Results 1 to 37 of 37
Like Tree2Likes
  • 1 Post By GrahamK
  • 1 Post By flynnaus

Thread: New $10,000 coffee machine

  1. #1
    Super Moderator Javaphile's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Earth!
    Posts
    15,466

    New $10,000 coffee machine

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    The $10,000 coffee machine

    "Do you like coffee? Ever had a cup from a machine that costs about $10,000? Now's your chance... It's the best cup you've ever had - guaranteed."

    Blossom's pitch attracted throngs of conference-goers from venture capitalists to budding entrepreneurs and reporters hoping to taste its "insanely great" cup of coffee.

    The portable machine behind the brew was built from scratch in a San Francisco warehouse for hardware startups by mechanical engineers and industrial designers with experience working at technology namesakes like NASA, Apple, Tesla, and BMW.

    The founders set out to see if they could deploy hardcore science and engineering to outdo hand-crafted brews.

    Their invention, the Cafe1, precisely controls brewing time and temperature to the point where "drastically" different cups of coffee can be elicited from the same beans.

    The machine includes a QR barcode scanner and wi-fi connectivity so roasters can place an internet link on their bags which will be recognised to identify the best way to brew each mix of beans.

    The first limited production run is just 10 machines which will sold for $11,111. These are aimed at commercial establishments as opposed to consumers.

    Jeremy Kuempel, president of Blossom Coffee, acknowledged the price could preclude his dream of "making excellent coffee available to everyone".

    But he asserted it would pay for itself within a year of consistent use.

    "Blossom Coffee is about more than one machine," he said.

    "We are committed to bringing our technology to more accessible levels."

    And in the future, he added, "you might be seeing a new price."
    Source: BBC News - Silicon Valley's hottest start-ups vie for attention

    Makers website: Blossom Coffee | Better Brewing Through Technology


    Java "Things that make you go hhhmmmmm...." phile
    Toys! I must have new toys!!!

  2. #2
    Senior Member Bosco_Lever's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    QLD
    Posts
    438
    Biggest bunch of bull dung I have ever read. No in depth description of what it does and why it is "drastically" better. Just a load of typical silicon valley marketing tripe. I wonder if the engineers they employed were the recipients of redundancy packages and came together out of sheer boredom. No proof of hardcore science, but loads of hardcore insanity.
    Will they give a money back guarantee if the coffee is not the best I have ever had??????

  3. #3
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    WA, perth
    Posts
    247
    the sad thing to remember is also that a large proportion of people wouldnt be able to tell the difference between a good or bad coffee. others even think bad coffee 'is what coffee is meant to taste like'

    reminds me of an online review i read not long ago of a new cafe here in perth with 'i ordered a coffee here today, and it tasted like water. never going back' - yet it seems that all the cafe cares about is the coffee and im wondering if the poor bugger ordered a brewed coffee and it didnt taste as burnt/stale/overextrated as he/she is normally used to tasting.

    all that said, bosco, maybe the article just couldnt care less about the details?

  4. #4
    Senior Member WiredArabica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Christchurch, NZ
    Posts
    175
    Wifi connectivity - Monitor machine performance remotely - yeah, it's so useful to know what the espresso machine gets up to while you're not around.

    Not that it's espresso of course, with a lever arrangement like that. It would appear to have about the same function as an aeropress (with a self filling brew chamber), and with a portafilter and I assume a metal filter basket.
    Hmm, there's an idea... Oh wait! Coava disk.

    Just wait - it'll take off. Look at the number of people who have nespresso, and like it... Heh, it'd actually be an upgrade in that case!

  5. #5
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,028
    Biggest bunch of bull dung I have ever read.
    maybe the article just couldnt care less about the details?
    Not that it's espresso of course, with a lever arrangement like that.
    Gees, what cynicism. You don't know exactly how the machine works nor have you tried it yet you already know it's crap? You wouldn't think they are trying to protect their intellectual property by not giving much details?

    Perhaps wait until it is peer-reviewed by coffee professionals and have sampled a cup made from it before writing it off as a gimmick.

  6. #6
    Senior Member WiredArabica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Christchurch, NZ
    Posts
    175
    Well, we may not know it's crap, but some assumptions can be made from the info and pictures they've provided... That aside, I would love to be surprised.

  7. #7
    CoffeeSnobs Owner Andy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Internet
    Posts
    16,685
    Blog Entries
    1
    Gees, what cynicism.
    I tend to agree but I expect it's the high price tag that attracted that initial reaction.

    Cute idea. Similar USB memory stick stored "coffee roaster recommendation" devices have been used in the past to configure coffee machines but I don't know of one using QR codes.

