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Thread: Home Water Filtration - Will this work/be enough??

  1. #1
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    Talking Home Water Filtration - Will this work/be enough??

    Gene Cafe Coffee Roaster $850 - Free Beans Free Freight
    I'm looking to upgrade my home machine and as part of this want to make sure I have set up the water correctly. I have read so much water info, I'm swimming in it now!! Completely confused (almost!).

    The machine won't be plumbed.

    Location: Kedron, Brisbane.

    I know the Brita C150 is preferred/popular, however I want to avoid another tap on my already space challenged sink top (read "the missus won't let me!!"). I think the best option (only??) is for me to do an under sink in-line setup.

    I was thinking of the Everpure 4CB5-S cartridge with suitable head direct to my cold water tap (mixer).

    My question is, is this cartridge enough in it's own right, and will the cold water coming out the mixer tap be slowed so much that it drives me (err the missus, therefore ultimately me!) completely nuts!

    I'm happy to replace the cartridge 6-12 monthly, but given the machine cost, I really don't want to come up short on looking after it!

    I'm fumbling around a bit here so any and all assistance would be greatly appreciated! Thanks in advance!!

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    What's the flow rate of the everpure? I'm running a 3m Hf15 system which has a fairly high flow rate of 3.9 litres/minute and even that is too slow for a kitchen tap used day to day. Eg filling the sink would take a very long time.

    What you might consider is connecting the filtration system to another tap near the kitchen that is not as regularly used.

    For example if you have an internal laundry that is handy to the kitchen you could fill your jugs up there. And the lower flow rate may not be an issue for you.

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    Thanks herzog, the 4CB5-S is 6.3l/m, so it should be a bit better. I live in an old QLD'r and being small the laundry is down stairs. No alternative sink/tap options upstairs.

    I have had a look at changing the mixer tap to a 3-way but if I can find a simple inline solution that will enable me to use the current tap, that would be preferable.

    Does anyone know if the Everpure 4FC-S or the 4CB5-S are sufficient to keep my new coffee machine safe and happy? Do I need to do anything else to the water?

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    I live in an old QLDr and have an under sink with a small, push lever tap. It sits at the back to one side. It has a 2 stage under sink filter, I think it was 50u and 5, but I was talked into the 0.5u. We use it for the coffee machine, kettle and cooking water only. It has a good flow rate, but I don't think it's fast enough for all water. Also the filter replacement would step up.

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    Thanks for the reply Mike2e and welcome to CS!! It's a great little resource. Are you in Brisbane too?

    Your setup has a second tap right? I was hoping to avoid that if I can. Ideally if anyone knows of a descaling, under sink solution that I can get strong enough flow directly into my existing cold water mixer tap, without needing to get a 3 way tap. I think it's the cartridge that I listed above but I was hoping to find someone who had already done this to confirm that:

    a) the water flow is ok - strong enough to use for normal sink stuff
    &
    b) that this cartridge will look after my new giotto or expobar minore

    It may not be possible, but I figure if anyone knows how to do it, they'll reside in this wonderful collective of all knowing coffee knowledge! Thanks!

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    Contact a local company based in SE QLD with local knowledge of filtration requirements. What is good for Melbourne or Adelaide will not suit you.
    Look for filter systems Aust. They have a web store as well, under the name magnetic world.

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    Thanks Bosco_Lever that sounds like solid advice!

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    Prob not of interest to many, but for future searchers of water truth (?).....

    Everpure 4FC-S (if it'll fit under your sink!) will work plumbing into your cold water tap and at 9.5l/m flow rate, it won't cause you to pull your hair out waiting for a glass of water! AND apparently it will get rid of your nasty calcium/magnesium (it is magnesium isn't it???) scale causing badness! Good for Brisbane folk anyways (apparently).

    A big shout out to Pedro at Coffeeparts for putting me on the right track! Thanks!
    (the 4CB5-S will also work, just a bit slower flow)

    Now to stop procrastinating and pick a coffee machine....

