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Thread: How many mls per size

  1. #1
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    How many mls per size

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    Hi everyone
    This is a newbie question but I rather get out then Just wonder what is right to do,

    A 12 oz cup
    With double shot whats the right amount of mls go in it 40ml or 60ml

    Thank you

  2. #2
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Two schools of thought some think 40 mls some 60ml, I go with 40mls as 60 produces a "strong" coffee. Try it and do what you think taste best.

    Bett

  3. #3
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Its actually better to work in grams rather than mls, volume is greatly effected by the gas in the so its not an accurate measurement of extraction.

    For a double espresso, with a 50% extraction ratio you should look for around 28g of coffee from 14g of beans, with a pour time of about 23-25secs.

    Thats a good starting point, then you can experiment with different ratios and see where you find the flavour sweet spot with your beans, grinder, coffee machine and personal preferences.

  4. #4
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Assuming that you are filling the cup with steamed milk, both options--for me--would produce a hot milk drink with a weak coffee-ish flavour.

    Greg

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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 5F53535F4C3E0 link=1335859464/0#0 date=1335859464
    Hi everyone
    This is a newbie question but I rather get out then Just wonder what is right to do,

    A 12 oz cup
    With double shot whats the right amount of mls go in it 40ml or 60ml

    Thank you

    what sized baskets are you using to produce the coffee?

    at my work we use 20g baskets and run 45ml max for a double shot pouring into a 12oz takeaway - and if someone orders strong I pour another (freshly dosed!) 45ml on top!

  6. #6
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 74727F667E726A130 link=1335859464/2#2 date=1335865053
    Its actually better to work in grams rather than mls, volume is greatly effected by the gas in the so its not an accurate measurement of extraction.
    Totally agree, tried the method a few times now since seeing the post. Much more accurate not having to deal with different amounts of crema. Was easy enough to test as well with a set of digital kitchen scales
    thanks

  7. #7
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 56637476467E637C707D75110 link=1335859464/3#3 date=1335867259
    Assuming that you are filling the cup with steamed milk, both options--for me--would produce a hot milk drink with a weak coffee-ish flavour.
    Couldnt agree more. 12 ounces is a big cup for a coffee, I would be looking at 2 x double shots (2 ounces or 60ml) of espresso with milk in a cup that size. I find, and of course everything is subjective to individual taste, that you dont want to go past the ratio of 1/3 - 1/4 coffee in the cup for a flat white. Also, to clarify that, as long as the coffee is good and properly extracted etc.

  8. #8
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 40464B524A465E270 link=1335859464/2#2 date=1335865053
    Its actually better to work in grams rather than mls, volume is greatly effected by the gas in the so its not an accurate measurement of extraction.
    but gms are bloody hard to judge when pouring a shot,...whilst mls are an easy visual to gauge !
    *JMHO.. A good double* would be 60 ml ..including the crema.

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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 58565F545E0F083A0 link=1335859464/7#7 date=1337244783
    but gms are bloody hard to judge when pouring a shot,...
    Not really, when i want a reference check i just slip the balance that i use for weighing the beans, under a glass.

    Quote Originally Posted by 58565F545E0F083A0 link=1335859464/7#7 date=1337244783
    A good double* would be 60 ml ..including the crema.
    It might be good.....it might be awful! ;)



  10. #10
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    Re: How many mls per size

    so, if you are using a manual machine( non volumetric) how do you judge when to stop the shot ?
    timer ?
    weight of the shot ?
    volume in the cup/glass ? (visual of the height / size of the shot)
    start of blonding ?
    some other indicator ?

  11. #11
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 4A444D464C1D1A280 link=1335859464/9#9 date=1337251632
    so, if you are using a manual machine( non volumetric) how do you judge when to stop the shot ?
    * timer ?
    * weight of the shot ?
    * volume in the cup/glass ? (visual of the height / size of the shot)
    * start of blonding ?
    * some other indicator ?
    Cant speak for others but, for me it is an art learned through practice and repetition, I never measure or weigh with any device.* I look at how much is in the basket (just the right amount - notice I didnt measure this) for the grind, tamp it well (not too hard not too soft - 15kg equivalent force? I have no idea, I do it just right).* I look for a 25 second+ pour and bingo, two ounces of pure black gold!* I still get a couple of sink shots here and there (when my grinder doesnt do what I have patiently asked, pleaded, begged it to do) as we all do when adjusting for bean age or type but most of the time its all good.*

    Look in cafes, baristas dont, not the ones I see at least, tend to weigh their coffee before they make it for you.* They dont have time but, they dont need to either.* They know through lots and lots of training, practice and repetition that if they dose about right to their trained eye as well as having the right grind set up for the bean they are brewing etc etc they will extract a pretty good shot.

    I look for two things with my extraction, the first hints of blonding, a rough volumetric eyeballing of the amount extracted to the cup and last but certainly not least how the coffee is extracting - is it oozing and almost wanting to stretch out before falling deliciously into my little espresso cup?

