New Grinder/ machine ballance

[coffeemachine]

Looking good!! Don't forget room for the grinder!

[smeltitdeltit]

Thanks. I did t realise there Technika is almost as large as the Synch or 700. Not a deal breaker but something I need to look at carefully (with a grinder I’m probably pushing the limit). I’ve attached a pro 600 AR photo of how I will locate my machine for perspective.

Slight off topic, how does the quick mill DBs compare to the Profitec?

[coffeemachine]

"You will make a better cup of coffee with a high end grinder and a small domestic machine than a cheap grinder and a top of the range commercial espresso machine". The World Atlas of Coffee, J Hoffman

[coffeemachine]

Example of steaming for machine
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=335oD8u_61c


Good hands on with the machine, milk steaming at the 8min mark.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c21-ehesLdc&t=571s

It is a very impressive little machine.

[GARYCAMP]

Steam pressure is good no complaints it does nice microfoam.

[smeltitdeltit]

I just bought the ECM Technika V PID Rotary a couple weeks ago and its temperature very stable same tasting coffee every time just playing around with the flow control i was going go with the ECM Synchronika V3 which was $1000 dearer for a couple of coffees a day bit of a over kill as said in a earlier post.
But whatever machine you pick enjoy it nothing is better than making your own coffees at home with the right beans.

Thanks! How have your found the steam performance out of interest?

[GARYCAMP]

I just bought the ECM Technika V PID Rotary a couple weeks ago and its temperature very stable same tasting coffee every time just playing around with the flow control i was going go with the ECM Synchronika V3 which was $1000 dearer for a couple of coffees a day bit of a over kill as said in a earlier post.
But whatever machine you pick enjoy it nothing is better than making your own coffees at home with the right beans.

[coffeemachine]

You will enjoy this new machine! Congrats.

[MaverickJohn]

This is the one thing i learnt. The grinder is almost always the more important of the purchasing decisions.
I ordered the atom 65e but got several good recommendations my purpose for ordering this over a single dose as i generally host things at my place and needed a fast but good grinder to deliver a larger amount of coffee.
All research and opinions tend to go to very good single dosing such as niche/df64/p64.
But you need to get what suits your needs.
The niche zero is planned for a August dispatch. P64 is til late October.
I'm really grateful to this community. Very intelligent crew here
For reference I got a fairly great deal from Coffeeteca.
It came with 1kg Coffee and a tamping mat and also cheaper than competition.
The chrome will also match your new machine but is slightly pricier (it's what I bought)

They are both super options.
I had in my mind what i was set on buying. It was just between choosing the best value proposition.
I asked for opinions of people in the forums for help, and helped me with my decision. The ECM is universally regarded for their finish and attention to detail, however i went for cheaper machine with same feature set as the details werent something that i was worried about, as long as they were as durable as each other i was ok.
I got myself the la pavoni botticelli specialty which was a Dual boiler, Rotary pump, dual PID with flow control.
The ECM would have cost me $1500 extra. and thats ok if finish was also a priority. I consider myself practical with my money, i ended up buying the grinder and machine for less price than a synchronika

[smeltitdeltit]

Will do!! Leaning Technika or 600 I think.

[coffeemachine]

Happy to help! Its a journey for all us, without a final destination. smeltitdeltit keep us posted with your final decision.

Interesting how the commercial link got removed.

[MaverickJohn]

Hahaha I just upgraded from an oracle but only because I didn't like it. I enjoyed the 920 more than the oracle.
I ended up buying the la pavoni Botticelli specialty. Same features as the profitec pro 700.
You will be amazed at what your next machine will be like over the oracle. It's night and day

[MaverickJohn]

Not sure if it's possible for a grinder to be overkill for an espresso machine. Most people make the opposite mistake. The espresso machines you mentioned will benefit from the best grinder money can buy (doesn't mean the most expensive). The Eurkeka will certainly not be overkill. Great choices, all of them.

