Zack & Danis Coffee Roaster story and review

[Javaphile]

Do you still use the 'water cooled bean' method? :-)

Nope! Just lots and lots of air! That method disappeared from my regimen very quickly as I learned when to pull the roast so that the cool down time was taken into consideration. With a metal container, a fan that can move a goodly amount of air through the beans, and the ability to move the beans around there's no real need to do a quench.


Java "Blow baby blow!" phile

[DesigningByCoffee]

Do you still use the 'water cooled bean' method? :-)

[Javaphile]

I re-uploaded the pics in post 12 as the site that hosted them long ago disappeared.

Re-reading those long ago posts gave me a good laugh seeing how much my drinks have changed and yet stayed the same. While the roaster long ago died and was replaced the La Cimbali M28 is still doing its usual great job oozing its golden nectar into the same mini beer stein type cups and steaming up the same great microfoam.


Java "Hhhmmmm...Fresh coffee!" phile

[DesigningByCoffee]

Ahhh yes - since the depression… :-)
Speaking of which - we've been watching the Waltons with our kids (since there's nothing worth watching on Telly on sat night anymore!) and has anyone seen Ike's store coffee grinder?
Not one for the benchtop! Similar to this…



BTW read Java's review - now not on my Chrissie list!

[Yelta]

I've only been a CSer for 4 score and 7 years now!

Well now DBC, you certainly take the honour's in the seniority stakes, a CoffeeSnobber for 87 years eh.

[DesigningByCoffee]

Ahhhh no wonder I haven't seen it around on the more recent reviews. I've only been a CSer for 4 score and 7 years now! That is an old post…
Have to read your review on it now - find out what I've been missing! :-)

[Javaphile]

It's been around for a long time. In fact it's one of the earlier roasters to have been reviewed on here, by guess who? http://coffeesnobs.com.au/roasters/2...ry-review.html


Java "Blast from the past!" phile

[Yelta]

Hi all
Just stumbled across this - maybe its been around for a bit…The Nesco Roaster.

150g capability. Obviously limited in its true profiling ability, but the adjustable roast time in a popper style arrangement (23mins in the youtube clip) has the potential for good results. I was also intrigued by the auger complementing the fan - to keep the beans moving really well - always an issue with the popper in my limited experience. (Wonder if you could make one for a popper?) And less than $200!
I was quite impressed :-)

Well, that got me inspired - better go jump into some El Sal in the triple basket, 7 days post from the ole fashioned corretto!!

Matt

Not a bad idea, however the tiny 150 gram capacity of these small machines has me wondering, with a machine this size I would have to roast every second day, one roast of 725g per week is sufficient for me.

[DesigningByCoffee]

Haven't seen this one before…

Hi all
Just stumbled across this - maybe its been around for a bit…The Nesco Roaster.

150g capability. Obviously limited in its true profiling ability, but the adjustable roast time in a popper style arrangement (23mins in the youtube clip) has the potential for good results. I was also intrigued by the auger complementing the fan - to keep the beans moving really well - always an issue with the popper in my limited experience. (Wonder if you could make one for a popper?) And less than $200!
I was quite impressed :-)

Well, that got me inspired - better go jump into some El Sal in the triple basket, 7 days post from the ole fashioned corretto!!

Matt

[Javaphile]

Re: Zack & Danis Coffee Roaster story and rev

Andy:

The problem with scaling up this would be the catalytic converter. If you increase the amount of beans youre roasting of course the amount of smoke also increases. It could certainly be scaled up but Im not sure how easily at home. Commercially the cost of the larger catalytic converter would very quickly cost as much as an afterburner I think.

An additional problem is that above a certain temp the catalytic conver quickly starts loosing its effectiveness. As I recall from some work in the field years ago this temp is right around 450-500F so youre really pushing the limits using it in a coffee bean roaster.

I have seen a commercial scale hot air roaster that does somewhere around 1.5-2.5kg I believe but it did not use a catalytic converter.

I have no plans to try and scale this unit up. Im shopping around for a commercial quality drum roaster that will allow me to do between .5kg and 2.5kg of beans. Hopefully it wont take me years to find a deal on one. For a commercial quality roaster Id convert my homes back entryway into a dedicated roasting area with a powered vent to the outside. I wouldnt be doing but maybe one roast a day so I think I could get away with no afterburner and no complaints from the neighbors. Hell, in this neighborhood it would probably never even be noticed!


FrenchBean:

I couldnt agree more. When I spoke with this supervisor/owner(?) I even gave them the specs that I thought would fix the problem simply by reworking their existing die (I used to design and Quality Control check plastic injection molding dies) and explained to her how simple and cheap a fix it was and that by doing this even if their assembly was sloppy the enlarged gasket would compensate and prevent any leakage.

I was blown away that in this day and age of such massive consumer litigation here in the States that a company would take such a cavalier attitude towards a defect they openly admitted existed in their product. I think they just hope that no one notices it and put off the long roasting times to other things like low voltage or cool air temp and that they clean their roaster after every roast. If you do that youll probably never notice the presence of the leak. You have to do multiple lighter roasts with-out cleaning the top before the blow-by becomes obvious, or perhaps only a couple darker roasts, but unless youre turning the beans into darn near carbon it will not be noticable after only one roast. The leak can not be felt as its too near hot areas to get your hand up next to it, plus it is in the path of the exhaust from the roaster making it virtually impossible to detect just by feeling for the air coming out from around either of the two top gaskets. I think this is exactly what theyre counting on.

