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Thread: USED: Asking price

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    USED: Asking price

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    I know the market generally sets the price of things for sale. But some people just enjoy things and are not born traders. So what should we ask when we sell things coffee?

    Case in point is this: a while ago I put up for sale a Giotto Rocket in perfect unmarked condition for what I thought was a reasonable price. Some people asked me to sell for 30% of current price, which I thought was not reasonable....but maybe that is how things are?

    I have always gone by this:
    -used, perfectly condition, 2/3 of current price
    -used, w some wear, 50% of current price



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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Hi-end coffee machines are a micro-market, and coffeesnobs buyers make up a micro-part of that market, so your results will also vary on time of year, phase of moon, etc.

    Having said that, a 2 year old Giotto should go for at least $1800 - $2000 (IMHO), given new price has come down lately to around $2600 I think. (Ignore the occasional excellent deal that some recent Giotto owners got!). Ignore the requests for selling it at 30% new - that is silly!

    Coffeesnobbers like to know a bit more about their potential machines - when was it last serviced? How often did you backflush with water / chemicals? Have you always used a good scale-inhibiting water filter? Has the OPV been set?

    You could also list a few more manufacturers details that make it different from an older ECM Giotto - new control board, pressurestat, etc.

    Edit your original for sale post so buyers dont have to scroll through the conversation to get answers, and even lay it out with bullets / highlighting, etc.

    Finally, comment every month or two to keep it near the top of the "for sale" list. It may be that your buyer isnt here now, but will be next month.

    hope that helps, and good luck with the sale! (my fee is 10% :D )

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    PS you might also want to polish the s/steel with a microfibre cloth and remove the coffee from the drip tray lest you give the impression of not looking after it :)

    Are you sure its only 2 years old or did I add that up wrong?

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Interesting question - not easy to answer.

    There are so many variables to selling something - market conditions, buyers state of mind, timing, etc etc

    I think your rules of thumb seem very reasonable as long as its based on a percentage of the current price achieveable. Some people do their calculations based on their purchase price which often leads to a figure which is not realistic given that the items retail price has potentially dropped - this probably leads to disappointment on the sellers behalf.

    Some buyers, it seems, wont buy unless they get an absolute bargain and feel like theyve beaten you. No matter how cheap your item is - theyll still ask for a better price.

    Ultimately its your item and unless you have no choice (perhaps due to financial reasons or otherwise) you dont have to sell it at a price that you are not comfortable with - simply say no! If you have done your homework properly on what your item is worth - it will lie somewhere in a range (arbitrarily in a 5-10% range). If there are genuine buyers in the market and you have advertised it well it will be in the top of that range - if buyers are slim and you didnt sell it well it will be in the bottom of that range.

    Remember its yours and only sell it for what you think is fair...

  5. #5
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    Re: USED: Asking price

    if its in good (read great) condition I work on 30 per cent off retail for first year of purchase then devalue by a further 10 per cent for every year thereafter...

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Quote Originally Posted by 666A696A68676C6476686A6A716D6760646B050 link=1330680346/0#0 date=1330680345
    ......a while ago I put up for sale a Giotto Rocket......for what I thought was a reasonable price.* Some people asked me to sell for 30% of current price, which I thought was not reasonable....
    You are correct and need not be concerned by the usual riff raff that always blows in in the hope that some one some day will sell them the absolute best and most expensive piece of equipment in the best possible condition, for the lowest possible rock bottom price. It happens everywhere not just with coffee machines, and if I were you I wouldnt even grace them with a reply as it is a total waste of time.....once they have screwed you to the wall and taken the shirt off your back and you give in, they then want even more money off because of some new perceived problem they say has cropped up as they take a closer look at your offeriing. Its pretty classic stuff and if you are not careful they will have you paying them to take it away while they sneer and hiss at you for daring to try and put one over them......when in reality it is them that are "stealing" it from you.

    As I said, dont even grace them with a reply. Every time you reply you give them something to come back at you with to try and beat you down....and out.

    Its the very lowest and most repugnant form of buyer psychology known to mankind.

  7. #7
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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Quote Originally Posted by 487C6B7D66514D6168686B6B0E0 link=1330680346/5#5 date=1330852394
    You are correct and need not be concerned by the usual riff raff that always blows in in the hope that some one some day will sell them the absolute best and most expensive piece of equipment in the best possible condition, for the lowest possible rock bottom price. It happens everywhere not just with coffee machines, and if I were you I wouldnt even grace them with a reply as it is a total waste of time.....once they have screwed you to the wall and taken the shirt off your back and you give in, they then want even more money off because of some new perceived problem they say has cropped up as they take a closer look at your offeriing. Its pretty classic stuff and if you are not careful they will have you paying them to take it away while they sneer and hiss at you for daring to try and put one over them......when in reality it is them that are "stealing" it from you.
    Too true and its the reason that my restored e-61 resides in a crate.

