numbers all the way around).
                          I said I wouldn't comment on the niche (and I haven't seen it in person) but I find the DF64 better looking as the niche has a slight 'appliance-y' feel to it. Some see it more like an apple sleek design, but for me the DF64 looks at least as good if not better. I like the design overall, but perhaps not in love with it.
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                          Workflow: 3/5
                          Next up was to grind some beans.
                          The dosing cup sits well in the holder although a little snug even with just two sleeves on. It being plastic and see through does make it easy to see the grinds coming out and into the cup.
                          The DF64 has the on off switch at the bottom of the grinder which as most people point out as being a bit odd placement which I agree with. It makes it slightly awkward to operate but by no means a deal breaker.
                          The bellows have a slight learning curve to them as well. The first few times I used them I didn't press hard or long enough to get the grinds from behind the static screen out. You need probably 4/5 solid pumps + 4/5 small pumps to get all the grinds out. You can also hear and feel the difference between the static screen being blocked or just blowing out the lose grinds but the screen unblocked. Only took a few shots to grind to work this out.
                          I found that letting the beans grind until only a trickle of grind was coming out then hitting the bellows while the grinder was still running worked best. I have tried both pumping the bellows while running and not running, but doing so while running works best.
                          The dosing cup fits nicely into the holder on the grinder and snugly into a portafilter. Dosing straight into a portafilter is easy too. I have a 58mm portafilter, but he forks probably wouldn't hold a smaller portafilter without some mods.
                          Workflow is okay, but yet to really find a groove so this will probably improve over the next week or so.

                          Retention: 5/5 - 0.1-0.2g average so far
                          Once you get used to the bellows the retention is VERY low.
                          First shot I ground there was about 2g retained - this will be explained by 2 things. First I didn't pump the bellows hard/long enough to blow out the grounds from the static screen which is my fault. Second there will always be nooks and crannies that get filled by grounds that won't be exchanged - so it's not a true 'retention'.
                          Once I got the hang of the bellows I was averaging 0.1-0.2g retained with no RDT (Ross Droplet Technique). I am extremely happy with this and believe that I will probably long term average 0.1g with no RDT using the bellows correctly.

                          Static: 3/5
                          Wasn't an issue for me. There was some minor static around the exit chute and on the portafilter holder but nothing like some of the photos I have seen. It is however winter time but being in SA it is quite dry even in winter. I was expecting much much worse and pleasantly surprised. I have yet to try RDT to see if that makes a difference, but if I can get away without doing it I wont. Dosing into the cup there is some fines getting sprayed into the cup and around on the bench but very minimal. Dosing into a portafilter there is slightly more but this could easily be solved with a dosing funnel. I also expect I will keep using the dosing cup.
                          I have also seen a number of photos of the niche with a similar amount of static/grounds sprayed onto the bench so maybe that's just how it is with the smaller single dose grinders. I'd say it's no different to how much I get from either Mazzer I have owned.



                          Noise: 4/5
                          Hard to compare it without a decibel meter - it's not super loud or quiet either. On par with the super jolly I have had before, maybe slightly quieter. But it's not a quiet grinder and I use it in the small nook I have so it echos the sound somewhat.

                          Flavour: 5/5
                          I have been single dosing exclusively for years and found that both Mazzers I have had really just aren't setup for that. Immediately I could get a much better clarity in the cup. Less sour and bitter,the floral notes were more evident also.
                          Part of this will be a new burr set proving a better grind consistency, lower retention meaning less stale coffee from the previous grind and a small portion of flat vs conical taste (which I won't get into).

                          Price: 5/5
                          $882 NZD including delivery and an extra $100 for the TiN coated burrs. Works out to about $820 AUD (I had a small amount of money left in NZ so didn't need to pay any bank fees etc which might add up to another $20 or so maybe?).
                          However compared to other single dose grinders at the moment it's roughly $200+ cheaper than the niche (if you can get one from the retailer in the UK) and a few recent sales on the forum make it $500 cheaper if you went with stock burrs.

                          Overall: 4/5
                          Apart from the small quirks like the power button in a weird place I love it.
                          I do agree with James Hoffman's comments about the quirks but I don't think they are by any means deal breakers. Certainly from a performance and cost point of view it's going to be really hard to beat.
                          I will update this thread with some more comments over the next few days/weeks as I get to know the grinder a little better.

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                          • WhatEverBeansNecessary
                            WhatEverBeansNecessary commented
                            Editing a comment
                            For anyone interested I did the sums and I am average 0.14g retention at the moment.
                            Will do a sweep of the grind chamber and see what a "true" retention is less any reasonable exchange.

                        • #29
                          Originally posted by WhatEverBeansNecessary View Post
                          Morning all,

                          My DF64 arrived yesterday afternoon so had a (very limited) setup and play.

                          Just signed up to say thanks so much for taking the time to write that up - you have convinced me to get one!

                          Cheers

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                          • WhatEverBeansNecessary
                            WhatEverBeansNecessary commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Most welcome! I'm glad someone got something out of my ramblings.

                            After having another day of play I have decided I really like the grinder and the workflow is getting better already. Static is a very minor issue for me at the moment, but I might give a mod a go for the improved anti static screen.

                            As a side not the AU/NZ importer is looking at options for a service agent here in Aus which will make any warranty issues much easier.

                        • #30
                          Spent the weekend in lockdown so I made the mythos declumper tool (based off the Singaporean YouTube channel).

                          Grinds much better, virtually no static and no need to push the bellows much anymore (previously the 5th or 6th push will pump out a chuck of grinds).

                          Definitely recommend it from a workflow perspective.

                          Next up might be making the anti popcorn mod given there’s still another week of lockdown.

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                          • WhatEverBeansNecessary
                            WhatEverBeansNecessary commented
                            Editing a comment
                            Must admit I have also done the same mod with the anti-static/declumper screen made from plastic. Found it stops the need for aggressive pumps of the bellows.

                            Get some minor static but it's mostly chaff (from the super chaff-y Yemen) which follows after pushing the bellows.
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