This is the one thing i learnt. The grinder is almost always the more important of the purchasing decisions.
I ordered the atom 65e but got several good recommendations my purpose for ordering this over a single dose as i generally host things at my place and needed a fast but good grinder to deliver a larger amount of coffee.
All research and opinions tend to go to very good single dosing such as niche/df64/p64.
But you need to get what suits your needs.
The niche zero is planned for a August dispatch. P64 is til late October.
I'm really grateful to this community. Very intelligent crew here
For reference I got a fairly great deal from Coffeeteca.
It came with 1kg Coffee and a tamping mat and also cheaper than competition.
The chrome will also match your new machine but is slightly pricier (it's what I bought)

[coffeemachine]

I feel the 700 would be overkill given the drinks you are making. Check out the machines in store as that may swing you also. Heck you might see the 700 and love it!

I have only had machines with water tanks, and as I roast towards the darker side for beans, I don't really think that pre-infusion will help me (my understanding is that pre-infusion is better for medium to lighter roasts and really benefits those drinking SO espresso).

You can always buy this sort of add-on to give you manual control of the pressure and then do the pre-infusion yourself. It works with any E61 machine.
https://www.jetblackespresso.com.au/...rate-regulator

There are so many variables with espresso without even looking at pressure (how dark do you roast beans, temp of the machine, grams in the puck, volume of extraction and so on) that pressure just adds more complexity that I probably don't need.

When I started to think about a new machine earlier this year I was set on getting a pressure profiling machine (like the new VBM super digital or Crem one), but the more I researched the more I realised these were features that probably would not help me and I could put my money elsewhere. Also previous to my Rocket I had a Rancilio Silvia which lasted over 12 years, it was a simple single boiler machine and lasted a long time. I was really keen to have the next machine last a long time. I am sure those machines I mentioned will last, but there is something to be said for keeping things simple and focusing on reliability. This is why I like ECM/Profitec, they build solid machines and keep things simple. I don't know if I will be able to get a replacement LCD in 10 years time for those other machines, but I know I will be able to service my Profitec for many years to come.

I make a decent cup of coffee like most people here and now quite consistent, I don't ever feel I need to head down to the local cafe, that is pretty much what we are all trying to do at some level. In fact I find that I am pretty unimpressed with Cafe's when I need to go there, and I am always picking out their mistakes! Oh the life of a coffee snob.....

So to answer your question, no I do not miss line pre-infusion. With tank machines, you can lift the group head leaver and get pre-wetting of the puck (from the pressure in the boiler), I tried that a few times, but just made the extraction time faster and I could not tell how much water was getting into the puck. So all I do is lift the group head leaver and extract.

The 700 is super quiet, you cannot really hear it at all. The 600 has a vib pump is much quieter than my Rocket, but of course you hear it. However grinding beans and steaming milk is much nosier and it is hard to dampen the sound of those activities. The vib pump on the 600 is pretty quite, they have put it on rubber stands, I can live with the noise level from it, it does not wake up the whole house. It is almost pleasant, but I am really biased.

Another advantage to vib pumps is they take a while to come up to pressure, so you get natural pre-infusion from them. The rotary pumps hit full pressure almost straight away. When you go to the shop, take some of your beans, get them to grind them and pull shots. It is what is in the cup that matters, the machine and grinder help of course. But can you tell the difference in the cup?

Happy to answer any more questions. People here are all very helpful.

[smeltitdeltit]

Wow, thanks so much for the detailed advice.

I see today the 600 going for $3750 AUD, which is about the cheapest I’ve seen the Technika V. So DB or HX same price. Weighing up rotary vs vib I guess.

size wise, I can make the 700 work but it certainly is at the max I could do, prefer a bit smaller.

one main reason I’m interested in rotary ECM Tech or the 700 is the line pre infusion when plumbed.

is this something you’ve found you wish you had in the 600?