    The real gotcha here is that it uses a manual lever... regardless of the QR code information the down force pressure will be different for each user. If it had a servo driven plunger then maybe the QR code idea would produce similar in different locations.

    I like the concept for a $500 machine.
    What was the price of this one?

  8. #8
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    Location
    Cranbourne, Victoria, Australia, Australia
    Posts
    168
    haha the thing I find most intriguing is that they explicitly state "Easy to upgrade"...it's gotta make you wonder why they've said it...
    Attached Images Attached Images

  9. #9
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,028
    Quote Originally Posted by WiredArabica View Post
    some assumptions can be made from the info and pictures they've provided.
    Well you know what they say about assumptions.

    My first impression of the appearance wasn't favourable (and I'm a fan of Bauhaus design) but I'm not going to jump to any conclusion about the quality of its output. No steam arm or hot water tap so it appears to be designed to prepare long blacks.

    The Blossom One Limited

    The real gotcha here is that it uses a manual lever...
    ..and you would need to grind, dose, distribute and tamp.

    Check out the designer's teapot:

    Sorapot | Joey Roth

  10. #10
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Sydney North Shore
    Posts
    1,325
    To quote Blossom:
    “One Limited is so simple that anyone can learn to perfectly brew a cup of coffee in less than ten minutes.”

    There is no grinder on or next to it or a mention about grinding, dosing or tamping that takes more than 10 minutes to learn how to do, so it may be a pod machine, an expensive one at that.

    I think I will stick to my Breville Dual Boiler that cost a lot less, makes quite acceptable coffee and steams milk too.

    Barry

  11. #11
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    There is too much bulldust and plain wrong statements in their pro mo material, to make me even begin to think that they know what they are doing.
    Also i note they are careful not to call it an espresso machine....its more like a "mechanised Aeropress"
    They are obviously "up themselves" to believe it is worth that asking price !

  12. #12
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,028
    There is no talk about a grinding, dosing or tamping that takes more than 10 minutes to learn how to do, so it may be a pod machine, an expensive one at that.


    It says "
    - Accepts anystandard E61 Portafilter basket." One | Blossom Coffee

    There is too much bulldust and plain wrong statements in their promo material
    Marketing hype aside, I couldn't find any examples of "bulldust and plain wrong statement".
    You can check the inventor's thesis online (for his BSc from MIT) by googling "optimizing the coffee experience Jeremy Kuempel". He appears to have thoroughly researched the concept of coffee brewing and yu can get a better idea of what he is trying to achieve. I'm well prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt on any quality claims and I am looking forward to trying a brew from one of these machines one day.

  13. #13
    .
    Join Date
    Aug 2004
    Posts
    2,312
    Well.....if the purpose of the press release was to get people talking and to build awareness for something they may or may not actually have in the pipeline for future release so that when / if they ever release everyone will be all over it and talking it up hugely (as other manufacturers have done and are doing right at this time just take look around at some of the threads....), then it has been a very successful press release if nothing else.

  14. #14
    Senior Member GrahamK's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    Location
    Ormiston - Brisbane
    Posts
    541
    While the price definately sounds exhorbitant for what it is, and yes it does seem more like a over-sized Aeropress, it's good to see some lateral thinking and risk taking, especially as I'm not having to pay for it. As E de Bono would say, it's not so much what it is but where it could lead to. If you discount all lateral thinking up front you miss out on opportunities for innovation. So it, or aspects of it, may evolve into something far more innovative, practical and acceptable, and which could end up improving what we use today.

    GrahamK
    aaronpratt likes this.

  15. #15
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    .., I couldn't find any examples of "bulldust and plain wrong statement". .
    well , for a start..
    ..This unique sequence of events obviates the need for the noisy pumps that typically accompany advanced coffee equipment.
    I think a few advanced lever machine suppliers might argue that point for a start ..

  16. #16
    Senior Member Dennis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2007
    Posts
    4,512
    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    a few advanced lever machine suppliers ..
    Since when are lever machines advanced? Some night look prettier than others but they all pretty much work in the same way as they did 60 years ago.

  17. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Sydney North Shore
    Posts
    1,325
    Just like trotters are advanced horses and carts.

    Barry

  18. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    Quote Originally Posted by Dennis View Post
    Since when are lever machines advanced? Some night look prettier than others but they all pretty much work in the same way as they did 60 years ago.
    As do most coffee making processes. !
    Perhaps "current" would be a better choice of words, but i was attempting to keep some parity with the "Blossom speak"

  19. #19
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    9

    New $10,000 coffee machine

    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    well , for a start..


    I think a few advanced lever machine suppliers might argue that point for a start ..
    As long as we're accusing the maker of bulldust ( and I guess implicitly dishonest marketing) and getting nit- picky, you might want to note the use of the word 'typically', which was used to qualify the statement about noisy pumps and indicate that they will not always be present. "Always", being the word the writer could have used if that was the message he or she was trying to portray.