    Not saying this is right, but it works very well for me. :)

  12. #12
    Senior Member David8's Avatar
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 5E72617A7D7661130 link=1335859464/10#10 date=1337254914
    Cant speak for others but, for me it is an art learned through practice and repetition, I never measure or weigh with any device.* I look at how much is in the basket (just the right amount - notice I didnt measure this) for the grind, tamp it well (not too hard not too soft - 15kg equivalent force? I have no idea, I do it just right).* I look for a 25 second+ pour and bingo, two ounces of pure black gold!* I still get a couple of sink shots here and there (when my grinder doesnt do what I have patiently asked, pleaded, begged it to do) as we all do when adjusting for bean age or type but most of the time its all good.*

    Look in cafes, baristas dont, not the ones I see at least, tend to weigh their coffee before they make it for you.* They dont have time but, they dont need to either.* They know through lots and lots of training, practice and repetition that if they dose about right to their trained eye as well as having the right grind set up for the bean they are brewing etc etc they will extract a pretty good shot.

    I look for two things with my extraction, the first hints of blonding, a rough volumetric eyeballing of the amount extracted to the cup and last but certainly not least how the coffee is extracting - is it oozing and almost wanting to stretch out before falling deliciously into my little espresso cup?

    Not saying this is right, but it works very well for me. :)
    I think this sums it up really well. I stop my shots based on signs of blonding as well. :D

  13. #13
    Senior Member trentski's Avatar
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 6F7D657A666B6D6168686B6B697B770E0 link=1335859464/4#4 date=1335874479
    Quote Originally Posted by 5F53535F4C3E0 link=1335859464/0#0 date=1335859464
    Hi everyone
    This is a newbie question but I rather get out then Just wonder what is right to do,

    A 12 oz cup
    With double shot whats the right amount of mls go in it 40ml or 60ml

    Thank you

    what sized baskets are you using to produce the coffee?

    at my work we use 20g baskets and run 45ml max for a double shot pouring into a 12oz takeaway - and if someone orders strong I pour another (freshly dosed!) 45ml on top!

    and thats why I enjoy the coffee at your shop.

    If I saw you weighing the shots however, I wouldnt darken your door ever again ;)

  14. #14
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 7B57445F585344360 link=1335859464/10#10 date=1337254914
    I look for two things with my extraction, the first hints of blonding, a rough volumetric eyeballing of the amount extracted to the cup and last but certainly not least how the coffee is extracting - is it oozing and almost wanting to stretch out before falling deliciously into my little espresso cup?

    Not saying this is right, but it works very well for me. :)
    +1
    My point was that its not practical or possible to judge an extraction as its happening, by weight .
    Only the visual factors are available, and those are what most people use...with time being a secondary confirmation.

    ( i expect some OCD freak will chime in now and say how they have a micro gram scale under their group, connected to the brew control valve !* *:D )

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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 646A6368623334060 link=1335859464/13#13 date=1337297404
    My point was that its not practical or possible to judge an extraction as its happening, by weight .
    As I said, its both practical and possible while the extraction is happening - i just slip a balance under the glass before the pour starts.

    as far as I know its the only meaningful way to make comparisons between extractions as it allows one to calculate a brew ratio.

    Of course if one is happy with the coffee they are making now then there is no reason to bother with volumes, weights or any other quantative measure.

    The beauty of weighing beans in and coffee out is that it gives a very repeatable and accurate assesment of extraction, we can then vary all the elements within our control and test their effect on taste.

    I suspect one of the reasons so many cafes make such awful coffee is the lack of accuracy and repeatability in the process of coffee making used by so called baristas.

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    Re: How many mls per size

    [QUOTE=3638313A306166540 link=1335859464/13#13 date=1337297404]
    Quote Originally Posted by 7B57445F585344360 link=1335859464/10#10 date=1337254914

    ( i expect some OCD freak will chime in now and say how they have a micro gram scale under their group, connected to the brew control valve !* *:D )
    Have you read the name of this forum?
    Coffee snobs

    ::)

  17. #17
    Senior Member Dennis's Avatar
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Quote Originally Posted by 032F2C292E1F17400 link=1335859464/15#15 date=1337324550
    Have you read the name of this forum?
    Coffee snobs
    Yes, but a snob does not mean that to be one, you need to be obsessed with measuring everything.

    Ive come to witness that the obsessions people have (and I include myself amongst here) can make people happy, but more commonly have the reverse effect on them, and those around them.

  18. #18
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    Re: How many mls per size

    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    Quote Originally Posted by 0C2D2626213B480 link=1335859464/16#16 date=1337325559
    Ive come to witness that the obsessions people have (and I include myself amongst here) can make people happy, but more commonly have the reverse effect on them, and those around them.

    True, especially online where humor can be lost in the post.

    I guess all that really matters is that you enjoy the process of making a coffee and whats in the cup, whatever that may be. There is no bad way to make coffee, just some preferences for the individual person/pallet



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