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    Hi Coffee_Dude, I am in in Brisbane, Albany Creek, I do have a second tap, but it takes little space at the back corner. We used a Brita for the first year, but it was lot of hassle and waste of space. I rechecked the type, it is a Steffani Dual under counter available at the Big hardware. I measured the flow rate tonight at 6 L/min. I had forgotten that I put a 0.2pm filter in place of the 0.5 at last filter change. They state change every 6 months, but I wait until the flow begins to slow.
    I was considering changing to a 3 filter setup because I thought the filter would clog up quickly. When our machine steam pump leaked from blocking up, the repair agent who seems to have closed up, had a dual filter in line for the whole house, and a second setup in the sink mixer, and his coffee machine still blocked up. I was told this after the Sunbeam 6910 we had needed the steam pump changed for the second time in 2 years despite the filters. We have had a Breville dual boiler now for a few years with no problems but the machines internal filter is changed every 3 months.

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    Home Water Filtration - Will this work/be enough??

    Hi coffee dude, do you know would the everpure cartridges work with the aquaport 1/4 inch connection piece available at major hardware stores? The everpure connection piece looks like a bit big and clumsy to me.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MikE2e View Post
    Hi Coffee_Dude, I am in in Brisbane, Albany Creek, I do have a second tap, but it takes little space at the back corner. We used a Brita for the first year, but it was lot of hassle and waste of space. I rechecked the type, it is a Steffani Dual under counter available at the Big hardware. I measured the flow rate tonight at 6 L/min. I had forgotten that I put a 0.2pm filter in place of the 0.5 at last filter change. They state change every 6 months, but I wait until the flow begins to slow.
    I was considering changing to a 3 filter setup because I thought the filter would clog up quickly. When our machine steam pump leaked from blocking up, the repair agent who seems to have closed up, had a dual filter in line for the whole house, and a second setup in the sink mixer, and his coffee machine still blocked up. I was told this after the Sunbeam 6910 we had needed the steam pump changed for the second time in 2 years despite the filters. We have had a Breville dual boiler now for a few years with no problems but the machines internal filter is changed every 3 months.
    Thanks Mike2e, I had a look at the Steffani Dual one available at Bunnys but it didn't appear to address the water hardness issue that can cause coffee machines so much grief. I think, from memory, the Steffani was great for providing the user with clean water, but not really going to do much for the scale causing badness that comes with hard water. My understanding is that needs to be dealt with through an ion exchange process (or reverse osmosis...maybe? but that's a whole other level of confusion!). I suspect your changing the internal filter every 3 months is doing more for your machine then the Steffani Undersink system. Maybe someone with more water hardness/filtration knowledge could confirm this?

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    Quote Originally Posted by pyrmontboy200 View Post
    Hi coffee dude, do you know would the everpure cartridges work with the aquaport 1/4 inch connection piece available at major hardware stores? The everpure connection piece looks like a bit big and clumsy to me.

    Hi pyrmontboy200, sorry but I don't know. I've yet to get my everpure setup, but when I do I can have a look and let you know.... that's if no one with actual knowledge jumps in first (fingers crossed!)

    Thanks again to everyone who gave advice. Cheers!

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    It's cool, thanks for the reply, I've just gone and ordered a similar setup to you, except with the slower rate canister as the fast flow rate one you mention is too tall to fit vertically under my sink.

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    Interesting thread as I am tossing up between a Britta and Everpure system.
    Thanks for the comments and advice so far!

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    Anyone know if a pressure limiting valve is required in Sydney for a Everpure 4cb5s? Thanks in advance...

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    Sorry for jumping on to your thread! But I'm interested in getting an Everpure as well, particularly the 4FC-S. I can't find a detailed spec sheet online about what kinda filtration they use and how much chlorine they remove. Any ideas?

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    Why not contact Everpure directly and ask them??????

    Consumer Enquiries
    1300 785 355

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    Quote Originally Posted by Vinitasse View Post
    Why not contact Everpure directly and ask them??????