Java "<shaking his head> I cant believe the stupidity of some people" phile

[FrenchBean]

Re: Zack & Danis Coffee Roaster story and rev

Sometimes the stubbornness of companies like this doesn’t realize that their actions or inactions will someday come back and bit them on the behind..... A bit of courteous advice from a Roaster/Customer was given but not heeded.... The consequence of this is world wide BAD publicity...... I don’t blame you

FB

[Andy]

Re: Zack & Danis Coffee Roaster story and rev

Thanks for the update Javaphile.

Its a pity that you got so much grief from this roaster, it looked promising to start with. Having engineered your own fix do you think that the design could be "scaled-up" to a bigger "home-made" roaster?

The idea of smoke extraction interests me, and it seems that a lot of the industrial sized roasters use an after-burner setup to burn-off at least some of the smoke.

... I feel the need to play ;D

[Javaphile]

Re: Zack & Danis Coffee Roaster story and rev

Sorry all, I just realized I never posted the results of my dealing with Z&Ds over the blow-by/leak issue.

After not hearing from the supervisor (part owner maybe?) for a week I called them back and recieved a call back the next day. 1 Day before I was leaving for Christmas. Far too late for them to get me a roaster in time to do my Christmas present roasts. According to the head honcho there (I was told there was no one in the company higher than her that I could talk too) they are aware of this leak issue and IT IS ACCEPTABLE TO THEM!!! They acknowledged that my roaster is out of spec and that there *shouldnt be a leak, but that it would cost them too much to fix the problem that lead to it. A conclusion I *strongly dissagree with as simply making the gaskets bigger would solve the problem at a cheap price as they could simply retool their existing die. They stated that because of this they would NOT replace nor fix my roaster. There fix for this problem will be to crank up the heat on the next production run. Which of course means that the catalytic converter will not be as effiecient and more smoke will be released, in addition to the added smoke coming from the leak. There-by negating the roasters biggest selling point, its smokeless operation.

I got the supervisor to agree to allow me to take the roaster apart to fix the problem myself with-out voiding my warranty (*what warranty?) by doing so.

I was able to fix the leak with about 15 minutes of work by repositioning the components to bring them into proper placement with each other.

Fixing the leak has reduced the time to 2nd crack by about 2 minutes, a *very noticable difference.

All in all their attitude of dollars being more important than selling a properely designed/assembled product and their flat-out refusal to fix a problem they acknowledged existed (dispite their written warranty saying they would fix such a problem) left me with a very sour taste in my mouth and prompted me to do something Ive never before in my life done, contact comsumer protection agencies, the Better Business Bureau, and the Attorneys General in both mine and their state.

So the long and the short of it is, if you buy one of these roasters its very possible that there will be problems with it and they wont fix it. They acknowledge that the problem exsists and is not solely on my unit but potentially exists on all units being produced and they wont fix them.

Needless to say when its time to replace this roaster Z&Ds will NOT be getting anymore business from me.

Java "Z&Ds can kiss my you know what" phile

[Javaphile]

Re: Zack & Danis Coffee Roaster story and rev

The latest news on the Z&D roaster is I called them up today and asked them to send me another unit.

My gasket/quality_of_assembly worries were justified as it turns out. One of the two top gaskets isnt sealing and has an area that is allowing blow-by, there-by reducing the air flow accross the beans and lowering the temp of the air. No wonder roasts, especially 2nd crack, were taking so long!

You can see the area of blow-by (the brown oil/smoke stain in the middle of the lid that extends out to the right from the left opening) in this pic:



Also note the off-center ring of oil/smoke accumulation around the right opening. Heres a close-up of it:



After being escalated up to the supervisor and giving her a detailed explanation of the problem it was obvious she considered it to be operator error, although how this particular problem could be is beyond me.

To make a long story short theyre not going to do anything until their engineers and the manufacturers engineers have reviewed the photos and info I sent. Which Im afraid will be far too late to get me a properly working roaster in time to do my Christmas present roasts.

Well see what happens, but based on my experience today Im far from happy with their customer service.

Java I want a properly working roaster! phile

[Javaphile]

Re: Zack & Danis Coffee Roaster story and rev

I love the sweet Coffee cream taste in the dregs of a Latté IF you get it right.

Rich

These have that rich flavor seamlessly blended into the flavors of the espresso itself. A truely unique flavor that Ive never before tasted.

I find the microfoam (I use Whole Milk for the microfoam) really helps blend and tie all the flavors together when its properly made. Its like it picks up all the molecules of the espresso and holds them all in its little bubbles just waiting for a tongue to break on where-upon all those rich flavors are released in a velvety slide into the mouth. uuummm..nummy!

Ill do the single espresso pull straight into the 6oz tall glasses I like to use (think mini beer stein), prewarmed of course with boiling water, and then add in a slight amount of sugar on top of the crema, then pour a small amount of the microfoam in and give it a few quick swirls with the spoon and then do a hard pour of the rest of the microfoam. Ive no idea what others call it, but when I pour the milk/foam into the glass with the intention of causing it to mix with the espresso I call it a hard pour. As oppossed to a soft pour where you want to retain the distinct layers.

Doing the hard pour like this results in the espresso mixing in with most of the microfoam but leaving about a 2cm head of pure foam on the top and centered inside a cylinder of foam/espresso.

The entire glass tastes like those dregs of a perfect latte.

I generally call this a latte, but it really isnt. No idea what its called. LOL I just call it my special.

Java "Sipping down another" phile