    A bit difficult to judge the machine with the amount of info given, but I think it's generally foolish to criticize another's efforts at innovation without knowing anything about them. I wouldn't mind trying a brew from it!

  20. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    Oh dear ! .. are we all optimistically hoping for the reincarnation of the coffee "godshot" machine ??
    If so, i wouldnt hold your breath !
    Its obvious this device is based on the Aeropress (immersion brewing, low pressure filtration)..and as such it is only ever going to produce a "black" coffee.
    It certainly could not produce an espresso, or anything based on espresso,.
    In reality, its going to make "American" coffee !

    And having read that 70 page thesis on "optimizing the coffee experience ".... well, lets just say my opinion of MIT has dropped considerably if that is the kind of paper they accept from grad level research.

  21. #21
    Not a Shoe Jimmytheboot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    246
    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    And having read that 70 page thesis on "optimizing the coffee experience ".... well, lets just say my opinion of MIT has dropped considerably if that is the kind of paper they accept from grad level research.
    Its the research project for a bachelor degree

  22. #22
    Member sando's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Location
    Avalon NSW
    Posts
    84
    "Blossom founders Jeremy and Matt boast experience at Apple and NASA"

    No wonder the Shuttle program cost about $1.5 billion per flight

  23. #23
    Senior Member Rocky's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Central Queensland
    Posts
    1,085
    IF I had $10K (or $12K) to spend on a coffee machine, I think I would be spending it on the Kees van der Western Speedster.


  24. #24
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,286
    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    Oh dear ! .. are we all optimistically hoping for the reincarnation of the coffee "godshot" machine ??
    If so, i wouldnt hold your breath !
    Its obvious this device is based on the Aeropress (immersion brewing, low pressure filtration)..and as such it is only ever going to produce a "black" coffee.
    It certainly could not produce an espresso, or anything based on espresso,.
    In reality, its going to make "American" coffee !
    I'd like to disagree with some of this. It appears to me that this is most similar to a Presso, not an Aeropress, and as such will likely make something like the same brew--a low pressure espresso--rather than a version of filtered coffee.

    Greg
    Sticking to his Izzo lever.

  25. #25
    Not a Shoe Jimmytheboot's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    246
    Photo of the prototype



    Matches functionality of an aeropress with some added electronics

  26. #26
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,286
    So the E61 group handle in the production models holds only a paper filter??!!
    I guess it is an Aeropress--and a very expensive version at that.

    Greg

  27. #27
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,028

  28. #28
    Senior Member WiredArabica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Christchurch, NZ
    Posts
    175
    On a whim, I just measured the diameter of one of my Aeropress filters - 64mm... What's the inside diameter of an E61 handle sans basket?

  29. #29
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    While the engineering behind the One Limited is interesting, it essentially takes a pretty simple process and unnecessarily complicates it with enough control parameters to make even the most hardened coffee nerd's eyes water. Don't get us wrong, the coffee it produces is good (really good, in fact). But so is the coffee made with a $26 plastic AeroPress. The creators behind the Blossom One Limited have done an excellent job of marrying their love of engineering with their love of coffee. Fortunately for the rest of us, there are far simpler (and cheaper) methods of getting our daily caffeine fix that don't seem to be going anywhere any time soon.
    Effectively, all it does is measure the volume of water (8oz) , and control the brew temperature (PID).
    The "brew time" control is no more than an alarm beeper to alert the operator to pull the lever when the brew has steeped long enough.
    Pressure is not a consideration or an influence on coffee the extraction process,.. apparently !
    so ..8oz of steeped coffee, low pressure pressed through a paper filter ( or espresso basket ?)

    This device is worth about as much consideration as its designer gave to using an espresso process.......
    ......( one paragraph in a 70 page thesis on "optimizing the coffee experience" )

  30. #30
    Senior Member WiredArabica's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    Christchurch, NZ
    Posts
    175
    Hmm, after reading all this I now have this crazy idea for a french press with an embedded element, an internal temp sensor and PID controller to maintain temperature during brewing... Just the project for an old zilog micro development board I've had lying around but couldn't quite throw out. OTOH, I much prefer the aeropress so maybe a collapsible element to maintain temp during the 30sec brew time, that will fold down when pressed.

    I think I've a few summer projects coming up!

  31. #31
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Posts
    777
    Ha- what a joke- the amazing high tech they have discovered is called :"Dr Emidio Saladi's 1958 Caravel espresso lever machine".

    the blossom is not a standard lever: like the caravel it has an open boiler with gravity feed to the piston chamber... The advantage of this is that you can have the boiler temperature below 100C (pressured boiler levers typically run at 1- 1.2 BAR which equals maybe +/- 120C).

    they even copied the modularity- thought the blossom requires 'standard tools'- the Caravel needs NONE you can disassemble it in 30 seconds.

