Wood roasting

[DesigningByCoffee]

Great review Chris

[TC]

As promised, chapter 2.

We opened the second pack this morning: "good night". No gas once again but the bag wasn't rancid. Some promise...

#1 shot? Bang on. No wastage of my $30 to dial in. Lower body (as the blend promised) but sadly many of the same cup characteristics of the other one with the nasty finish. I didn't finish my shot. Tried it under milk and came to the decision that I wouldn't order a second if presented this coffee. 3 us had tried the other batch and all of us agreed that this was better than the other blend. If we use the term "clean" to refer to some coffees, I can only offer the opposite- dirty.

Time to play with some minds. I have some regular Saturday morning milky coffee people and chose two- both of whom have very good palates. One adds a little sugar to his coffee as well. We had P2 on today and I made a second using the wood-fired for each client without telling them what it was and asked for feedback. Neither was prepared to finish the unknown coffee. They were surprised when told it was a $60/kg blend.

Conclusions? I have enough info now to reinforce that there is huge value in profiling and whilst there are no doubt people who prefer one method to the other, I'm more than happy to keep on the pathway I am on.

My nonna taught me a few things too. She was old enough and wise enough to know that times change and whilst reminiscing and nostalgia have their place, she taught me that there is value in embracing progress.

I have no doubt that it's possible to create great wood fire coffee. Perhaps one day, I'll get to sample one.

[TOK]

You may have missed that the point of the discussion in this thread was not about wood roasting per se- rather the value in profiling roasts v hoping for the best.

Well said C, and thanks for the update, although after the shoddy treatment you received above, you've been unbelievably fair in taking the time (a cost) to visit their roasterie and give them some of your hard earned. I dont know that I would have bothered.

Looking forward to your next cupping.

[MrJack]

On the other hand, I would like a dollar for every roast that has been under/over done because the roaster blindly followed the numbers, failing to use sight and smell as an indicator that something is not quite right.

Never mind the fact that the area is full of smoke and flames are licking out of the machine, the profile called for x number of minutes and we are still 4 mins short, so, let her run.

If your "numbers" are wrong, then you're not really following the profile (you just think you are).

Of course the Captain of the big ship won't follow his GPS or compass if it's leading him straight at the shore or to the wrong port (unless he's an idiot, or perhaps sailing a Greek cruise ship). However, I don't imagine there would be many out there who steer their big ship blindfolded, guided by the feel of the wind and the screams of the sailors...

[TC]

Settle down everyone, there is a wood roaster in Lilyfield Sydney that has been there for some time, so wood roasting is no new thing, nothing to get our knickers in a knot.

You may have missed that the point of the discussion in this thread was not about wood roasting per se- rather the value in profiling roasts v hoping for the best.

[patro5]

Settle down everyone, there is a wood roaster in Lilyfield Sydney that has been there for some time, so wood roasting is no new thing, nothing to get our knickers in a knot.

[TC]

To update this thread, I shelled out 30 of my hard earned for 2 x 250g today. One of each blend. Roast dates were 27 Feb and 13 Mar respectively. These were selected from the rear of the dozen or so bags on display. The front ones were older again with roast dates back to January. No single origin at all.

The roastery looks terrific. The bags of greens on display were from one of our larger Melbourne brokers. I couldn't see too much....

The older one: "Good Morning"... Nothing from the bag valve. Not too dark/no visible oil on opening but the bag smelled rancid. We experimented with pours.

On duty was the Leva. We had a panel of 5 tasters and although I was really hoping to say that I had consumed a massive slice of humble pie; all I can offer is that I suspect "the big ship" may have ran aground. Good crema. The shots varied from acrid to astringent and just plain yuck to my palate (and the rest of the panel as well). Not nice at all and yes, the smoke was there. Perhaps a good serve of milk and sugar would have helped, but I am not so sure.

I'm happy to hold off on a final opinion until we try the other but at this point, it reinforces the value in profiling roasts.

I'll open the other bag on Saturday and see what it offers when consumed with less age.

One wonders whether these newspaper articles are really just advertorials?

[chokkidog]

Willem Boot writes aout this very principle in one of his much read articles, here: https://bootcoffee.com/wp-content/up...int_July05.pdf



[QUOTE=mds;551007I this forum has become one big peeing contest dominated by a handful of bullies - you know who you are - who if they don't agree with you are quickly to put you down. And we talk about free speech?

Most disappointing.

Mel[/QUOTE]

It's a shame that the posting of an article has been hijacked by a troll and their sycophant and turned into a thread of something else.

Bullies!! What bullies? Peeing contest?? Any examples?? Nah..... didn't think so.

You know you're 'free' to name names and give examples.

Just some dribble from behind the computer of another brave, courageous cyber warrior. ;-)

Bullies and trolls aren't tolerated on this site and are banned pronto......

Know anyone who's been banned lately?? :-D

[Yelta]

I suggest you read posts #7 (your first in this thread), #8 and #9 again and have a think about who made this 'personal'. There's absolutely no angst in TC's reply (#8) to your post (#7) and in fact he begins by concurring with your first point. You then respond with what many would perceive as a personal affront, "Yeah, for you. Perhaps you lack his intuitive sense." (#9).

I'm sorry, but this really comes across as trolling (even if not intended as such).

I suggested something similar (was deleted) TLC certainly comes across as an angry person.

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

With all due respect, no one owes anyone any reverence based on the number of posts they do or don't have. In fact, suggesting that I do is a little condescending, so don't do it. The elevated sense of self-worth this little clique ascribes to itself always manifests itself in your treatment of newbies. I find it both amusing and annoying. Grow up, and treat new participants with a little respect. It is, at least, encouraging to see some objective debate in some of these subsequent posts.

I suggest you read posts #7 (your first in this thread), #8 and #9 again and have a think about who made this 'personal'. There's absolutely no angst in TC's reply (#8) to your post (#7) and in fact he begins by concurring with your first point. You then respond with what many would perceive as a personal affront, "Yeah, for you. Perhaps you lack his intuitive sense." (#9).

I'm sorry, but this really comes across as trolling (even if not intended as such).

[TC]

Hi Chris,
I would be interested in your findings, especially if you run it through one of the levers you have. Not interested in a side by side, with any other coffee.
I was gifted some wood roasted coffee a few years ago, roasted in the USA and it was two weeks old when I got it (carry on luggage). I really enjoyed it, but did not have my lever at the time. Forgot the name of the roaster, but they serve it via a lever in one of their establishments.
Anyway, looking forward to a non biased review.

Will do Bosco. I really hope it's good as the more great places to do coffee, the better.

Back to topic:

What I do know is that no amount of practise on known profiles would allow me to replicate them perfectly without logging them. A shade or two lighter or darker makes a difference. 30 sec either way makes a difference. 5 deg either way makes a difference. 5 deg cooler or warmer ambient temp at drop makes a difference. 5 deg higher or lower at turn makes a difference. 500g more or less mass at drop makes a difference. I could keep going....

In my opinion, anyone who believes s/he has all of this nailed without profiling roasts must clearly know everything. When you know everything, it's time to get out as your mind closed to learning a long time ago. I'm happy to keep learning with technology, my senses and by logged and documented experimentation.

[burr]

Umm I take it most people contributing here roast for personal (or commerical) use, but $15 for 250 g really isn't that outrageous, check out Campos' prices. I appreciate that great quality coffee can be sourced for much cheaper (i.e. beanbay) but years ago when I bought from various cafe roasters $45/kg was the going rate.

p.s. kudos to the wood roasters for atleast giving it a go, consider the article is written for the average bloke. After spending three years to work out the profile I'm sure its consistent enough not to require a thermometer.

[TC]

Wow! Quite the prima donna! Buddy.

Once again welcome to CoffeeSnobs. I feel you have introduced yourself well to our resident members and they now have a good idea of what you're like. Enjoy your time here.

[Bosco_Lever]

I'll be buying some out of curiosity. At $60/kg when purchased in 250g bags, I'm hoping to get my socks blown off.

Hi Chris,
I would be interested in your findings, especially if you run it through one of the levers you have. Not interested in a side by side, with any other coffee.
I was gifted some wood roasted coffee a few years ago, roasted in the USA and it was two weeks old when I got it (carry on luggage). I really enjoyed it, but did not have my lever at the time. Forgot the name of the roaster, but they serve it via a lever in one of their establishments.
Anyway, looking forward to a non biased review.

[fatboy_1999]

I find it interesting how many people start posts with the phrase "With all due respect" and then proceed to show none at all.
Usually whilst chastising others for not showing enough respect.

As for the topic, at $60 per kilo, I'll let others try out the product and stick with my usual supply chains.