    Consumer Enquiries
    1300 785 355
    Thanks. I was waiting til this morning to contact Pedro @ coffee parts who I bought it off, but just thought someone might know in the meantime. Thanks for the customer service number, they appear shut over w/e too though.

  19. #19
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    To the best of my understanding, activated carbon removes chlorine. You will not need to worry about it. Filter cartridges will take well beyond mains pressure without a PLV (at least Brita will as they are rated to 9bar). If you are plumbing a machine a 350kPa PLV should be used. I reckon they are a good idea with fridges, dishwashers etc as well.

    Chris

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    Thanks very much Chris.

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    I've just purchased an over sink everpure on the weekend. I'm in wooloowin (renting) and have just set up my machine after it being in storage for the last six months. I had a twin under sink setup in our house in nz and had great flow rates also. I'm not convinced with the filter included but needed it asap as I didn't want to run tap water through my machine either. I will be contacting a water filter company soon to discuss some more options.

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    Damn Water Filtration!

    OK quick update. I received my Everpure 4FC-S and installed it on the weekend. Nice and simple, no mess no fuss.

    Here's my problem, after flushing a solid 5-10 mins water through the tap I got my trusty water testing kit and did my first post water filter test. Nothing. It hadn't changed. That must be a mistake, I know I'll try again, I must be mistaken..... Nope, the amount of change between my pre filter to post filter water? Nothing, nada, zippo, zilch!

    At this stage I'm still not convinced that it's something to do with the filter so I decide to run MORE water through the tap. I convince myself that it must need to 'settle in', so I leave it go for 24 hours of standard kitchen use before testing again. Still NOTHING! No change. I test from the bathroom tap (unfiltered) and it's exactly the same!!! How is this possible that the bath water is the same as my new, beaut, "it's what you need" coffee machine water filtration system! It's not like these things go off??

    The next thing I start to consider is that the water test kit might be a dud, but when I test it on the other side of town (Beenleigh!), which is fed by a completely different dam/water supply and get readings that are in keeping with that supply, I quickly rule the water test kit out. The test kit is working ok for these purposes.

    I follow up with the place of purchase, who, whilst nice enough, tells me that the water system is only meant to bring the 'hardness' down to the levels that I'm quoting them. They go so far as to say that the levels of 107.4 to 125.3 ppm (GH) & 71.6 to 89.5 ppm (KH) are the target range for coffee machines and that at these levels I shouldn't expect any scale build up, and that it's what they aim for.

    They did acknowledge that they had some deficits in knowledge with regards to the Everpure range and recommended I speak to Pentair who would have the technical expertise. Pentair, politely told me that they did not deal with this particular water filter and to speak with Water Filters Australia, who incidentally, were very helpful up to the point of telling me anything useful as the 'water filtration expert' was on a day off and they would contact me tomorrow. I'll see how that pans out.

    So now I'm confused. I'm a weekend warrior coffee consumer. I don't do coffee for a living and whilst I enjoy a great cup of coffee as much as the next person, I'm clearly no expert. Everything that I've read however, points to water hardness (GH) in the range of 60 to 80ppm & alkalinity (KH) of about 40 to 60ppm, to produce a nice cuppa and keep my machine in a happy state.

    Either the Everpure 4FC-S is working fine and is clearly not suitable for my goal (or anyone else wanting to keep scale to a minimum or free in their machine!) or the unit I have is a dud. Or I have completely misunderstood the value of running water hardness at the levels I just quoted to avoid scale build up on my shiny new machine.

    So, I suspect I'm back to square one, just $200 (with a little change) poorer.

    So, does anyone know if it's possible to run a water filter, under sink direct to the existing mixer tap, that will produce water hardness in the range required to keep a machine scale free-ish, whilst still providing water flow at upwards of 7-8L/m?