    I tired of being offered 1/3-1/2 of fair price by individuals who thought they were doing me a favour ::)

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    A lot of people use ebay and the likes to establish what they think is "market value".

    If they are looking at overseas listings they will often get a far lower market value than here. We are a high cost Country.

    Having said that there are some fantastic bargains here too if you do the research. Especially in the high end of the market where there is limited turnover.

    These are the expectations you are unfortunately dealing with when trying to sell at what should be a fair price in a good economy.

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Quote Originally Posted by 717D6E6E696F6F1C0 link=1330680346/7#7 date=1331961095
    A lot of people use ebay and the likes to establish what they think is "market value"....
    Too right....

    My e-61 moves to its new home next week. Better still its going to a mate who will love it and look after it.

    Price was always firm but a heap of people offered to "do me a big favour" and take it off my hands; some for under 1/3 of the advertised/sale price.* ::)

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    Senior Member saoye's Avatar
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    Re: USED: Asking price

    A fair price is one that the Seller and Buyer agrees on.* There are two opposing forces, the seller wants to sell at the highest price possible and the buyer at the lowest price possible. It is a matter of how patient the seller is for the right buyer to come along.* There are a myriad of scenarios and each situation is unique.* If the seller just wants to get rid of the item to make space or fund for another item and is not fussed at how much "loss" he or she has made compared to what was originally paid, that to him is a fair price whatever that might be.

    The perception of value is another matter considered by the buyer.* Convenience of locality, state of the machine, previous owners care etc all comes into play in the buyers mind.
    Bear in mind, putting a price too low can also be a negative for the seller since the immediate perception would be "whats wrong with it".

    At the end of the day, a fair price is what the seller is happy to hand the machine over for and the buyer is happy to pay.*

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    I put some ACF cups up for sale at 2/3 what I paid for them new. They look as good as new to me and in my mind I imagined someone in the market for ACF cups might be happy to save a third of what they were going to spend and essentially get the same product.

    If they dont sell it wont be because people dont realise how valuable they are. Value in a market economy is what someone will pay at a given time and place.

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    [QUOTE=03363B3C08143831313232570 link=1330680346/8#8 date=1331962247]Too right....

    My e-61 moves to its new home next week. Better still its going to a mate who will love it and look after it.

    Price was always firm but a heap of people offered to "do me a big favour" and take it off my hands; some for under 1/3 of the advertised/sale price.*


    I think* Talk_Coffee is pointing to the elephant in the room.* Things have changed, and there are many people who cost everything and value nothing.* ebay has certainly contributed to the sense of entitlement that one can expect to find brand new treasures for next to nothing.* Question is, who pays?* But then, how many people feel like this is even a question worth asking?

    I admire CS sponsors who find, stock, service and promote really nice stuff.* That is how I found my way to experiencing how darn good a cup of the black stuff can taste.* And good service should be rewarded. That means it has to be paid for. After all, we all want to make a living.

    We have had guests for dinner who say THAT is nice coffee!.* Some then ask why I start with green beans, or say hmm, thats* a lot of money for a coffee machine.* This surprises me because they miss that it takes effort to create something beautiful.* I know some have instant coffee at home.* Would they understand what it took to cook the meal they just had, starting with fresh ingredients?*

    Let them be, if they can live with themselves.*

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Quote Originally Posted by 4E424142404F444C5E40424259454F484C432D0 link=1330680346/11#11 date=1332143209
    We have had guests for dinner who say THAT is nice coffee!. Some then ask why I start with green beans, or say hmm, thats a lot of money for a coffee machine...
    I know what you mean - and yet they dont bat an eyelid at a your (hypothetical) $2000 DSLR and lenses that cost as much each. My brother-in-law gets praise (rightly-so) for his camera work, and now people are asking to pay him to take photos but they still baulk at an expensive coffee machine... if only theyd pay me for my coffee ;)

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Quote Originally Posted by 757D7572787E1C0 link=1330680346/12#12 date=1332162375
    Quote Originally Posted by 4E424142404F444C5E40424259454F484C432D0 link=1330680346/11#11 date=1332143209
    We have had guests for dinner who say THAT is nice coffee!.* Some then ask why I start with green beans, or say hmm, thats* a lot of money for a coffee machine...
    I know what you mean - and yet they dont bat an eyelid at a your (hypothetical) $2000 DSLR and lenses that cost as much each.* My brother-in-law gets praise (rightly-so) for his camera work, and now people are asking to pay him to take photos but they still baulk at an expensive coffee machine... if only theyd pay me for my coffee ;)
    Thats a bit of an over-generalization and just a bit unfair too. Its ego-centric to think that everyone shares the same interests as you or places the same values and priorities on things as you do.

