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5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

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  • 5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

    I need to buy a new 5 kg drum roaster, and i would like to know your experienced opinion.
    My approach is to find the best compromise between price and quality, but Im able to consider the most expensive choice since Im looking for quality first...Im willing to economically dedicate the most important "slice" of my business plan for the "best" roaster available.
    I just finished to read the Willem Boots article on Sept-Oct Roast magazine issue about what to consider before making a conscious decision.

    Im evaluating all the model from the main manufacturer like Ambex, Diedrich, Giesen, Toper, US Roaster corp, Brambati, Petroncini, San Franciscan, Has Garanti, Ozcaffe, Scolari engineering, Wampa, Coffetech, Sivetz, Joper, Gothot and........PROBAT.
    It seems that the best roasting companies lean towards Probat (like sweetmarias founder Tom Owen...my "morning star" for this business), but I saw great roasting company using Diedrich, Gothot and others as well.

    I want to know why Probat is the most expensive, and I would like to know it from a technical prospective, please dont just tell me that "they are the market leader".
    Are their drum better? Why?
    Are their airflow better? Why?
    Are their components material better? Why?
    Are they burner better? Why?
    Do they roast the beans better? Why?
    :-) :-)
    Talking about a very important aspect of the purchase for me, that is the full roast profile automation system, it seems that they dont offer the best choice out there.
    For example, it seems that the "logofile artisan" system from Praxis International is much more extensive.
    Im also looking with interest at the evolution of the "artisan" opensource roast project http://code.google.com/p/artisan/

    Thanks for your help.

  • #2
    Re: 5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

    Bon Jorno Ruben,

    It could be that the Probat is a name that carries certain prestige in the roasting industry. A name that is well regarded, something like a Rancillio Silvia or a Giotto would be in the espresso machine category.

    Reason? The questions you listed can/will be answered by a number of qualified hands on roasters of the Probat shortly.

    It would certainly be a substantial upgrade from the FZ-RR700 baby roaster Ruben
    Is it still working?

    Looking forward to the answers to your enquiry.

    Gary at G

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: 5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

      Originally posted by 34332423283521273422232A2A2F460 link=1295467329/0#0 date=1295467329
      Im willing to economically dedicate the most important "slice" of my business plan for the "best" roaster available.

      Hi there... you might want to check out Stonka in New Zealand as well.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: 5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

        Welcome Rubens,

        There are many good roasters and times change as do countries of origin of some of the more major brands.

        Best bet is to see whats available near you (same country would be handy!) and then speak with the respective people. Not much use in buying a roaster from a NZ firm if you have no local support.  :-?

        Although many 2-30kg roasters have a lot in common, its frequently the things that you cant see or may not understand which make the difference between a roaster and a great roaster.

        If you can see a roast and sample the results, all the better. If youre new to roasting, bring someone who understands what needs to happen and when it should happen along with you to assist in the evaluation.

        Good luck

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: 5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

          Welcome to CS Rubens.

          a) 2mcm above has already answered the question in its simplest form ( the question) as in:

          "...Although many 2-30kg roasters have a lot in common, its frequently the things that you cant see or may not understand which make the difference between a roaster and a great roaster...."

          You wrote:
          ".......Im evaluating all the model from the main manufacturer like Ambex, Diedrich, Giesen, Toper, US Roaster corp, Brambati, Petroncini, San Franciscan, Has Garanti, Ozcaffe, Scolari engineering, Wampa, Coffetech, Sivetz, Joper, Gothot and........PROBAT...."

          I am sorry but you cant evaluate this list of roasting equipment because they are not all of the same type. You have drum batch roasters, you have air roasters, and you have hybrid drum/air roasters, you have well respected brand names next other brand names, you have brands that specialise in large plants next to brands that cater to small plants....all in the same group. They cant be compared.

          You have brands that offer PLC add ons for small size machines and brands that dont, and you are including brands that for any given sized batch machine, cost a veritable "squillion" dollars next to others that sell for "a song".

          There are horses for courses and for different sized roasting plants, some manufacturers have greater expertise than others....

          All this is nothing more than a list of manufacturers / brand names....

          Also you wrote "...It seems that the best roasting companies lean towards Probat (like sweetmarias founder Tom Owen...my "morning star" for this business), but I saw great roasting company using Diedrich, Gothot and others as well...."

          But this also means nothing. Roast Masters have their pet brands, some are close minded individuals and wont look at other brands when it comes time to grow and update, while other Roast Masters are flexible and like to keep up with the technology.....this is nothing more than individual personal preference and opinion, perhaps simple proximity of a roaster to an equipment manufacturer, perhaps a pitch by the roaster to a certain client market sector, or whatever...

          Some manufacturers give poor service and others give great service, some are flexible and listen to the Roast Masters needs and others are not......who says anyone is a "best roasting company", and dont forget that the internet lends itself superbly to brand names being turned into icons for no reason other than the anecdotes placed up on intenet Lists by many people that actually dont have the real knowledge and are only repeating parrot fashion what they heard some one else say......on some other list......

          If you want a 5 kilo starter machine there is no point talking to Scolari unless you want to sell your house, your fathers house, and your grandparents house to put down a deposit. If you live in Turkey tou would be mad not to simply buy a good name Turkish roaster, and if you live in Europe, why buy American stuff when the major European names are at your doorstep......!

          Again, horses for courses.

          This is not to discourage you.

          2mcm made another observation worthy of your note:
          "... Best bet is to see whats available near you (same country would be handy!) and then speak with the respective people...."

          Hope this helps

          Regardz,
          Attilio
          very first CS site sponsor

          PS someone above wrote "bon jorno"......you are in Italy????? Se sei in Italia ci sono alcune fabriche che sono molto ma molto in gamba...e perche no? Devi domandare aiuto da i costruttori...sono loro che ti devono avvisare per la situazione tua. E poi vedrai quelli che sono capaci non solo di venderti una macchina, ma se ti danno limpressione che saranno in gamba di dare lassistenza technica nel futturo che oviamente dovrai avere..... Anchio dopo 26 anni di esperienza, sono scapato da un costruttore che aveva prezzi buoni, ma il modo di fare non a dato fiducia della sua capacita di darmi assistenza buona dopo la vendita......

          Apologies a) for my broken Italian and b) if you are not even italian ;D

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: 5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

            Bon Jorno Attilio. Moto bene.

            Si. He is indeed Italiano. The best man to speak to if you want to know about the FZ-RR700 baby roaster.

            Gugliamo at G

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: 5 kg roaster evaluation: why Probat is the most expensive?

              Ok there are enough roasting machine manufacturers in Italy to poke 3 sticks at and there is some very very good technology being incorporated into the machines FOR THOSE THAT ARE WILLING TO BE OPEN MINDED and dont simply go down the path of ..."....the only good roaster is a 50 year old probat roaster...."

              Not that I am saying there is anything at all wrong with that brand....I had one for 25 years and am quite knowledgeable and realistic about the strengths and limitations of the model that I had. I am simply challenging the blind repetition of internet myth to build a manufacturer name into some kind of nirvana for people with no experience to strive for........ and that name isnt the only one that has undergone this phenomenon in cyberspace :

              You have to make a choice of whether you want

              a) traditional drum batch roaster ( roast by conduction)

              b) air roaster (roast by convection)

              c) a drum batch roaster with variable air speed (roast by conduction AND convection at the same time)

              Then you can approach various Italian manufacturers and see how you go.

              In the end however/......most starters in the business I imagine would go with a low priced traditional drum batch roaster certainly in the size of a 5 kilo batch. You should be able to fall over them anywhere in Italy!  

              Regardz,
              Attilio.

              Comment

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