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    I'm keen to find a suitable solution but have not had the time yet to invest into researching it any further. Maybe try puretec commercial link removed per http://coffeesnobs.com.au/general-ne...icy-rules.html as another option for help. I actually sent Everpure an email after I posted above and have not had a reply from them as yet either.
    Last edited by Javaphile; 14th July 2015 at 09:42 PM. Reason: Commercial link(s) removed

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    Thanks for the update. I asked a very similar question a few months ago as I wanted to achieve the same as you ..... filtered water to protect the coffee machine delivered through the standard kitchen mixer at a decent flow rate. Whilst not being able to provide much insight into your problems I will be following with interest and hope you keep the thread updated of your findings.

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    Not sure why the link was removed? The undersink filter system they manufacture have an anti scale system protection. I think part of the key with most filters from each company is to run a multiple stage filtration. I will keep looking into this but would still be interested in other feedback and ideas also.

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    You cant provide a direct link to a supplier / manufacturer who is not an "Official Site Sponsor". It is still possible for us to copy and paste the name you provided into Google. It doesn't give too much information on what it does unfortunately. One of my local suppliers is a place I deal with at work just up the road so I might get in touch to find some additional information.

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    Looking at the spec sheet (which is more marketing guide than technical datasheet), the 4FC-s seems to be primarily for reducing inorganic particulates, microbes and chlorine. Only passing mention to scale and no certification for removal of scale forming ions listed.

    So, maybe a case of wrong tool for the job.
    Dimal likes this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrJack View Post
    Looking at the spec sheet (which is more marketing guide than technical datasheet)
    and therein lies the rub. There seems to be a whole lot of mis-information surrounding water filtration, with plenty of 'marketing' and only limited specifics as to what a filter will actually do.

    I am gaining a very quick lesson in water filtration, and as I pull it all together, I'll post up my own little experience for others to possibly benefit from, as well as what I've decided/found to be the best solution to my specific situation. In the meantime, these images are from the Everpure website. Basically the one that ticks all the boxes is the 4FC-S.
    Attached Images Attached Images

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    Notice "dissolved minerals and salts" is not ticked...

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    Neither is viruses....?!?

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    Not really a problem with our scheme water

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    Quote Originally Posted by MrJack View Post
    Notice "dissolved minerals and salts" is not ticked...
    Hahaha OK, I'll bite.... what is the purpose/point of this statement?

    You sound like you may have some knowledge/experience in this area, & clearly there are a bunch of folks who are trying to navigate the somewhat complex world of water filtering for their coffee machines. Would you be keen to share your knowledge so that others may be able to benefit?

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    Easier to use Bombora supplies. They know coffee and know coffee filtration.
    Dimal likes this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Talk_Coffee View Post
    Easier to use Bombora supplies. They know coffee and know coffee filtration.
    Agree - I too spent hours web researching water filtration and eventually contacted and went with the Bombora recommended Everpure Claris to deal with the chemical cocktail that emits from Perth taps. No complaints yet.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee_Dude View Post
    Hahaha OK, I'll bite.... what is the purpose/point of this statement?
    It's the dissolved minerals and salts which become scale

    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee_Dude View Post
    You sound like you may have some knowledge/experience in this area, & clearly there are a bunch of folks who are trying to navigate the somewhat complex world of water filtering for their coffee machines. Would you be keen to share your knowledge so that others may be able to benefit?
    I have a reasonable handle on how the various technologies work, and their limitations (i.e. the science and engineering principles), but my experience is with industrial applications, and somewhat limited.

    Interpreting datasheets is the easy part, but sadly only half the problem

    If you can find a competent vendor who understands the needs of your application and the products available, that's your best bet.

    Always happy to try and answer questions posted on the forum though, where I can.

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    I am in exactly the same boat as the OP... getting a new kitchen but only a single mixer tap (4.5L/min) so need a filtration system that will cope with filtering all the cold water requirements of a kitchen.

    I came across this set-up:
    Twin High Flow Cold Water Line Water Filter System from Clarence Water Filters.
    First stage is a 5 micron poly spun sediment filter to remove dirt, rust, algae etc.
    Second stage is a 5 micron phosphate and coconut shell carbon (GAC) for scale reduction, taste and odour.
    Flow rate of 15-16 litres per minute.

    Anyone able to give me any feedback on this suggestion?

    Am about to give Bombora a ring as well (thanks for the suggestion).

    Pete
    Last edited by bainpj; 22nd July 2015 at 04:26 PM.

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    Unhappy Hmmm… I think I fell down a rabbit hole…

    Now, before I go any further, a few disclaimers, I’m in mental health and am not a chemical engineer/scientist or coffee machine technician by any stretch of the imagination.

    What I share here is simply my understanding of how it was explained to me, along with a little additional research (google quality only). Do with this info what you will!

    That being said, I now have an appreciation as to why it’s so difficult to find the answers to what seems like a simple question!

    So last week I spoke with the good folk at Water Filters Australia who advised that I was best to talk to Pentair, again, but this time provided a name & number for Mark* who was most helpful.

    After listening to me discuss the results of my testing (both pre & post) and my concerns with the Everpure 4FC-S, he told me of this lovely little compound, called Polyphosphates and how they are used in some water filtration applications.

    In essence they are dispersed into the water supply through the cartridge (the dispersion mechanism & technology appears to vary significantly depending on the manufacturer) under my sink. Once in the water supply, Mark* said that they bind to the errant magnesium (mg) & calcium (ca) & the occasional iron(fe) ions, and do so in such a way that they are now not available to form scale in your trusty pipes etc.

    Now I may have mis-heard Mark*, however a little research has found an article from the American Water Works Association Journal** (1957 - yes I know, it’s old!), written by the Head of the Illinois State Water Survey, a Mr Thurston Larson, who states that PP’s are only effective against Calcium Carbonate in the battle against scale. Maybe the science around PP’s has evolved somewhat since 1957 to include magnesium ions?

    In addition, Mark* explained that the PP’s also ‘coat’ your metal appliances making it difficult for scale to attach and form. Perfect right?

    Well not quite… my understanding is that the PP’s are generally ok, and perform as stated, until they spend a bit of time in a heated environment, where, if they get hot enough, for long enough, they fall out of their newly formed relationship (chemical bond) and create what’s known as orthophosphate. Which is by and large not a problem, until it forms it’s own kind of scale by bonding with the calcium and we’re right back where we started. We have scale!

    Thurston says “…The rates for reversion for various polyphosphates vary, but there is no record of any polyphosphate that possesses desirable useful properties which is not subject to partial or complete reversion to orthophosphate within a matter of hours under high-temperature conditions…”.

    Hmmm does he mean perhaps like inside my twin boilers?

    It’s an interesting read, which Thurston finishes up by saying “…Polyphosphates are a truly remarkable class of chemicals. Their effectiveness for many purposes has been demonstrated in the laboratory and by practice. Their ineffectiveness for other purposes has also been established in the laboratory as well as by experience. It is unfortunate that no specific data are available for the cure-all misapplications which have resulted in disastrous failures and chaotic difficulties….”

    which to my naive ears suggests that there is definitely a suitable application in the water filtration arena for the 4FC-S, but it may not be quite at the level I’m looking at for my shiny new Expobar Minore IV!

    When I asked Mark* about the fact that my testing & re-testing showed no change with regard to water hardness, he stated that the effectiveness of the PP’s are not going to be able to be tested in my standard GH & KH water testing (possibly at all?), which means I’ve no real way of knowing if they’re working or not, other than to take the company’s word for it. He was unable to direct me to any literature around Everpure’s testing, however I did catch him while he was driving. He did make a point of saying that Everpure is a “…multi national…” with the language around this comment suggesting that if it did not work this would have been the organisation’s downfall long ago. Being the skeptic that I am, I still prefer to see evidence based arguments.

    When I pressed him for an answer as to what I should do to minimise my potential scale build up, he recommended that I explore the Everpure Claris Ultra or similar, but that in the meantime, my machine would be ‘fine’ with the 4FC-S for a ‘couple of months’. Which gives me some solace until I sort out what happens next.

    Mark* suggested that the Claris Ultra was probably what I would be better to go for, particularly if I didn’t want to head down the road of RO and then adding minerals back into the water. The way he described it was that it did a little of the PP’s as well as the removal of the CA & MG from my water at the same time. The only issue was the water flow, which I had actually solved through an earlier conversation and which Mark* agreed was a strong solution. That solution is a little further on.

    Now to confound things some more, I spoke with another bloke last week, Bob* from Bombora/Fridge Filters who, after very patiently listening to my tale, if I understood him correctly, suggested that the difficulty with what I was searching for (something that I could link up to my existing tap without adding another tap to my sink or reducing my water flow to 1 ltr/min) was that when using a resin or PP’s style solution it’s not simply enough to allow water to flow over them, but that the water needs to flow at such a slow rate so as to absorb the resin for it to be of any use.

    We explored a couple of products including 3M, Everpure and of course Brita.

    His recommendation echoed that of the many good folk on here like Chris from TC. His preference and ultimate recommendation was the Brita C150.

    The solution to the taps on the sink issue & the slow flow rate though the main tap, was to simply not install a tap at all, but to leave the water after the Brita C150 filtration unit hose with a one way ‘locking’ valve/tap/end (no idea what the correct term is!), and to switch it on when I need to fill my jug/container, all from under the sink! Genius in it’s simplicity really!

    *not real names
    ** the link to the *old* article http://www.isws.uiuc.edu/pubdoc/C/ISWSC-65.pdf

    This is a great website which really helps to explain in layman terms… Scale reducers vs water softeners | Pureflow Water Systems
    and this one too… ISWS - Illinois Water Supply - Question 3 Further Resources

    ***

    Mr Jack, except in the case of using an RO system I didn't think there was a cartridge that filters out 'minerals & salts' at a domestic level. Do you know of one?

    Pete, the key points I’ve found in all of this, if your goal is to reduce/eliminate de-scaling of your machine, is to reduce your water ‘hardness’ to circa 40-60ppm (not 60-80 as I earlier stated). It’s worthy to note though that this is below what some suggest is the optimum ‘taste’ range for espresso (circa 80-100ppm). As you're remodelling you may want to consider a 3 way tap, if you still want to go the Brita C150/Claris Ultra style.

    I have found no ‘under sink’ option that enables me to utilise the main tap in my sink without either a 3 way tap or seriously impeding the water flow at the tap to that of a trickle (1 or 2 ltr/min).

    My understanding is that the options are:

    1 - Do nothing & risk damage & or have a regular interval descale (2-4 months!)
    2 - ION exchange which includes units that you can ‘regenerate’ - not ideal if you need to watch your salt intake for medical reasons
    3 - Reverse Osmosis - but that comes with it’s own risk to machines if not managed appropriately and some suggest can taste lousy, but I have no experience of this
    4 - Polyphosphate additives which is it’s own type of ION exchange but is reportedly unstable at temperatures above 60℃ - technology in this area may have improved to such that this is no longer the case - a suitably qualified chemist/scientist etc may be able to shed some light on this
    5 - Rain water - and if the water is too soft - mix it with some ‘hard’ tap water
    6 - Bottled water - but check the chemical breakdown & test hardness for your water choice
    7 - Give up and drink tea!

    Personally, I’m off to look at rain water tanks with a decent first flush and particle filters at the entry & exit points.

    Apologies for the length folks, it’s taken a while to find the ladder out of this rabbit hole! If you fall in, be wary of the snake oil salesman, there are a few about…

    Cheers all and thanks for the reply's and patience from those that have seen / read it all before....

  38. #38
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    Coffee_Dude,
    Great work with your investigations,very thorough!
    Sound as though you have a real nice espresso machine there,had you ever considered using rain water for your machine?

    I have my la Cimbali two group m27 basic set up by my back door,its connected to my 21/2 thousand litre house tank,via a pre flush 60 litre diverter tank.Simple connection to a garden tap (tank connected) with non return valve installed,terrific system...works smoothly,no filters (other then the diverter tank),so scale,no dust,no chemical cleaning,no gunk of any description enters any of my machines.
    Machines that aren't connected are "jug fed".
    I also recently set up a heat exchanger "Bezzera" single group at my work,all staff are using that happily these last two weeks,love the flavour of coffee without the "town water taste"
    Everybody to their own I suppose,I'm happy puddling along as I'm doing,just interested in "why people insist filtering is the only way".
    Cheers,
    Mick.

  39. #39
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    Thanks Mick. I guess it's like anything, we do the best we can with the info we have.

    It sounds like you've got a great setup. I'm just stating to look at tanks, but I can guarantee, it'll be a whole lot smaller!

  40. #40
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    So, jumping into the same situation, and having read all of this thread, are we saying that Rain Tank Water is better than a filtered water system than something like the Brita C150? I am also in Brisbane. I have 20,000 raintank installed already and only use it at the moment for topping up the pool washing the cars and for the dogs?

  41. #41
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    Now really confused. Rang Bombora supplies and not sure they really had someone on hand to tell me what should be done. The first person said they were knowledgeable on water filtration but when I asked about rain water vs tap water she passes me onto the expert. Second person told asked me what my coffee machine was (a Rocket Giotto) and she said she had never heard of it. She then told me I need two separate systems, A Brita C150 for the coffee machine and a separate system for drinking water. When I said I wanted a system that could do both she said that's not possible. Now I have no idea what to do.

  42. #42
    Senior Member Bosco_Lever's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Studel View Post
    Now really confused. Rang Bombora supplies and not sure they really had someone on hand to tell me what should be done. The first person said they were knowledgeable on water filtration but when I asked about rain water vs tap water she passes me onto the expert. Second person told asked me what my coffee machine was (a Rocket Giotto) and she said she had never heard of it. She then told me I need two separate systems, A Brita C150 for the coffee machine and a separate system for drinking water. When I said I wanted a system that could do both she said that's not possible. Now I have no idea what to do.
    Please refer to reply#6 and follow directions.
    Google or any other search engine will be your friend.
    Water in Brisbane is pretty good, water on the Gold Coast is excellent. Bombora is in Perth and are experts in WA water which is on a par with SA water.
    Talk to a local expert, it really is that simple. Your brand of machine is irrelevant.
    Dimal likes this.

  43. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Studel View Post
    Now really confused. Rang Bombora supplies and not sure they really had someone on hand to tell me what should be done. The first person said they were knowledgeable on water filtration but when I asked about rain water vs tap water she passes me onto the expert. Second person told asked me what my coffee machine was (a Rocket Giotto) and she said she had never heard of it. She then told me I need two separate systems, A Brita C150 for the coffee machine and a separate system for drinking water. When I said I wanted a system that could do both she said that's not possible. Now I have no idea what to do.
    Hi Studel, it is confusing. Very simply, Bombora is probably right. I looked pretty hard and couldn't find a solution that would address my initial goal. Tap water that was suitable for normal sink duties and good for my machine. The earlier choice I espoused is NOT the solution!

    Standard disclaimers apply, I'm no chemist, industrial or otherwise, and found that many resellers were focused on selling what they stock. Exception being Bombora, but then again they seem to stock everything! This all just my personal experience/research (google quality only!).

    The simplest solution I found for plumbing is a Brita C150 PLV kit that you plumb under the sink, and if you don't want another tap on the sink, a switch/tap on the end of a bit of braided hose (buy that separately from either Bombora as a kit, or the parts form the hardware/plumber - your call) that allows you to fill a jug under the sink for filling your machine. Total cost about $250ish.

    Given that you have access to rain water, if it's being filtered appropriately, I would be using that. Plenty of simple, inexpensive micro filters that will be more than enough for what you want. As long as you take all the normal precautions for bird/bat poo that could potentially harbour nasties etc.

    Most valuable thing you can purchase? A water test kit that tests for water hardness (GH & KH). Go to your local pet store/aquarium and ask them for a kit. About $20/30 for a titration style kit. This will allow you to keep tabs on the water quality. Everybody seems to have different opinions, but generally you're aiming for 40-60ppm, but it depends on your personal taste. Good luck!

  44. #44
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    Hi,
    Could you do what I did?
    I simply plumbed my Brita C150 into the fridge water instead of standard fridge filter and took a T off that line to the Izzo. We have great filtered water for drinking and coffee
    Water in Rocky very hard so set to 80 or 90% from memory. No issues re high bypass % with this setting
    Cheers
    Dave
    Studel likes this.

  45. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffee_Dude View Post
    Hi Studel, it is confusing. Very simply, Bombora is probably right. I looked pretty hard and couldn't find a solution that would address my initial goal. Tap water that was suitable for normal sink duties and good for my machine. The earlier choice I espoused is NOT the solution!

    Standard disclaimers apply, I'm no chemist, industrial or otherwise, and found that many resellers were focused on selling what they stock. Exception being Bombora, but then again they seem to stock everything! This all just my personal experience/research (google quality only!).

    The simplest solution I found for plumbing is a Brita C150 PLV kit that you plumb under the sink, and if you don't want another tap on the sink, a switch/tap on the end of a bit of braided hose (buy that separately from either Bombora as a kit, or the parts form the hardware/plumber - your call) that allows you to fill a jug under the sink for filling your machine. Total cost about $250ish.

    Given that you have access to rain water, if it's being filtered appropriately, I would be using that. Plenty of simple, inexpensive micro filters that will be more than enough for what you want. As long as you take all the normal precautions for bird/bat poo that could potentially harbour nasties etc.

    Most valuable thing you can purchase? A water test kit that tests for water hardness (GH & KH). Go to your local pet store/aquarium and ask them for a kit. About $20/30 for a titration style kit. This will allow you to keep tabs on the water quality. Everybody seems to have different opinions, but generally you're aiming for 40-60ppm, but it depends on your personal taste. Good luck!
    Yep, i think you are on the right path there with with the C150. I don't mind the extra tap but getting decent advise seems to be night impossible on the filtration even for the tank water. The people down the coast started said to filter the tank water and don't worry about the other. I said I didn't want to get scale, then he started spooking about inline magnets etc that I have read a lot on and yet to see any hard evidence. My Tank is not in the house as such but i can get to it easy enough. It seems clean, no smell, clear, tastes a little metallic so i will take you advice and get a test kit.

    Are you going tank water? If so, which system are putting in to filter it before the C150 or have you decided to go another way?

  46. #46
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    Hi All

    I am one of those "filter in & out" rainwater dudes. Even though I am lucky to live in an area with very little "upwind traffic" I still would recommend due care unless you have a remote farm.
    IN - rough filtering removing & preventing anything getting into the tank in the first place - frogs, mouldy leaves etc - via a 60 litre holding tank.
    OUT: basic stone candle filtering my H20 for coffee.
    FWIW, every time I try chemical filtering or RO systems I can taste the difference.
    Result - No residues means no need to clean above the showerscreen on any of my machines, even after years of use. Oh, and the coffee is so good that I supply rainwater to a few friends for their cuppas.

    Hope this helps.

    TampIt
    mulquemi and Studel like this.

  47. #47
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    Behmor Brazen - $249 - Free Freight
    SCALE = PARANOIA.

    Can someone please provide scientific evidence of how rainwater will cause scale to build up in a coffee machine.????????

    It has been explained in detail that filtered rain water is devoid of those nasty little creatures whose sole purpose is to destroy coffee machines by depositing scale in the boiler and other vulnerable parts.

    Sage advice was given about in line magnets. I have used one for over five years now. It is highly effective in rendering the above creatures impotent.

    My coffee machine has no scale deposits at all, and I use filtered tap water, and the inline magnet is a wonderful backup. Helps dissipate OCD as well.
    Dimal and Vinitasse like this.



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