    As it is a copy of the Caravel: I would expect it will work nicely- the Caravel is brilliant.

    but 11K is just absurd- a bad joke.

  32. #32
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    Whilst i agree they have replicated the "open boiler" principle of the Caravel ( though in truth i doubt they even know of its existence !), I cannot agree that it is a copy of it, since the Caravel is capable of producing genuine "espresso" coffee from its pressurized group , the lever action of which can comfortably generate 6-8 bar pressure .
    If you wanted to generate 8 bar on the blossom, you would need to apply something in the order of 100kg to that joke of a "lever" ...but it would fold up in the attempt !

  33. #33
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2006
    Posts
    24
    Quote Originally Posted by blend52 View Post
    Its obvious this device is based on the Aeropress (immersion brewing, low pressure filtration)..and as such it is only ever going to produce a "black" coffee.
    It certainly could not produce an espresso, or anything based on espresso,.
    In reality, its going to make "American" coffee !
    While not perfect I do get a pretty good espresso coffee out of my presso unit. at a fraction of the cost it does a great job with a similar principal and I highly recommend it for the office/camper user.

    I'm not sure how spending $50,000 on a unit that uses a similar principal could do that much better.

  34. #34
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,028
    The demo machine appears to be an early prototype and is somewhat unlike the proposed design.

    I still can't understand why everyone is still up in arms about this. Nobody on CS has seen it work (ie attended a demo). Nobody on the CS site has tried coffee made by it but somehow many of you have decided it's rubbish.Trying to claim it some glorified Aeropress is a bit of a stretch. Yes, the limited first release of the Blossom is outrageously expensive but the good news is nobody has to buy it. What it does claim is a superior, repeatable brew. Surely it is entitled to some benefit of the doubt until we can try it for ourselves.

    It's not just this machine. There appears to be a trend that some will set out to rubbish a concept, machine, coffee before they even see it working or try it for themselves. The Breville BES900 brouhaha is a classic example.
    Last edited by flynnaus; 4th October 2012 at 09:48 AM.

  35. #35
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Posts
    1,275
    Brettryan, the Aeropress is different in principle and function to your Presso which is designed to replicate the espresso extraction.
    ....... The Aeropress and the similar Blossom cannot replicate an espresso extraction.

    flynnaus,...I thought you had read Kuempel's thesis on optimizing coffee brewing.. ?
    from that ( and the obvious follow on design of the Blossom machine's ) it is very clear that he based the design on the Aeropress principle.
    It is also equally clear that this unit is little more than a PID'd boiler ( and brew pot) with a volumetric pump...surrounded by a lot of unconvincing "geek speak" .
    How can it claim to produce a repeatable brew when It has no ability to control brew time, agitation, or extraction rate / pressure,..which are all left to the operator ( though it would heave been relatively easy to incorporate those functions if they were serious)
    Unless you idea of the ultimate coffee experience is 8 oz of American black, then this machine will not bring you much satisfaction.
    Blossom is obviously more about creating a business image ( hence the attention grabbing price pitch) and gaining a foothold in the top end of the coffee world...and that is fine,
    ....but lets not pretend that this is anything special in terms of coffee brewing.

  36. #36
    Senior Member flynnaus's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Sydney
    Posts
    4,028
    Unless you idea of the ultimate coffee experience is 8 oz of American black, then this machine will not bring you much satisfaction.
    ....but lets not pretend that this is anything special in terms of coffee brewing.
    I'm not pretending anything. All I am saying is don't knock it until you try it.
    Vinitasse likes this.

  37. #37
    Senior Member GregWormald's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Posts
    2,286
    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    Quote Originally Posted by flynnaus View Post
    All I am saying is don't knock it until you try it.

    Where's the fun in that?

    Since it's not even available until "spring 2013", not even the inventor would be allowed to spruik it--and he's sure doing so.

    Greg



Similar Threads

  1. First time on Coffee Snobs and looking to purchase a coffee machine!
    By margaretm in forum Brewing Equipment - Midrange ($500-$1500)
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: 28th October 2013, 01:03 PM
  2. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 8th March 2011, 08:55 AM
  3. coffee machine coffee table
    By tcm-geelong in forum Brewing Equipment - Extreme Machines ($3000+)
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 17th November 2009, 09:27 PM
  4. New coffee machine - coffee tastes yucky!Help pls
    By orangegerbera2003 in forum General Coffee Related...
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: 4th December 2008, 01:05 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •