Results 1 to 12 of 12

Thread: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

  1. #1
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    9

    Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi all

    A gumby question. When making coffee at home with my Rancilio Silvia, should I pour the shot first and then steam the milk, or the other way around?

    I often make two lattes at home at the same time and notice that by the time Ive steamed the milk the two espresso shots have cooled down quite a lot. I.e. Im adding freshly heated milk to shots that have been sitting around for about 5 minutes. (I havent timed it but it seems to take about this long for the steam to get up to temp, do one "dry run" to get excess water out the wand and system etc, and then get back up to max steaming temperature).

    I havent tried it yet, but would I be better off heating the milk first and then pouring the shots? Or I would the nice microbubbles and too much milk heat?

    Cheers,
    D.E.M.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Koffee_Kosmo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Brisbane
    Posts
    5,113

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    For the Silvia I would steam the milk first then pour the shot
    Reason - To have the boiler full

    For my HX I steam after I pull the shot

    KK

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    466

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    I pour the shot then steam. When the boiler reaches steaming temperature everything gets extra hot - meaning even if I flush a lot of water through the group handle it is still too hot.

    However when you are steaming on silvia you dont want to wait for the boiler light to go out. What you want to do is start to steam while the boiler is still heating (I find around 40s after the switch was flicked). This means a more constant pressure is achieved and milk is steamed much faster.

  4. #4
    Senior Member Luke_G's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Location
    Northen Rivers
    Posts
    659

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    A return gumby question ...

    Are you heating your latte glasses with boiling or very hot water before pulling the shots into them?

    If your going to do the milk first you will have to keep it moving if you want even milk to pour with.

  5. #5
    hazchem
    Guest

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    What Martial Monkey said, shots first, then yer milk. As Luke mentioned heating the glasses with some hot water from the boiler at the very beginning will help.

    Quote Originally Posted by 707B61767871716764667167677B140 link=1255929205/0#0 date=1255929205
    do one "dry run" to get excess water out the wand and system etc, and then get back up to max steaming temperature

    sounds to me like you might be letting nearly all the steam out when doing this? Ive never felt the need to do that with mine. A few seconds at most is all Ive found is required, just enough to get the excess water out and then youre ready to start steaming your milk.

  6. #6
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    9

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    Thanks for the replies all.

    Luke, nope, Im not pre-heating my cups at all. For the lattes I use a medium sized glass (not sure of the vol, about 200 or 250ml?) and when I do espresso shots I use a small 70ml ceramic cup.

    I used to pre-heat with some water from the machine but I always got a few particles of coffee grinds left over from the previous pour so stopped doing it.

    Koffee Kosmo, you mentioned getting the boiler full - this is something I hadnt thought of. Im not doing a pre-pour first to get things heated and to fill the boiler - I just turn the machine on, wait for it to get to temp and then pour my shot. It sounds like I need to probably do a pre-pour into my cup to a) heat it and b) fill the boiler. Does that sound right?

    Hazchem, re: "sounds to me like you might be letting nearly all the steam out when doing this?" Yes, Im letting it "free" steam until the heating light comes back on - someone told me to do this to clear the water from the system. I then wait until machine heats back up again and the heating light goes out. Ill try free steaming for just a few seconds and see how it goes.

    Thanks all,
    D.E.M.

  7. #7
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    703

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    OK,
    Now we have some more to go with.
    Firstly, Silvia really needs minimum of about 30 mins warm up time, with the portafilter sitting in the grouphead so everything warms up, (45 -60 mins is better).

    Always pour your shots first, best if into cups that have been pre-warmed.
    I use hot water from the jug to heat my cups, you could use some hot water from Silvia.
    After pouring the shot/s, I flush the grouphead briefly and hit the steam switch, and after about 40 sec or so you can briefly bleed the steam wand, as described above, and steam your milk. It is definitely better to start steaming while the heating light is still on, gives you much stronger steam power.
    For example if I havent filled my jug, it is only about as long as it takes to get milk from the fridge and put some in the jug and shes ready to bleed the steam wand. Total time to pour two shots and steam milk should only be around 2 minutes or so.