    Family friends won about $2.5mill in lotto a few years ago. They set up the two kids with housing and cars, fixed their place inside and out but kept the 1994 commodore. Its simply transport to them. A few weeks ago I offered them some of my roast and the response was "oh I think we have a coffee machine somewhere".

    Ive a life-long friend working fulltime and earning about $38k after tax. He cant even afford the money I spend on beans let alone a machine. If he won lotto I doubt hed even consider coffee a priority because its not in his orbit of wants and needs.

    Ive another friend just ordered a hand made wood plane for $980 that will be delivered sometime in May. Would you ?

    Its not always about simply desire or simply money, you usually have to have the desire AND the money.


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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Quote Originally Posted by 757073737D7463110 link=1330680346/13#13 date=1332166286
    Thats a bit of an over-generalization and just a bit unfair too. Its ego-centric to think that everyone shares the same interests as you or places the same values and priorities on things as you do.
    hm, perhaps I didnt say it right - I dont expect people to want to spend the money I do on a coffee machine. Ive bought for and assisted with a few purchases for friends, and the most important thing is that they get what theyre happy with - including the freebie entry level sunbeam I got for my uncle.

    However, what I said about the camera analogy, is that people are much more happy to accept someone elses high-priced camera than my high-priced coffee machine. Theyre both hobbies, they both produce much better results than the cheap appliance from the big retailer, and they could both be turned into a business, and yet only one is seen to be excessive, generally.

    Im not talking about desire or money, just acceptance.

    :)

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Quote Originally Posted by 515951565C5A380 link=1330680346/14#14 date=1332203642
    Im not talking about desire or money, just acceptance.

    :)
    Fair enough Iain. I didnt mean to suggest you were being unfair to others. Sometimes online forum threads are like talk back radio. Eventually dissenters leave and conversation spirals towards a centric view. Sometimes.

    Ive been down the lack of acceptance track with computers and incidently with cameras. Try telling family, friends and workmates the camera you bought on your trip cost more than the trip. Then youll see a stunned look or two. Its just a cross to bear I guess.

    Acceptance often follows exposure and experience. Sellers of high end coffee machines dont appear in every shopping centre or department store unlike the appliance level machine. So its natural for others to think "excess" not "hobby". There was a time when this was true for high end photographic gear too and people woul almost reel in shock when prices were mentioned. But now high end photo stuff* can be found everwhere and people just accept the fact others like owning and using them. Same with computers. Though at least coffee machines and cameras have longer lifespans.

    Your fortunate that* others appreciate your guidance seeking* the finer things.


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    Re: USED: Asking price

    We live at a time in Australian history when a sizeable proportion of the population is quite affluent. I guess we can attribute this to a fairly stable economy and the two-income family. I often look at the affluence (maybe based on debt but still superficially affluent) of the average working family and reflect on how different it was in the 50s & early 60s when I was growing up. I know lots of people who holiday overseas every two years but express horror at the price of a good coffee machine. Of course it is about personal priorities and what you value. Ive never heard anyone express horror at money spent on a new tinny & outboard motor which is somehow totally acceptable and not an extravagance. I do my best to avoid making judgements about peoples toys.

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    Re: USED: Asking price

    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    Quote Originally Posted by 20252626282136440 link=1330680346/15#15 date=1332210349
    Acceptance often follows exposure and experience
    Quote Originally Posted by 162B272F3D440 link=1330680346/16#16 date=1332291386
    We live at a time in Australian history when a sizeable proportion of the population is quite affluent.
    And since were constantly exposed to our own increasing affluence, we dont see an issue (nor is there necessarily one) with spending big dollars on boats, cameras, houses etc. Its good to remember how good we have it though - were only a generation or two away from waking up at 5am to feed the animals and milk the cow at the age of 6... Or living on a horse owning nothing but the horse and everything its carrying.

    Quote Originally Posted by 162B272F3D440 link=1330680346/16#16 date=1332291386
    I do my best to avoid making judgements about peoples toys.
    I agree absolutely - I have friends who have boats worth tens of thousands, but theyre on it every weekend fishing or skiing or something. So long as the kids are fed and watered, you can spend your money on whatever you choose! Its only excessive when you live beyond your means, ie income < outcome. Generally. And all generalisations are dangerous ;) And this topic is OT... generally :P



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