    After steaming, blow boiler down and refill immediatly.
    Soon as possible fit your blind filter and flush the grouphead and 3 way valve, then you have a relatively clean start for the next round.
    Depending on how much you use Silvia, you would want to do a chemical clean every week/2 weeks/3 weeks to keep the shower screen/grouphead all free from gunk.




  8. #8
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Posts
    9

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    Hi all

    Thanks for the tips. Ive made a few coffees using your advice (warming machine up longer, pre-heating cups, steaming when light still on) and its a noticeable difference, both in taste (smoother, sweeter) and in time.

    I cant believe how much more steaming power I get by steaming when the heating light is still on. Its half the time. Now my only problem is keeping the milk in the jug when I first start stretching the milk!)

    Some questions: what is a blind filter and the 3 way valve? And what does flushing with it do for me? The reason I dont pre-heat my cups using the machine water is because I get all this crap (leftover grinds) in the cup.

    Regarding usage, I make 1 double espresso each morning, two hot chocolates at night, and 24 lattes on saturday and 2 on sunday. I descale the machine about once every 2 or 3 months.

    Thanks all,
    D.E.M.

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    1,520

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    http://coffeeparts.com/accessories/blind-filters.html
    http://www.jetblackespresso.com.au/shop/ac/coffee-cleaning/

    a "blind filter" is a basket without any holes in it, this stops water coming out and allows you to "backflush"
    The 3way valve releases the pressure from your shot, backflushing it removes any stray coffee grinds and muck that may clog it over time, you also help clean the group head / shower screen of grinds / muck at the same time. (It (3way) is a solenoid at the back of the grouphead)

    YoU also need some back flush detergent to ensure you clean properly

    I would suggest you Google "backflushing a Silvia", that will help explain, IMO its a very important part of the cleaning routine.

    go and speak to a CS sponsor and ask them to show you how / discuss backflushing your machine

    you can use the hot tap in the sink to warm your cups or I used to fill my boiler via the steam wand and fill a cup to warm with the hot water when i had a silvia type machine

    Leeham

  10. #10
    A_M
    A_M is offline
    Guest
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    6,381

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    Quote Originally Posted by 464D57404E47475152504751514D220 link=1255929205/7#7 date=1256508734
    Some questions: what is a blind filter and the 3 way valve? And what does flushing with it do for me? The reason I dont pre-heat my cups using the machine water is because I get all this crap (leftover grinds) in the cup.

    Regarding usage, I make 1 double espresso each morning, two hot chocolates at night, and 24 lattes on saturday and 2 on sunday. I descale the machine about once every 2 or 3 months.
    If your doing all the coffees you state and have not done a plain water back flusk or a chemical clean (blind) and or cleaned your shower screen etc.... Then your machine is dirty :-[


    I would be seriously looking a chem clean every sunday and a plain water back flush every evening.

  11. #11
    Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    87

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    To add to this, if you dont have one already, get yourself a good group head brush

    http://coffeeparts.com/accessories/group-head-brushes.html

    This is a handy tool to use to clean around the group head after you finish pulling your shots. A very good habit to get into and doesnt take long at all to do.

    Also, grab yourself a short non-phillips head screwdriver to remove the group shower screen with and clean that also. That got done once a week with my Silvia before my backflush routine. Again, only takes a few mins to do.


  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Nov 2006
    Posts
    979

    Re: Order of pouring shot vs heating milk

    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    Dont steam first as it will overheat everything and send the brewing temperatures out of wack.

    I agree it takes about 40 seconds to get up to steaming temp, about the same time it takes me to get the milk out of the fridge fill a jug and give the boiler a quick bleed. I have never actually timed it, I simply start steaming when there is obviously enough pressure and the steam is coming out dry.



Similar Threads

  1. Soy Milk Heating
    By KatiesCoffee in forum Milk Froth and Bubbles
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 31st March 2011, 12:07 PM
  2. silvia: shot or milk which order
    By mmmcoffee in forum Brewing Equipment - Midrange ($500-$1500)
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 18th May 2009, 04:36 PM
  3. Order of sequence syrup/milk/shot
    By Kelrizzo in forum General Coffee Related...
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: 22nd July 2008, 11:02 PM
  4. Why would someone deliberately order burnt milk?
    By Matt_King in forum Milk Froth and Bubbles
    Replies: 26
    Last Post: 15th June 2007, 03:28 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •